Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I teach chemistry. I differentiate every time we do a lab with the questions I ask of each group. I know who needs their hands held and I know who to tell to figure it out. I know who to ask the higher level questions of and who to lead through the lab step by step (except someone needs to tell my principal that because he says I give too many orders...well, some kids NEED orders.).
Could you teach AP Chemistry and Basic Chemistry in the same classroom simply by differentiating instruction?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler
In math, I try to leave, at least 30 minutes of work time in class so I can go around and help students individually on their level. I am trying to use the guide on the side model here. Next year, I'm going to flip the class to appease those who think I need to do more showing the students how to do things as opposed to assisting them in finding their way (they won't watch the videos but I can stop the whining). I've also found that grouping kids so that the higher performers help their peers helps them reinforce what they know.
At my kids school we have 10th graders taking Honors PreCalculus and 10th graders taking Basic Geometry. Do you think you could teach both in one class simply by differentiating instruction?
In secondary school kids are on a different schedule. Some kids take Geometry in 8th grade. Others take it in 10th grade. The kids who are ready for it in 8th grade should get it in 8th grade and not have to wait for 10th grade simply because there are some people who don't believe that there are smart kids in the world.
I did and regret that decision. In hindsight, I do not think grade acceleration helped my dd. At the time, the jump actually kept her with her peers but now that she's in high school, we're finding she identifies with her age mates more than her classmates and that is a problem. If I had it to do again, I would not have allowed her to be double promoted. The combination of a grade skip and accelerated classes in high school has her in classes with kids who are often 2 years older than her when she wants to be with kids her own age.
Are all her classes with older kids? My son has one class with some kids who are 2 years older (Geometry) but most of his classes keep him with kids who are his age. Even his Geometry class is a majority 9th graders so the kids are only one year older than him. They are pretty much the same kids he took Algebra with last year, but now they are in high school and he is middle school (not a big distinction in our school).
I don't think my son minds being with older kids in one class but I bet if it was all of his classes it would bother him. I can see it being an issue with sophomores and seniors when the seniors are all in graduation/college mode.
I am glad my son's courses were accelerated but I would not want him to be placed in a higher grade. He is an athlete and in FL athletic eligibility runs for 4 years once you start 9th grade. You can play HS sports in middle school if you are in an integrated middle/high school but your eligibility starts to run when you start grade 9.
There is no way he would have been physically ready for high school football and lacrosse if he had started high school at age 12 so he basically would have had to cede 2 years of athletic eligibility. Right now at age 14 he is average sized for an 8th grader and will be physically able to compete for a spot on the JV team next school year. Whether he makes it or not is up to him but at least he is the right size.
Momma, this is why I am not so keen on having my kids start kindergarten by their birthday (curse my crappy cervix for wimping out on us too soon). Even though I think longingly of all the money I would save by not having to pay that extra year of childcare, I know it is the right decision in my heart. If it were just my daughter, I'd be more open to the possibility but I really think my little guy is going to appreciate that extra year of growth around puberty. And even my daughter is so soft spoken and compliant in class that an extra year to gain some confidence would do her good, I think. I hate being in this spot.
Momma, this is why I am not so keen on having my kids start kindergarten by their birthday (curse my crappy cervix for wimping out on us too soon). Even though I think longingly of all the money I would save by not having to pay that extra year of childcare, I know it is the right decision in my heart. If it were just my daughter, I'd be more open to the possibility but I really think my little guy is going to appreciate that extra year of growth around puberty. And even my daughter is so soft spoken and compliant in class that an extra year to gain some confidence would do her good, I think. I hate being in this spot.
The hard part is that you have to decide before you know what they will like and whether the extra time will benefit them. You don't know if your child will be a high school athlete when they are 3. You just can't tell. So you will do what the rest of us do, which is make the choice you think will be best for them.
Momma, this is why I am not so keen on having my kids start kindergarten by their birthday (curse my crappy cervix for wimping out on us too soon). Even though I think longingly of all the money I would save by not having to pay that extra year of childcare, I know it is the right decision in my heart. If it were just my daughter, I'd be more open to the possibility but I really think my little guy is going to appreciate that extra year of growth around puberty. And even my daughter is so soft spoken and compliant in class that an extra year to gain some confidence would do her good, I think. I hate being in this spot.
My son was going to be the youngest child in the class and so my mom, a teacher, pressured me to start him late. Something I am ambivellant about in retrospect. He was athletic, but not tall, so from that aspect it helped (it is an issue for boys especially).
Some of his friends parents were most surprised of his accelerating because of the effect on him playing team sports. As a family, we decided sports would take a lower priority...
When he was double promoted it meant he started high school at 12, and some of his classmates were already 15. He ended up in classes that first year, with some seniors, and they treated him wonderfully. He went to a small private high school--which helped. I would not have accelerated him at our large public high school.
When things start getting complicated, that's when an educational pyschologist should be consulted.
