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Old 10-09-2013, 04:57 PM
 
11,642 posts, read 23,829,877 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by villageidiot1 View Post
It could be different where you live but I am familiar with the schools in Western Pennsylvania and a few are charging a minimal amount for participating in extracurricular activities. The fees are typically around $100/year. Most schools have not done this.

The other item that you refer to is fundraising. This typically pays for things like meals after away games. Fundraising by booster organizations have paid for extras such as coach buses for long road games, warm-ups, and some equipment in the fitness center. It really hasn't lowered the athletic budget much since these costs would not have been incurred.
Here in SE Florida athletic budgets have been decreasing for years. Some years the drop has been in excess of 20%. The public schools do not charge participation fees but athletes are required to participate in fundraising for most sports. Fundraising can cover any expense.

Edited to add: I just saw the posts above. Some sports are not funded at all by the district. Those sports do charge participation fees in addition to raising funds. Lacrosse is a sport that was added recently that receives no district funding.

Last edited by Momma_bear; 10-09-2013 at 05:09 PM..
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Old 10-10-2013, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Shawnee-on-Delaware, PA
7,962 posts, read 7,314,425 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyway31 View Post
Club/private programs not a part of the school using school facilities should have to pay rent!
What about the Chess Club? Cub Scouts? Girl Scouts? All of them use taxpayer-funded school facilities. Forgive me for thinking you're just some kind of a Scrooge.
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Old 10-10-2013, 08:41 AM
 
Location: Shawnee-on-Delaware, PA
7,962 posts, read 7,314,425 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by villageidiot1 View Post
Yes, hockey is an exception in PA since it is not a true school sport and is not under the PIAA. I'm not aware of any school districts providing any funding to hockey.

The $1,800 probably only covers ice time and refs. I have never seen a price comparison but hockey would have to be way more expensive than football.
Actually my co-worker lives in NJ, where I do believe ice hockey is an official high school sport.

When my kids were younger we got a flyer home from school advertising a (private) youth hockey program at the local rink. Cost was over $500 back in 2005 or so. That's in comparison to the ~$100 we were used to paying for youth football! So yeah, hockey is way expensive and I'm not surprised that even in wealthy areas of NJ the public schools don't fully fund it.
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:29 AM
 
4,449 posts, read 4,594,969 times
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Quote:
Yes, my issue is primarily with the sports that have gotten disproportionately huge. I'm not opposed to school sports per se. I'm opposed to taxpayer/school budget money being allocated to them
You know I think school systems are 'political' as well as 'educational' institutions. It seems reasonable to me that each system emphasizes a different approach to the teaching of young students. In one school perhaps there may be more of a push to science/mathematics so more money say would flow towards instruments and more modern expensive tech machines thus benefiting the science students and not non-science ones. Now in the case of sports I'd be hard pressed to think that more money out of limited school budgets would flow to sports activities in schools even the ones that have great sports programs. How could more money say go to shoulder-pads, tennis rackets, lacrosse sticks, etc etc rather than books? But I really personally don't know what is occurring in US school in that scenario today.

One thing I'd say is very good with sports in schools is the fact that it can be a reality provider to those who think say they can have a college and pro career. You know only the best move on, only the best. HS sports can readily disabuse parents and students of the notion. But if they insist well you're correct that there are clubs and other teams outside of school where they can prepare and shoot for the pro leagues as a 'walk-on'.
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:32 AM
 
1,858 posts, read 3,085,505 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtab4994 View Post
What about the Chess Club? Cub Scouts? Girl Scouts? All of them use taxpayer-funded school facilities. Forgive me for thinking you're just some kind of a Scrooge.
Whoa! LOL. Nice try to slip in a kink in all of this. That those clubs have meetings/events in classrooms or other school buildings that are funded by the public is TOTALLY different than a football program spending huge amounts on things like tackling dummys, uniforms, helmets, goal posts etc. The classroom the chess club has its meeting in during off hours costs nothing extra. The weight room and all of those other things I described above for the football program can have immense extra costs.

