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Old 08-10-2009, 12:42 PM
 
22,769 posts, read 27,933,872 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drshang View Post
All that said, the baby boomer generation has been ridiculously lucky in terms of investments. Housing returns that are 4-5x inflation. Equity markets that have performed better than average since the 70s. Low inflation during most of the time. Dot com booms. Standard of living booms.
Luck has nothing to do with it; since the early 80's, boomers have been running deficits and borrowing from their children's unearned future income.
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Old 08-10-2009, 12:49 PM
 
Location: Seattle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rubber_factory View Post
Luck has nothing to do with it; since the early 80's, boomers have been running deficits and borrowing from their children's unearned future income.
True, I mean had they not been so poor financial managers the returns probably wouldn't have been that high. I just think it's funny when I see a housing listing for 600-700k and the price was 40k in 1975.

But still they had globalization, Internet, telecom, and many other large scale world innovations that helped keep returns that high. So I do think, on average, they were quite fortunate to have so many global innovations in a pretty short time.

I mean compare that to people who were burn in a year like 1905. They had the great depression and WWII through most of their adult life. That's bad luck! Of course most of them got really awesome social security handouts that all the young people are now paying for (the first receipients of social security paid very little in and got great benefits).
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Old 08-10-2009, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
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Originally Posted by user_id View Post
Anyhow, so if they continue to avoid retirement will it cause an elevated unemployment rate for some time? Will it make it more difficult for the younger generations to get employed?

I think its definatley making it harder for not only the younger generation to get employed, but move up as well.

In my company, every single person in any management position is over 40, and about 3/4's of them are over 60, and a few are past social security age.

Without fail, they all are maintaining expensive lifestyles which force them to clog up the pipes forever.
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Old 08-10-2009, 01:03 PM
 
14,256 posts, read 16,310,868 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randomdude View Post
I think its definatley making it harder for not only the younger generation to get employed, but move up as well.

In my company, every single person in any management position is over 40, and about 3/4's of them are over 60, and a few are past social security age.

Without fail, they all are maintaining expensive lifestyles which force them to clog up the pipes forever.
All the more reason for the kids to learn to do things the baby-boomer way
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Old 08-10-2009, 01:06 PM
 
Location: Seattle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randomdude View Post
I think its definatley making it harder for not only the younger generation to get employed, but move up as well.

In my company, every single person in any management position is over 40, and about 3/4's of them are over 60, and a few are past social security age.

Without fail, they all are maintaining expensive lifestyles which force them to clog up the pipes forever.
From my experience, most people who are over 60 and still working are incredibly lazy, tired, full of outdated skills, and expect everyone younger to work harder than them because "they are young" and "we paid our dues." Of course then they complain about age discrimination if they can't get a job.

NOTE: this doesn't apply to everyone, just most people
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Old 08-10-2009, 01:09 PM
 
14,256 posts, read 16,310,868 times
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Originally Posted by drshang View Post
From my experience, most people who are over 60 and still working are incredibly lazy, tired, full of outdated skills, and expect everyone younger to work harder than them because "they are young" and "we paid our dues." Of course then they complain about age discrimination if they can't get a job.

NOTE: this doesn't apply to everyone, just most people

"Paying your dues" is a key facet of the baby boomer culture. That is why we get annoyed whne the kids show up with their expectations of good evaluations and rapid promotion.

Remember when we used to stay at our desks until 9pm or 10pm and show up in the office on Staurdays and Sundays? It wasn't like we had a ton of work to do but it was important to be seen. That was all part of "paying your dues".
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Old 08-10-2009, 01:12 PM
 
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
5,517 posts, read 9,448,461 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drshang View Post
From my experience, most people who are over 60 and still working are incredibly lazy, tired, full of outdated skills, and expect everyone younger to work harder than them because "they are young" and "we paid our dues." Of course then they complain about age discrimination if they can't get a job.