My son played football and basketball, and ran track before high school, in high school he ran track and tried wrestling, and learned to play guitar, was a part of student government, etc.
Unless a miracle occurs, my kids are pretty sure to be in large public schools. My son IS right on target for height for the age he would be had they been term but if I don't redshirt they are going to effectively be as much as 17-18 months younger than some kids in their grade (I don't adjust their age as a matter of course any more but do continue to be mindful of the difference when considering decisions like these). I don't want middle school to be an unpleasant experience for him if he goes through puberty much later than his classmates.
Maybe an educational psychologist is a good idea. I think though as smart as they may be, I need to consider where they are at socially and hopefully give my daughter a chance to find her voice at school.
Unless a miracle occurs, my kids are pretty sure to be in large public schools. My son IS right on target for height for the age he would be had they been term but if I don't redshirt they are going to effectively be as much as 17-18 months younger than some kids in their grade (I don't adjust their age as a matter of course any more but do continue to be mindful of the difference when considering decisions like these). I don't want middle school to be an unpleasant experience for him if he goes through puberty much later than his classmates.
Maybe an educational psychologist is a good idea. I think though as smart as they may be, I need to consider where they are at socially and hopefully give my daughter a chance to find her voice at school.
You may very well be able to get them full scholarships for elementary or high school. JHU CTY offers scholarships for their online programs and summer programs. The vast majority of the highly gifted kids that are identified and attending special schools, have parents that are affluent. So, figure out what's best for them, and then see about available financial resources.
Put your kids in whatever extracurricular activities that most appeal to them, and be flexible when they want to try something new. Gifted kids often get very absorbed into their hobbies--sometimes they are long lasting, and sometimes not. Summer is often a great time for them to go to camp and see how serious they are about new interests--again, there are lots of low cost options and scholarships available.
Very few kids will be talented enough to play at the collegiate level. Former teammates of my son ended up playing football for Stanford and USC. Both had career ending injuries, one his Freshman year, the other his Sophomore year. The one that was academically gifted continued, the other boy who was bright (but his family expected him to go to the NFL and put no priority on his education) dropped out. These boys were treated like celebrities in the community, but I'd seen the pattern of how easily they're discarded when their bodies break down, and frankly there were racial implications of the way these teenagers were used, so that I didn't want athletics to be a priority for my son. (Read Friday Night Lights if you haven't if you decide to let your son play football in TX.) When my son was 7, there were parents talking about potential college football scholarships--which was insane--none of those kids had athletic talent, and had their parents been that concerned with their education, they would have had much better odds of academic scholarships.
Many of my sons male friends were shorter than the girls in their class, and it made no difference with attraction and the shenanigans that happened in 6th grade. The kids that are held back to give them advantages, like 15 year old Freshman, can have a short term advantage in high school, but by their Sophomore year, the other boys shoot up anyway. If your son really struggles in pre-K or kindergarten, then you have an evaluation done by someone outside your school district.
You just can't predict every eventuality. One twin might need one thing, and the other something totally different. And you'll just have to do your best, and know that while your children aren't perfect, neither are you and your spouse.
Could you teach AP Chemistry and Basic Chemistry in the same classroom simply by differentiating instruction?
At my kids school we have 10th graders taking Honors PreCalculus and 10th graders taking Basic Geometry. Do you think you could teach both in one class simply by differentiating instruction?
.
No. They're different classes with different content. It is not differentiation to teach solution by induction (what my dd is learning in pre calc right now) and properties of similar polygons (what I'm teaching in geometry right now) in the same lesson. Obviously, you do not know what differentiation is. It is NOT teaching multiple, disperate, subjects in the same class.
Chem and AP chem also do not compare. AP chem is, usually, taught as a two hour block because of the sheer amount of content and the lenght of the 24 required labs. I could not differentiate a class with both chem and AP chem because the average student couldn't get through the labs. That's why the average student doesn't take AP chem.
You might want to do some research on what differentiation is and is not. It is not a way to teach multiple subjects. It's practices that help you teach the SAME subject to kids of varying ability.
Here's an example of differentiation. To find the sum of the measures of the angles of any polygon, you use the formula (n-2)*180. I had a couple of students who were struggling with the formula so I showed them that they can inscribe triangles into the shape by, connecting vertices to make triangular sections, and then count the triangles. Since the angles of a triangle add up to 180 degrees they can then just multiply the number of triangles by 180. There are different ways to do things that different levels of kids get.
When I teach LeChatlier's principle in chemistry, I will teach it conceptually and then I'll use a ditch digging/hill making analogy to help the lower level students see what is happening. Even if they don't get it, most can do the problems with that visual. In short, I pass out crutches to the kids who need them. At first I didn't know how I was ever going to differentiate but I'm finding little things along the way. This is one area where my content knowledge helps me. Unfortunately, it's a slow learning curve involving me trying different things with different groups until something clicks. I keep the ones that work.
