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sorry, i have to disagree on the financial industry being tightly regulated. part of the problem is lack of transparency and the other part is lack of enforcement! if you had actual regulation enforcement, could madoff, stanford, and all of the other fraudsters still on the loose have gotten away with their schemes? Madoff's Victim List - The Wall Street Journal
i think at some point we are going to see a lot more fraud exposed, tied into the state pension funds.
[quote i think at some point we are going to see a lot more fraud exposed, tied into the state pension funds.[/quote]
No you're not. The SEC is a worthless waste of money run by brain dead individuals who are too close to the people they're supposed to be policing to have any usefulness. We should just close them down and move on.
On top of that Madoff should be a lesson to people ( but I'd doubt he will be). For one, anyone that invests all their money with one guy deserves exactly what they get. I am so sick of hearing about "Madoff victims". Many of those people were simply victims of their own greed and stupidity.
Madoff is also an example of why we'd be better off without the SEC or any other false preception of security. The governments job is not and should not be to protect people from doing stupid ****. Without this stupid notion that somehow big brother can take of you and remove all evil from the world, perhaps people would wake up and take responsibility for their lives even if that meant playing a round or two less golf a week. Or reading stupid blogs written by nitwits for that matter. And maybe, just maybe, the next Madoff would have a tougher time because people wouldn't be inclined to give anyone all their money.
Everyone's heard the quote, "a fool and his money is soon parted", but no one wants to admit they're that fool.
it is ridiculous to deny that outright fraud goes on in wall street. i have little sympathy for the madoff investors (simply because how many other hedge fund losers are able to get their money back?) that does not mean that people like madoff should be allowed to go unchecked! instead of" abandonment" of the SEC, the SEC needs to actually do its job.
Who's deny fraud exist? Of course it does, thats life sweetie and all the police in the world won't stop it. What would help is if people took responsibility for their own actions and made it harder for these things to happen. Maybe doing some homework instead of relying on someone else to protect them whether that someone is a stockbroker, a banker or the government.
I don't need to SEC to protect me, why do you need them to protect you?
Who's deny fraud exist? Of course it does, thats life sweetie and all the police in the world won't stop it. What would help is if people took responsibility for their own actions and made it harder for these things to happen. Maybe doing some homework instead of relying on someone else to protect them whether that someone is a stockbroker, a banker or the government.
I don't need to SEC to protect me, why do you need them to protect you?
you admit that there is fraud on wall street, yet are implying it is the job of the individual to detect that fraud! we have a regulatory body which needs to do its work. that doesn't excuse a level of personal responsibility but, given the lack of transparency on wall street and the federal reserve, (as well as the fact that some companies flat out LIE) it would be almost impossible for an individual to protect himself /herself from all potential fraud.
your analogy would be similar to saying that if you put a lock on your house you don't need the police for a burglary because you put the lock on your house.
No Sandy what I'm saying is even with police there are burglars so even if you lock your doors don't leave all your money on the counter and then cry when someone steals it. There is NO WAY to stop crime. Period! The best thing anyone can do is act responsibily to protect themselves as best they can. Had Madoff investors put 10 or 15% of their money with the guy they wouldn't have been wiped out, for example.
You could put on cop on every corner and there would still be crime. You can make a law for everything but it still won't stop people from breaking them. If you walked naked in an area littered with sex offenders you shouldn't be shocked if you get raped. If you go into the ghetto don't be shocked if you get car jacked.
The idea that government can protect you from the cold harsh reality of life is foolish. Trusting someone because of a degree or a title is equally foolish. I don't trust my doctor or my lawyer because they're just people. Even if they're well intentioned they could easily screw up so I always get 2nd opinions for anything important. I also don't trust cops or government officals. Some are great, some are morons thats life. But I do trust myself to look after my own best interests.
i actually agree with some of your post, however it still doesn't address the issue that we have an enforcement division which needs to do its job! if you get assaulted, the police need to investigate. if you get robbed, the police need to investigate. i am simply stating that the fraud on wall street needs to be investigated, not because people didn't do their "research" but simply because a fraud was committed. as far as investment, personally i would never trust my money with someone else but surely you can see the potential future damage to responsible taxpayers and /or homeowners if pension fraud is allowed to continue unabated.
Cause they have government's back... you aren't going to take on government, are you? The government gave them TRILLIONS of dollars... the government has given the okay for MILLIONS in bonuses... who do you think the government is working for? All this under democratic leadership... who do you think is getting paid?
Hi evilnewbie,
They are the government. They are the biggest political contributors and the cabinet is full of former bank executives.
I posted this in RE, but though some of you might enjoy this story as well:
Neighbors: Exec. moved into bank-owned beach home - Yahoo! Finance (http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Neighbors-Exec-moved-into-apf-818362254.html?x=0&.v=1 - broken link)
it is ridiculous to deny that outright fraud goes on in wall street. i have little sympathy for the madoff investors (simply because how many other hedge fund losers are able to get their money back?) that does not mean that people like madoff should be allowed to go unchecked! instead of" abandonment" of the SEC, the SEC needs to actually do its job.
Hi florida- I just want to point out that the OP asked why "bank executives" were not blamed more in relation the the meltdown of the housing market via securitization. I later posted that the Mtge broker industry committed fraud and deserve blame and the "bank executives" were scapegoats. I note that bank executives may not have been diligent, but this is not outright fraud.
You refer to Bernie Madoff in this same context, but this is not apples to apples. The regulation for a Bank is much higher than for "Made-Offs" Firm which is an Investment Firm... like a boutique shop for Private Investors. His FRAUD was the creation of false trades. He was taking investor money and using this to pay prior commitments (which were basically fake "profits" on trades that did not exist). Horrifying and BLATANT fraud... but not apples to apples with the tone of the OP in my opinion.
It did not have anything directly to do with the securitization of mortgages and the housing bust.
Just want to clarify.
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