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While I do not remotely disagree that dyscalcia is a real and frustrating disability I find it odd that many who have it just feel they shouldn't have to "do math". Meanwhile those with other specific disabilities, like dyslexia, are still expected to read and write, they just expect to learn specific strategies to overcome their disability.
It's not like that, most of us know we have to "do math" at least for school, or we don't graduate. There are no strategies that make it doable that I know of, I was a straight A, except for math student who by 6th grade scored at the college level on yearly tests in all subjects except math, and by 8th grade I was post college, there were no measurements that high. No matter how hard I worked I could't get math, except elementary arithmetic which I'm actually great at, and do use every day in life. I was fortunate that I had teachers who were willing to work with me regularly, and saw me give it everything I had to the point that my other grades were declining, they finally passed me with Ds that I probably didn't deserve, I couldn't even learn enough to know if I deserved to pass, or not.
It's horrible when you try everything, and work hours every day, and you still can't learn it. My verbal scores were extremely high, but my math was so basic the scores average out, and the Ds, plus the decline due to trying to pass the high math requirement of my high school hurt my GPA. My family had little money, and my math problems had me feeling stupid, and not really college material anyway. I ended up going to a local college, and was fortunate to have professors who recognized, and then helped me recognize that I was far from stupid and could become very successful, and go on to grad school with my strengths.
It definitely feels like a real disability to me, and no one had any strategies for me to work with. For me it was incurable, like asking someone who was almost blind to read a page of a book, maybe they could pull out a few words with immense struggle, and putting together the little bit they could see, but they could never actually read the page.
I completely understand the OP, even bringing this up has me feeling stupid again.
It's not like that, most of us know we have to "do math" at least for school, or we don't graduate. There are no strategies that make it doable that I know of, I was a straight A, except for math student who by 6th grade scored at the college level on yearly tests in all subjects except math, and by 8th grade I was post college, there were no measurements that high. No matter how hard I worked I could't get math, except elementary arithmetic which I'm actually great at, and do use every day in life. I was fortunate that I had teachers who were willing to work with me regularly, and saw me give it everything I had to the point that my other grades were declining, until they finally passed me with Ds that I probably didn't deserve, I couldn't even learn enough to know if I deserved to pass or not.
It's horrible when you try everything, and work hours every day, and you still can't learn it. My verbal scores were extremely high, but my math was so basic the scores average out, and the Ds, plus the decline due to trying to pass the high math requirement of my high school hurt my GPA. My family had little money, and my math problems had me feeling stupid, and not really college material anyway. I ended up going to a local college, and was fortunate to have professors who recognized, and then helped me recognize that I was far from stupid and could become very successful, and go on to grad school.
It definitely feels like a real disability to me, and no one had any strategies for me to work with. For me it was incurable, like asking someone who was almost blind to read a page of a book, maybe they could pull out a few words with immense struggle, and putting together the little bit they could see, but they could never actually read the page.
I completely understand the OP, even bringing this up has me feeling stupid again.
The problem though is that since you were never diagnosed and your teachers did not have good strategies, you were left feeling anxious and were not confident in your own ability to do math.
There are strategies available, but they probably should be used well before high school.
It's not like that, most of us know we have to "do math" at least for school, or we don't graduate. There are no strategies that make it doable that I know of, I was a straight A, except for math student who by 6th grade scored at the college level on yearly tests in all subjects except math, and by 8th grade I was post college, there were no measurements that high. No matter how hard I worked I could't get math, except elementary arithmetic which I'm actually great at, and do use every day in life. I was fortunate that I had teachers who were willing to work with me regularly, and saw me give it everything I had to the point that my other grades were declining, until they finally passed me with Ds that I probably didn't deserve, I couldn't even learn enough to know if I deserved to pass or not.
It's horrible when you try everything, and work hours every day, and you still can't learn it. My verbal scores were extremely high, but my math was so basic the scores average out, and the Ds, plus the decline due to trying to pass the high math requirement of my high school hurt my GPA. My family had little money, and my math problems had me feeling stupid, and not really college material anyway. I ended up going to a local college, and was fortunate to have professors who recognized, and then helped me recognize that I was far from stupid and could become very successful, and go on to grad school.