I think flipping classes will really help to differentiate instruction. I could even do different levels of lectures but it would be up to the kids to pick the one appropriate for them.
FTR, however, I do believe in tracking. There is only so much differentiation can accomplish. But it's the bottom of the class that really needs to be tracked. The average student would benefit from the kind of enrichment you can do with the upper class so I wouldn't separate them out. I'd take the bottom out and put them into smaller classes so they can get the attention they need. IMO, without that bottom in the classroom, differentiation should work just fine.
Edited to add: With all the online resources out there, I question how much differentiation is really needed for our top kids. You have resources like Khan academy that offer high level content videos for thousands of topics that kids can choose to watch if they want a deeper understanding. My issue with the mixed ability classroom is that I could teach more content to my upper kids but don't because the rest of the class can't pace with them. So I offer deeper content in what I do teach instead (this is differentiation). I'm learning that I have to teach things three ways to get most of the kids into the fold. So, while differentiation can fix kids needing to be challenged in the content I do teach, it cannot fix that there is content I just don't teach because I pace slower to accomodate the bottom of the class. There is also the impact of removing the higher kids from the class to consider. Their peers learn from them and the questions they ask and whether kids are high or low, they will have to work with people who aren't like them their entire lives. This bush has many thorns.
In a non lab based class, it might be possible to single kids out and pace them faster so you can teach them more material but my experience with upper level kids is that they view more work as punishment for being smart. You'd need a separate honors class to make this work. They balk at getting the same credit everyone else does but having to do more to get it. They're ok with more work for AP or honors credit.
If the goal is teaching deeper, differentiation can work. If the goal is teaching more, differentiation will not help. So you have to decide. Do you want depth of knowledge or more topics taught? I can do depth of knowledge with differentiation (not in everything but I'm working on it). I can't do more content with differentiation because, as I said, kids balk at being asked to do more work than their peers for credit in the same class. So, even if I wanted to break them up into same ability groups within the class, they'd never let me do it. I would hear cries of "not fair, not fair" from students, parents and administrators alike.
Last edited by Ivorytickler; 04-27-2013 at 06:00 AM..
Unless a miracle occurs, my kids are pretty sure to be in large public schools. My son IS right on target for height for the age he would be had they been term but if I don't redshirt they are going to effectively be as much as 17-18 months younger than some kids in their grade (I don't adjust their age as a matter of course any more but do continue to be mindful of the difference when considering decisions like these). I don't want middle school to be an unpleasant experience for him if he goes through puberty much later than his classmates.
Maybe an educational psychologist is a good idea. I think though as smart as they may be, I need to consider where they are at socially and hopefully give my daughter a chance to find her voice at school.
Could you explain why your kids are slated to start scool 18 months younger than the kids starting a the same time? This isn't making sense. Are you saying the other kids are all red shirted? If so, you should red shirt. You don't want your boys to be smaller than the other boys in their class their entire school career. They're going to be picked on and won't be able to compete in classes like gym.
However, as a public school teacher, I'll offer some advice. Enrich rather than teaching ahead. If you teach your kids ahead, you will only result in them being bored in school. Go deeper with them not faster with them. In the end, their educations will be superior. However, you won't get the notoriety of being the mom to the accelerated kids.
If I had it do to over, I would have taken this route with dd#2. I do not feel we did her any favors by accelerating her or putting her in the G&T program. From what I've seen with the kids in her program (about 60 kids), ahead in 2nd grade does not equate with being ahead in 8th grade. It seems that many of these kids were just fast out of the gate but then slow down and the other horses catch up.
If I had it to do again, I'd find something dd had to work at to be good at to put her in so she'd learn work ethic. For her, one of the pitfalls of being smarter has been that everything comes easily to her so she never learned to study. I posted earlier this year about her hitting a wall this year with a combination of AP lit, AP history, Honors chem and Honors pre calc on her plate with no chance of recovery because this school doesn't take transfer credits from a cc or consider work done at another university. She's still struggling and she's done irrepairable damage to her GPA. While I don't hold grades as the holy grail, colleges do and she just weeded herself out of the college she really wants to attend. Looking at what this cost her, my gut says accelerating her did her no favors. Maybe she would have been better prepared for this combination of classes as a junior (she's a sophomore who is one year younger than the other sophomores, because of her grade skip, who takes junior level classes). We'll never know. However, I'm starting to think the Peter principle applies to gifted kids.
Right now, I feel we pushed her too hard (because that's what the "experts" told us to do) and that resulted in shooting her in the foot and telling her to go race. It's also going to cost us because she won't be considered for scholarships with her new lower GPA and that, is, unfortunately, a serious problem if I can't find work.
Last edited by Ivorytickler; 04-27-2013 at 06:04 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
If it were just my daughter, I'd be more open to the possibility but I really think my little guy is going to appreciate that extra year of growth around puberty. And even my daughter is so soft spoken and compliant in class that an extra year to gain some confidence would do her good, I think. I hate being in this spot.