NOTE: this doesn't apply to everyone, just most people
Im going to have to agree with that whole heartedly. The majority of those over 60 depend on the younger workers to pull most of their load, while they take half days off for golf every other day, and have little to no knowledge of current software, laws and regulations, technology or new processes and techniques.
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Old 08-10-2009, 01:17 PM
 
22,769 posts, read 27,933,872 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LauraC View Post
Younger workers:

Think education trumps experience.
No, we think competency trumps experience.

Many baby boomers cannot even use the basic information tools of the 21st century.

Quote:
Think it's okay to job hop after employers put so much time and money into training them.
Well, it is okay. No sense in sticking around in your cubicle, getting fatter, poorer, and waiting for your own obsolesence.

Quote:
Think they are entitled to promotion and great evaluations. Maybe this is because they are used to over-inflated grades.
No, they expect individuals to be compensated according to their level of competence and performance, rather than how long they've managed to be employed at an organization.

Quote:
Think everything is a team effort and are more concerned with good team process than good results.
Totally arbitrary claim.

Quote:
Think everything should be measured by fairness and that they're being picked on if they are not afforded equal opportunities.
As opposed to being deliberately unfair, and "handing out" opportunities based on something other than merit? I don't see anything wrong with a merit-based approach.

Quote:
Overvalue time off over getting a job done.
Is this a joke? I'm not going to sacrifice my well-being for the sake of the organization, just to have them achieve their objectives, and then fire me.

I have my own goals, and it is my employer's option to align the organization's goals with my goals. If I don't like it, I can go into the marketplace and find a job with more personal time. If they don't like it, they can go into the marketplace and find a worker who doesn't value his or her personal time.

Quote:
Think the world revolves around them and their problems and that everyone should get out of their way because they are the center of the universe.
I'm not sure what this one is about, but my world view extends from the organs in my head, and everything else just dangles from that point of reference.

Last edited by le roi; 08-10-2009 at 01:26 PM..
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Old 08-10-2009, 01:18 PM
 
14,256 posts, read 16,310,868 times
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Originally Posted by Randomdude View Post
Im going to have to agree with that whole heartedly. The majority of those over 60 depend on the younger workers to pull most of their load, while they take half days off for golf every other day, and have little to no knowledge of current software, laws and regulations, technology or new processes and techniques.
That is why it is importnat to hire kids that are smarter than you are and then pay them a pitance while the "pay their dues".
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Old 08-10-2009, 01:31 PM
 
Location: Seattle
1,369 posts, read 3,064,091 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggy001 View Post
"Paying your dues" is a key facet of the baby boomer culture. That is why we get annoyed whne the kids show up with their expectations of good evaluations and rapid promotion.

Remember when we used to stay at our desks until 9pm or 10pm and show up in the office on Staurdays and Sundays? It wasn't like we had a ton of work to do but it was important to be seen. That was all part of "paying your dues".
The thing is, if I'm starting a different business and need to build a team for success, I don't really care if someone worked till 9pm on Saturday in 1980. I care about performance of my business today. To me, "paying your dues" is pretty much irrelevant. I care about growing and building a profitable business.

All that said, older workers often bring cool headed behavior and are able to put things in perspective much better than younger workers and I think they have lots of value. That said, I think after 60 the large majority of people become pretty much useless dead weight in the corporate world. I think there's a huge drop off between 53 and 63 for most people. Most people are fine into their 50s but after they hit 60 all they think about and talk about is retiring. The 60+ people I worked with forget things, lack good judgment and seem to just be kind of clueless other than spouting some quotes that they heard about in some motivational speaker seminar they went to last week in between their two rounds of golf or shuffleboard.

EDIT: I think there's a reason government offices for things like air traffic controllers, pilots and jobs that require intense amounts of judgment have "mandatory retirement ages." People just wear out after a certain age. They just lose a lot of their ability and drive. It's just a fact of the aging process. I'm not trying to say that a 49 year old worker is useless compared to a 28 year old worker, but I'm trying to say that after a specific age (I would say around 60) people need to retire because they will generally destroy value, not add to it.
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