It definitely feels like a real disability to me, and no one had any strategies for me to work with. For me it was incurable, like asking someone who was almost blind to read a page of a book, maybe they could pull out a few words with immense struggle, and putting together the little bit they could see, but they could never actually read the page.
The experience you describe sounds very familiar to me. For me, as well as my older son, this was what it was like.
I was fine with addition, subtraction, and memorizing my multiplication tables. I struggled a bit when it came to long division, but I can muddle through with enough time. I also never had much problem with fractions.
It was when I first took pre-algebra that I had problems. I passed it with a C and went on to Algebra 1. I had a horrible teacher and I was quickly lost. My high school let me opt for consumer math and some other similar math in order to get math credits, and I handled those classes okay because they were primarily more adding, subtracting, multiplying, etc. We did things like learn to balance our checkbooks, learn how to figure a tip or a % off discount, figure out a monthly budget.
When I went to community college and again was faced with algebra, even "pre" algebra remedial classes, I was not able to understand it. I had free tutors, and paid tutors, and spent hours upon hours in the school math lab.
My son (21) was someone who had similar issues but he also struggles with more basic elementary math concepts. In 9th grade he was evaluated for special education and he tested at a 3rd grade math level, but was said to be performing on a college level for language arts and everything else. He spent hours in special math classes and he never "got it". He graduated and I am absolutely certain someone just "fudged" his math scores to make that happen. He is absolutely worried about what he'll do in life if he cannot get through basic college algebra and the entire experience has left him feeling like he is stupid, even though he excels in other areas.
That's pretty awesome, actually... did you have a diagnosed disability or special permission or something? A big part of my math "issues" pertain to remembering the steps. If I'd ever been allowed to have notes like this, I would not have quite the history of math class failures that I currently do.
To the OP: I know exactly what you are going through. I have changed my major repeatedly based on what math was required for this or that degree or program! I finally settled on a BA in English because I can take "math for liberal arts" and I know, from having taken it before, that it will be the math class I am most likely to actually PASS.
I would advise you to ask around; the instructor or professor DOES matter. In fact, when I was attending community college, there were students who would actually travel to a different CC campus across town to take Algebra from one particular instructor who had a well known reputation for being REALLY good at helping those who had failed repeatedly.
The best I can suggest if it is a possibility for you is to do your math online. That way you are at home and can use your notes without issue. I just happened to have a great professor who did everything he could to help everyone learn and understand. I think he understand dyslexia as well because he is dyslexic so he knows first hand how frustrating it can be.
I don't disagree with you in saying that if you miss one piece of math concepts, it can set you up for failure in the future.
The problem, however, in my opinion is:
1) Adolescent brains mature at differing rates. Many children are not ready for the complex nature of mathematics fields, such as algebra, in the seventh and eighth grades, but instead would be better equipped to handle the concepts in the tenth grade. As such, having these students be introduced to algebra at a time when their brains haven't matured enough to handle the concepts, simply frustrates them, confuses them, and often causes them to become defeated. Not only that, the class moves on to other concepts, and those individuals who did not get the math concepts are left behind from obtaining the material.
2) Incompetant teachers who don't work through the problems, step-by-step, but instead move too quickly, not explaining how they arrive at their answers, and assuming that everyone understands.
That's very interesting.
I didn't have an actual algebra class until 9th grade, but my math problems started sometime during 6th grade when suddenly I couldn't figure it out. I don't even know what kind if math we were doing, it was something beyond elementary arithmetic which I am fine at, I thought that might be because the basics were easy for me to memorize, but there were concepts I couldn't figure out.
Maybe I missed something along the way, I don't even understand it enough to know what I don't know, or why I don't know it, which is a very bizarre feeling for me, like trying to read a very foreign language I've never encountered before, maybe I could figure out some very basic words based on languages I do know, but I could never actually understand how to get across a thought in that language, or know if I was actually saying it correctly. I don't even know what algebra is, or what it's supposed to do. Is that normal? edit: I googled "what is algebra," no internet when I was in high school. The definition made sense, and I could figure out the answers to the basic questions until they turned it into algebra, then it became horrible, and that shaky, "I'm an idiot" feeling took over.
