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It is a problem because fewer people are needed to actually do anything of value....
This is not a problem, unless you think working less is a bad thing. Jobs have been being out-sourced or destroy with technology for centuries. Why is it that the west still has the highest standard of living if this is a problem?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randomdude
Wall-E is an eventual reality. The problem is, we arent going to be in some utopia with robots doing everything. There will be a few people who control everything, and everyone else will be killing each other for the scraps.
Oh yeah? And why exactly do you think some humans will be in control? Robots will surplus as in every way possible, you think we are going to be in control? haha.
I don't see what an Engineer with a 4 year degree or Masters would retrain for that is better than what he had that got offshored.
There are many things. The most obvious is another area of Engineering that is more in depend. If that won't work than another field, perhaps Health care? There are a number of options available to people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedNC
Do you think trade is balanced now?
If it is how is it balanced?
If not what would it take to put it in balance?
I have cited information on the trade deficit, trade is currently not balanced but its more balanced now than 1-2 years ago.
There are a number of ways you could balance trade. The "Free market" approach would be to have all currencies freely floating against each other. If this was the case now, then the US dollar would decline in value against key currencies (e.g., renminbi) and it make imports more expensive. This difference between this and tariffs is that its the market that is determining the value and not a short sighted government or a rent-seeking work force.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stac2007
What are you talking about? People have been living on credit because salaries have not kept up with the rate of inflation.....
If your wages go down, you don't borrow to keep it up. That is after all, idiotic. Rather you reduce your spending, etc. Inflation has also not dramatically surpassed wages.
I agree. I have read some of User_ID's post's and just can't understand his rational.
I am a laid off designer engineer that was in the automotive industry. A combination of the whole auto crisis and offshoreing put me on the street. I've been in it 17 years.....
I don't see what is so hard to understand, the industry you work in has destroyed itself. You made good while and worked in it for a number of years...and now you have to figure out something else to do with your life.
Now, you can complain about out-sourcing, off-shoring or whatever else or you can get busy finding a new career.
I don't see what is so hard to understand, the industry you work in has destroyed itself.
Now, you can complain about out-sourcing, off-shoring or whatever else or you can get busy finding a new career.
With your first statement , it clearly show's you have absolutley zero knowledge of the automotive industy.. only your opinion and what you've heard in the news.
Your second statement I actually agree with. The news stated this morning that their were 7000 new jobs in our state (I'm not believing it, since KNOWONE is hiring right now) ... all service related. So instead of making $40 an hour doing a skilled trade, I can make $9 an hour as the french fryer at the local fast food joint... good times !!
An earlier poster said something about "crappy manufacturing" jobs... this country was built on those "crappy manufacturing " jobs. Die makers, mold makers, machine tool builders, machinist's, mill rights, draftsmen, engineers are all jobs that helped build this country to a super power. Now we are loosing those trades and all the countless years of knowledge, what then ? We become a country of service oriented jobs ? Sure that is going to create wealth. Isn't Mexico a service oriented country ?.. they sure are doing well....
With your first statement , it clearly show's you have absolutley zero knowledge of the automotive industy.. only your opinion and what you've heard in the news.
Clearly I'm imagining the federal government bailing out 2 auto companies, Chrysler filing for bankruptcy and GM about to collapse.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scarabchuck
Your second statement I actually agree with. The news stated this morning that their were 7000 new jobs in our state (I'm not believing it, since KNOWONE is hiring right now) ... all service related. So instead of making $40 an hour doing a skilled trade, I can make $9 an hour as the french fryer at the local fast food joint... good times !!
Well, if you want to work in fast food that's your business.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scarabchuck
An earlier poster said something about "crappy manufacturing" jobs... this country was built on those "crappy manufacturing " jobs.
I said that and what I meant by it were...in fact "crappy manufacturing jobs". Not manufacturing jobs in general. Contrary to popular belief the US still manufactures a number of goods, it just does not deal much with low-skill manufacturing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scarabchuck
Die makers, mold makers, machine tool builders, machinist's, mill rights, draftsmen, engineers are all jobs that helped build this country to a super power.
