Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 11-04-2011, 08:43 PM
 
Location: Fairfax
2,904 posts, read 6,905,267 times
Reputation: 1282

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by psr13 View Post
In order to have done in while being considered "sponge-like" in regards to language learning, it would not really have been your choice. That phrase is usually used to refer to children before reaching about age six. Pre-age six is supposed to be the time it's really easy for kids to learn a language.
Interesting. Under 6 is indeed the best time to learn a language but I just (perhaps wrongly) assumed that high school would be easier than adulthood since the brain is still developing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 11-04-2011, 09:05 PM
 
Location: Liberal Coast
4,280 posts, read 6,073,166 times
Reputation: 3924
Quote:
Originally Posted by decafdave View Post
Interesting. Under 6 is indeed the best time to learn a language but I just (perhaps wrongly) assumed that high school would be easier than adulthood since the brain is still developing.
From what I've read, there isn't a big different between learning it as a teenager (especially late teen) and as an adult. It's actually been easier for me now (mid twenties) than when I was a teenager to learn languages.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-07-2011, 07:49 PM
 
1 posts, read 940 times
Reputation: 10
I think the most important thing about learning a second language is to communicate and practise a lot. Age may matter a little as the older one is, the harder for him to learn a language. But the decisive factor is one's own endeavor. For example, many people think Chinese is very hard to learn, cuz there are many dialects in Chinese and the Chinese slangs have no rules to follow. But if you involve yourself in that language environment, it's easier to acquire since you are "forced" to listen and learn that language.



------------------------------------

Last edited by toobusytoday; 11-18-2011 at 11:16 AM.. Reason: removed link. New posters cannot post links
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-07-2011, 09:57 PM
 
26,733 posts, read 22,409,968 times
Reputation: 10023
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch View Post
Interesting situation. I have always heard that learning one's 2nd language as an adult will "cost" you the most in terms of effort, and that #3, 4, etc. will come easier.
Most likely if languages are related, then yes.


Quote:
Have been studying Russian for 15 years. I hope to pick up German easier one day, it seems to me to be sort of "between" English and Russian logically.
Well sort of. If I'd draw a circle, I'd put English and Russian at the opposite points, taking in consideration the logical structure behind them. Now German ( if I'd put it next to English say on a right side,) would be still pretty close to English, but already a bit closer to Russian ( as far as logical structure goes.) Same with Romance languages - you can put them on the left side of English - still pretty close, but already somewhat closer to Russian as well.
Generally speaking if people can grasp the logic behind the foreign language, they can learn it rather fast at any age. In that respect learning foreign languages might be even easier for a young adult than for a child, because an adult already knows where to concentrate the effort - what basic grammar to learn first, what expressions and so on.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-07-2011, 10:02 PM
 
Location: The High Seas
7,372 posts, read 15,978,306 times
Reputation: 11866
Quote:
Originally Posted by decafdave View Post
Interesting. Under 6 is indeed the best time to learn a language but I just (perhaps wrongly) assumed that high school would be easier than adulthood since the brain is still developing.
I can't give you the names of the researchers off the tip of my tongue right now, but I have read a few books on the subject and it seems that there is no definite ideal age to learn another language, but there is an ideal time to pick up an authentic accent in a language. That would be the younger, the better! Single-digit ages.
You can attain fantastic proficiency in a language at any age. It just takes dedication and time.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-09-2011, 01:38 AM
 
Location: Duluth, Minnesota, USA
7,641 posts, read 18,086,955 times
Reputation: 6913
Quote:
Originally Posted by decafdave View Post
It's well-known that the ability to naturally pick up a language declines sharply at around puberty. Am I right to assume that different adult age groups have differing levels of ease also? I'm sure it varies individually, but is there an age that one reaches that makes it incredibly hard to learn?

I'm 23 and feel like I can still learn new things easily. However, I haven't pushed myself as far at learning foreign languages as I should have. How long can I reasonably expect to be able to pick up a language with a given amount of effort? (A European language like German, not something incredibly hard like Korean).
Older adults (generally) have more difficulty acquiring new languages than younger adults, particularly if they've been monolingual all their lives. The amount of time it will take to learn German depends on previous language learning experience, the time you devote to it, and your natural aptitude for languages.

When you learn a second language - say, Spanish - a third language (say, German) is usually easier to learn. If the third language is closely related to the second (e.g. German and Swedish, or Spanish and French), it will generally be easier by a matter of magnitudes to learn (although pronunciation might be just as difficult as if it was your second). Learning a second language teaches you a lot about the grammar of your own language and how it relates to the other language(s), and hence paves the way for acquisition of further languages.