I also came across an interesting NY times article arguing against required algebra, link below, here's an interesting quote:
“There are students taking these courses three, four, five times,” says Barbara Bonham of Appalachian State University. While some ultimately pass, she adds, “many drop out.”
Another dropout statistic should cause equal chagrin. Of all who embark on higher education, only 58 percent end up with bachelor’s degrees. The main impediment to graduation: freshman math. The City University of New York, where I have taught since 1971, found that 57 percent of its students didn’t pass its mandated algebra course. The depressing conclusion of a faculty report: “failing math at all levels affects retention more than any other academic factor.” A national sample of transcripts found mathematics had twice as many F’s and D’s compared as other subjects.
I teach courses on research methods (esp. quantitative methods) and statistics, and ALL of my quizzes, exams, and other assignments are OPEN-EVERYTHING. I have never understood the utility of having students memorize formulas etc. My assignments test how well students understand the material, not how well they can memorize things!
Statistics (or algebra or other forms of math) do NOT have to be so scary, even for students who are not particularly good at math.
THIS
I never understood why students needed to memorize formulas more so than *to understand the concept behind them* and being able to identify and differentiate when and why certain mathematical concepts need to be applied to the problem.
As an Engineering major (initially) upon entry to college I was thoroughly turned off by the 'approach' of using Calculus and Chemistry as 'weeder' courses most often taught by instructors who one could not understand since they couldn't speak English well.
Ironically, the very occupations that use most math concepts (STEM type jobs etc...) have the data resources on hand to look up and use as needed.
Fast forward. As someone who always was good with business oriented math (geometry was my sore spot) - percentages and statistics - I excelled in bus school and in second grad school program when I had these types of courses.
While I think some suffer 'dyscalculia', I bet there are a good many who simply had bad teaching methods applied in their formative mathematical educations or negative approaches without practical examples as to how some of the concepts are used in the everyday world.
I surmise nothing quells a child's interest in learning concepts (of any arena of knowledge) than NOT being able to see the practical application of the need for learning said 'skill' in the everyday world.
This is more of a vent post, as I know there is no solution to my problem.
After 20 years, I finally started college. There were a handful of reasons I didn't go back when I graduated high school, bit I'm happy to be going back. However, I can't even pass Pre-Algebra. I failed it three times in High School and only graduated when the Summer School teacher coached me though every question, even on the final.
Time has passed, nothing has changed. My hopes are dashed. You can't get a degree without at least College Algebra. I BARELY passed the Remdial Math 1 class I tested into, and now half way through Pre-algebra and I realize its going to be a no go. I'm so disappointed. Everyone always says I'm so smart, but obviously Im not.
I think I'll just work in being as attractive and well liked as possible, since that seems to be my only strength in life.
I have the same issues. Barely passed math in high school. now in community college, I've retaken every math class (starting from the bottom up) at least twice, I will be on my third time with elementary algebra come fall term. It's like a foreign language someone has made up and I can't seem to grasp it.
You're not alone in your struggle. I won't be graduating next spring as planned, because I have to retake elementary algebra, and I still have one more class after that!
I don't disagree with you in saying that if you miss one piece of math concepts, it can set you up for failure in the future.
The problem, however, in my opinion is:
1) Adolescent brains mature at differing rates. Many children are not ready for the complex nature of mathematics fields, such as algebra, in the seventh and eighth grades, but instead would be better equipped to handle the concepts in the tenth grade. As such, having these students be introduced to algebra at a time when their brains haven't matured enough to handle the concepts, simply frustrates them, confuses them, and often causes them to become defeated. Not only that, the class moves on to other concepts, and those individuals who did not get the math concepts are left behind from obtaining the material.
2) Incompetant teachers who don't work through the problems, step-by-step, but instead move too quickly, not explaining how they arrive at their answers, and assuming that everyone understands.
I completely agree. I was not ready for algebra in junior high nor high school. Since, I have gone on to master advanced concepts.
Back when I was in school, I had a math teacher that was really a coach. Math was secondary to him and he really didn't belong in a math classroom. That was the norm, though.
As I said earlier, there are many reasons that people are not successful in mathematics. Without working with an individual, it is difficult for me to diagnose why. A math specific disabilities are extremely rare (but gaining momentum I might add).