All this sort of work has changed dramatically with technology, much of it can automated. Who cares what the country use to do?
Quote:
Originally Posted by scarabchuck
Now we are loosing those trades and all the countless years of knowledge, what then ? We become a country of service oriented jobs ?
What is wrong with service oriented jobs? Sooner or later the vast majority of jobs all over the global will be service oriented jobs. Why have people manufacture things when machines can do it?
Anyhow, as I said you can complain about it or you can start getting busy learning new skills. The choice is yours.
Clearly I'm imagining the federal government bailing out 2 auto companies, Chrysler filing for bankruptcy and GM about to collapse.
Don't look now, but Toyota is posting record losses too. Will Japan again subsidize them like they did in the 70's?
Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id
What is wrong with service oriented jobs? Sooner or later the vast majority of jobs all over the global will be service oriented jobs. Why have people manufacture things when machines can do it?
Other than the fact that they are typically booooooring, lack any kind of creativity, are usually low skilled, and don't pay well. Nothing! If you want to be some kind of worker drone working in a cubicle, go for it.
Apparently you have no idea what it's like to create or make something. Start with raw materials and build something of value. That's what made this country a superpower, not servicing others.
To what do you attribute this too? What made it more balanced?
I already stated this in a response to you. The trade deficit increase as a result of increased borrowing by Americans from foreign creditors (Namely, China). The biggest source of borrowing was home equity related, at its pick people were extracting $600 billion/year from home equity withdraws (around 10 times the historic norm).
The world lost interest in funding Americans credit binge and now the deficit is improving. Trade deficits can only occur long term if the surplus nations borrow money to the nations running a deficit. But even the lending at some point breaks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedNC
I have know idea where you live, but on the west and east coast inflation has definitely surpassed wages.
Note, I said "dramatically". Wages over the last decade have grown a bit slower than inflation. There has not been a dramatic shift and if Americans did not stupidly borrow themselves into a hole inflation would've been lower.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedNC
Don't look now, but Toyota is posting record losses too.
Toyota just had its first lose in 70 years. They have a pile of cash, they are not in trouble.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedNC
Other than the fact that they are typically booooooring, lack any kind of creativity, are usually low skilled, and don't pay well. Nothing! If you want to be some kind of worker drone working in a cubicle, go for it.
This is just silly. Service oriented jobs come in a wide range of pay scales, skill levels etc. What are you using right now? A service. What is Google? A service....
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedNC
Apparently you have no idea what it's like to create or make something. Start with raw materials and build something of value. That's what made this country a superpower, not servicing others.
And I will say it again, that was the past. Technology can more effectively "build something of value" than people. Only high skill manufacturing can't be automated.
I already stated this in a response to you. The trade deficit increase as a result of increased borrowing by Americans from foreign creditors (Namely, China). The biggest source of borrowing was home equity related, at its pick people were extracting $600 billion/year from home equity withdraws (around 10 times the historic norm).
So the way to balance trade is to just stop buying the stuff we use to make from other countries.
Maybe a better solution is to start making this stuff in America again. What a concept. The workers could get paid to make stuff, thus having money to buy the stuff they make. I'm telling you this could work.
There are many things. The most obvious is another area of Engineering that is more in depend. If that won't work than another field, perhaps Health care? There are a number of options available to people.
I have cited information on the trade deficit, trade is currently not balanced but its more balanced now than 1-2 years ago.
There are a number of ways you could balance trade. The "Free market" approach would be to have all currencies freely floating against each other. If this was the case now, then the US dollar would decline in value against key currencies (e.g., renminbi) and it make imports more expensive. This difference between this and tariffs is that its the market that is determining the value and not a short sighted government or a rent-seeking work force.
If your wages go down, you don't borrow to keep it up. That is after all, idiotic. Rather you reduce your spending, etc. Inflation has also not dramatically surpassed wages.
Really? So how does one pay for rising utility bills and other basic necessities which they must pay for? It’s not like one can a person can stop buying food? I never said inflation suppressed wages. The fact that corporations are outsourcing more and more jobs means the jobs which are left and in greater demand. For the employer it’s a buyers market
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