The time you devote to language learning, and most importantly, how you learn it, are of crucial importance. The time I need not make note of, as you probably know with any other skill, the more you practice, the better you get. You will become fluent much faster if you are immersed in the language; for example, if you studied the basics at home for two months and then went to Germany for a year. That's the only real way, in my opinion, to become fluent in a language (although constantly being surrounded by speakers of the desired language in your home country may suffice).

Finally, a lot depends on your innate aptitude to learn languages, which I suppose is largely a function of mental flexibility (and long-term memory). For some people, learning other languages (even a second language) is second nature; they rapidly assimilate the grammatical structures with little rote study, acquire the vocabulary of their surroundings, and come to speak with a clear accent. (On a side note, I have ran into a person who was in the Canaries for a year and speaks perfect Canarian Spanish but has great difficulty reading or writing). For others, it is very difficult and demands tremendous effort. The Department of Defense actually administers an examination that tests this aptitude.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-11-2011, 03:43 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
17,161 posts, read 56,905,862 times
Reputation: 18462
Quote:
Originally Posted by decafdave View Post
I learned a fair bit of Mandarin Chinese first as I lived in Shanghai for a summer and even had a tutor. So when I was trying to speak Korean, many times the Chinese translation would jump to mind instead. Both languages are so radically different than English that they compete in my mind!

This doesn't seem to be an issue at all with German, since IMO German is the closest language to English. I believe English came from Old German.

I'd love to take some free or low cost German lessons. I haven't expecting much except for institutions like Goethe.

How fluent are you in Russian? I hear the grammar is quite difficult but learning the Cyrillic alphabet just takes a little effort?
How fluent am I in Russian? I should get off my butt and take a proficiency test. I read nearly full speed, I can read books and newspapers easily. I can understand native speakers fine, I speak fairly well, with occasional grammatical errors. I don't practice writing enough, I would rate my writing only fair. The last time I was in country, in '06, I could speak well enough to get a room in a hotel, order in restaurants, shop in stores, etc.

If you are just starting German, let me suggest the "German in 10 Minutes a Day" book, these were published by Sunset for a while. Where you are I think you will find it in many book stores.

Your internal confusion of Korean and Chinese sounds natural. When I run into someone who speaks only Spanish, you may know that the vowels in Spanish are nearly identical to Russian, so I want to switch to Russian, although it does not do any good. The few times I have done this it seemed to confuse the Spanish speaker no end - to meet a gringo who speaks a 2nd language but it's not Spanish. But I am sure they pick up on the vowels as well, wondering what the devil I am trying to say.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-15-2011, 01:50 AM
 
9 posts, read 15,540 times
Reputation: 13
I think I have to say sth because at first I am a international student from Asian areas and I am attending the university in the U.S. I am 19 right now, It feels like I can learn English esily maybe because I am still young, and the most crucial thing I think is the language environment, before I came to the U.S, I couldn't speak English fluently, but after I came here, I have no choice but to listen, speak English every single day, so, on that way I pick up lots of English words and know more slangs sth like that.
But I think somehow it still depends on person, some people have the gift at learning language, but some people do not.
Some languages are really different, just like Asian language, such as Chinese, Korean,Japanese, it's hard to pick up because the harder grammer, complicated santence structure, different way to prononce.

Last edited by zmflzqy; 11-15-2011 at 02:00 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-15-2011, 02:17 AM
 
Location: Liberal Coast
4,280 posts, read 6,073,166 times
Reputation: 3924
Quote:
Originally Posted by zmflzqy View Post
I think I have to say sth because at first I am a international student from Asian areas and I am attending the university in the U.S. I am 19 right now, It feels like I can learn English esily maybe because I am still young, and the most crucial thing I think is the language environment, before I came to the U.S, I couldn't speak English fluently, but after I came here, I have no choice but to listen, speak English every single day, so, on that way I pick up lots of English words and know more slangs sth like that.
But I think somehow it still depends on person, some people have the gift at learning language, but some people do not.
Some languages are really different, just like Asian language, such as Chinese, Korean,Japanese, it's hard to pick up because the harder grammer, complicated santence structure, different way to prononce.
I've been studying Mandarin. It doesn't have hard grammar or complicated sentence structure. In fact, those two areas are actually quite simple for English speakers. It only has the difficulty of pronouncing, tones, and characters.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-18-2011, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Fairfax
2,904 posts, read 6,905,267 times
Reputation: 1282
Quote:
Originally Posted by psr13 View Post
I've been studying Mandarin. It doesn't have hard grammar or complicated sentence structure. In fact, those two areas are actually quite simple for English speakers. It only has the difficulty of pronouncing, tones, and characters.
Agreed about Mandarin! That's why it is so easy for us to pick up basic conversational Mandarin. But try to become literate....

Korean, on the other hand, has a very easy alphabet called "hangeul" that one can learn in a day. However, actually speaking that language is a real challenge (at least for me).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:53 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top