As I said before, I started having problems with numbers in second grade. I didn't have algebra until 9th grade. I can totally relate to how stupid and embarrassed this makes you feel, not being able to do it while everyone else in the class can.
Not many items on that list apply to me but some apply strongly--like the sensitivity to noise, etc, the problem reading music--actually I can read music but can't "compute" or translate fast enough to play an instrument. I had music drilled into me in school and also had piano lessons and I wanted to do it but just couldn't.
My school was one of the top rated in the state so I had excellent teachers but I still could never do math. Algebra was a big question mark to me, it may as well have been hieroglyphics. It was like something from another planet with no connection to anything and no reason for being and it was a big blur. Yet I could do fractions. I still cannot do percentages--I understand it if I see it on a graph but I don't know how to figure it out. Maybe someone can figure out a pattern but I can't.
Numbers killed my interest in science by 7th grade when we had to figure out chemical equations. Yet I did really well in every other subject and was great at language. I was good at art and got straight A's in geometry. In geometry you can see PICTURES and there are rules written in LANGUAGE, not numbers. The square on the hypotenuse of the right triangle....all that fun stuff---I LOVED GEOMETRY. Geometry was like language logic--s-i-m-p-l-e--but a lot of the algebra kids couldn't do it.
We are definitely not stupid but there is some kind of a disconnect in our brains somewhere. I have one sister who cannot do math either and another sister who is practically a mathematical genius--same schools, same, same, same.
As I said before, I started having problems with numbers in second grade. I didn't have algebra until 9th grade. I can totally relate to how stupid and embarrassed this makes you feel, not being able to do it while everyone else in the class can.
I can too. Until I was in my 30's, I thought that I was just one of those people who could not do math. I understand completely how it feels to feel stupid.
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Not many items on that list apply to me but some apply strongly--like the sensitivity to noise, etc, the problem reading music--actually I can read music but can't "compute" or translate fast enough to play an instrument. I had music drilled into me in school and also had piano lessons and I wanted to do it but just couldn't.
I think the most significant in that list, at least for determining a bona fide, math specific disability is whether you can estimate the number of objects in a group.
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My school was one of the top rated in the state so I had excellent teachers but I still could never do math.
I am of the opinion that going to a top school doesn't necessarily mean you have a top teacher.
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Algebra was a big question mark to me, it may as well have been hieroglyphics. It was like something from another planet with no connection to anything and no reason for being and it was a big blur. Yet I could do fractions. I still cannot do percentages--I understand it if I see it on a graph but I don't know how to figure it out. Maybe someone can figure out a pattern but I can't.
I felt the same way in high school. Now, with the background I have in mathematics education, I know why, for me, specifically, this was an issue. Different people; different reasons, but rarely an actual math specific disability.
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Numbers killed my interest in science by 7th grade when we had to figure out chemical equations.
Unfortunately, this is the case. If you cannot understand the underlying mathematics, it will throw up a barrier in other math intensive studies.
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Yet I did really well in every other subject and was great at language. I was good at art and got straight A's in geometry. In geometry you can see PICTURES and there are rules written in LANGUAGE, not numbers. The square on the hypotenuse of the right triangle....all that fun stuff---I LOVED GEOMETRY. Geometry was like language logic--s-i-m-p-l-e--but a lot of the algebra kids couldn't do it.
This is seen a lot. The difficult part of geometry for many are the logic tables and proofs. Many students who are linear thinkers (like me) have difficulty when they get to geometry and they think, "Hey, when are we going to start doing math?" because it is different that the math they have done in the past. Many people who feel they cannot do math excel in geometry.
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We are definitely not stupid but there is some kind of a disconnect in our brains somewhere. I have one sister who cannot do math either and another sister who is practically a mathematical genius--same schools, same, same, same.
There are people for whom mathematics come easier than others. Just like there are those for whom drawing comes easier. I really believe that it is often what interests you more. For example, a person who draws may value the satisfaction of seeing a beautiful rendering unfold before them at their own hands. Another person may enjoy the analytical nature of a puzzle and seeing the pieces of which come together and the problem is solved at their hands. Neither person has disability. And both can learn the other discipline. Our education system can't get out of its own way most of the time.
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I'm so disappointed. Everyone always says I'm so smart, but obviously Im not. 