I was once a fanboy like you. My high school has had one of the top football programs in the country over the last 20 or so years. They've traveled across the country and played live on ESPN. I enjoyed all of that. But, when you step back and really put things into perspective, you see much is wrong with the picture.
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:40 AM
 
1,858 posts, read 3,085,505 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travric View Post
You know I think school systems are 'political' as well as 'educational' institutions. It seems reasonable to me that each system emphasizes a different approach to the teaching of young students. In one school perhaps there may be more of a push to science/mathematics so more money say would flow towards instruments and more modern expensive tech machines thus benefiting the science students and not non-science ones. Now in the case of sports I'd be hard pressed to think that more money out of limited school budgets would flow to sports activities in schools even the ones that have great sports programs. How could more money say go to shoulder-pads, tennis rackets, lacrosse sticks, etc etc rather than books? But I really personally don't know what is occurring in US school in that scenario today.

One thing I'd say is very good with sports in schools is the fact that it can be a reality provider to those who think say they can have a college and pro career. You know only the best move on, only the best. HS sports can readily disabuse parents and students of the notion. But if they insist well you're correct that there are clubs and other teams outside of school where they can prepare and shoot for the pro leagues as a 'walk-on'.
Public schools are made available to those students living within a certain radius of the school. All must aim to provide a quality, balanced education for all. We can't have a world where Johnny grows up in East Anywhere town and his school focuses on Science at some expense to Literature (or whatever). Johnny shouldn't have to commute across town or to the next town over to attend a high school focusing more on his area of interest. Private/specialty schools and higher education can operate that way; not traditional public high schools.

If there were more and more prominent "club" or AAU teams for the elite or wannabe elite players, a lot of these issues would go away. The cream of the crop would know it and be able to compete against one another. Those not chosen for the elite club/AAU teams would know they aren't at that elite level in their sport. The more casual athletes in it for positive experiences rather than glory/profit can still play for their schools team. The school's team just would have more basic facilties/equipment etc. No jumbotrons at those fields.
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Old 10-10-2013, 02:32 PM
 
Location: Shawnee-on-Delaware, PA
7,962 posts, read 7,314,425 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyway31 View Post
I was once a fanboy like you. My high school has had one of the top football programs in the country over the last 20 or so years. They've traveled across the country and played live on ESPN. I enjoyed all of that. But, when you step back and really put things into perspective, you see much is wrong with the picture.
Ah, so you're a reformed fanboy. I'm actually a never-was. My kids played youth football but their (private) high school doesn't even have a football team. They played baseball and basketball.

For a high school football team to travel across the country, I doubt that was paid for with public money. I'd be against that, too, and you'd be right to go to a school board meeting to complain about the expenditure.
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Old 10-10-2013, 06:18 PM
 
Location: Wheaton, Illinois
10,261 posts, read 21,672,531 times
Reputation: 10454
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtab4994 View Post
You Libertarians kill me.

I could ask Why should parents pay for AP Latin when almost nobody takes it? but I think offering AP Latin is valuable for a well-rounded student body and it gives kids choices.
Librrtarian? I'm a left wing trade unionist.

Latin is scholarship, sports isn't. We need schools to turn out scholars not jocks. The Far East is kicking our ass, no time for trivial stuff like football. We have to get serious about learning. Sports are kid stuff, adults should be concerned about serious matters, you know, like how their kids are gonna make a goddam living.
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Old 10-10-2013, 07:26 PM
 
7,072 posts, read 9,557,448 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishtom29 View Post
Librrtarian? I'm a left wing trade unionist.

Latin is scholarship, sports isn't. We need schools to turn out scholars not jocks. The Far East is kicking our ass, no time for trivial stuff like football. We have to get serious about learning. Sports are kid stuff, adults should be concerned about serious matters, you know, like how their kids are gonna make a goddam living.

One of the "star" football players from my high school is now a delivery truck driver. I see his athletic achievements got him far in the working world.
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:40 PM
 
Location: C-U metro
1,368 posts, read 3,206,169 times
Reputation: 1192
Quote:
Originally Posted by travric View Post
You know I think school systems are 'political' as well as 'educational' institutions. It seems reasonable to me that each system emphasizes a different approach to the teaching of young students. In one school perhaps there may be more of a push to science/mathematics so more money say would flow towards instruments and more modern expensive tech machines thus benefiting the science students and not non-science ones. Now in the case of sports I'd be hard pressed to think that more money out of limited school budgets would flow to sports activities in schools even the ones that have great sports programs. How could more money say go to shoulder-pads, tennis rackets, lacrosse sticks, etc etc rather than books? But I really personally don't know what is occurring in US school in that scenario today.
In Oklahoma and Texas, it is called making idols out of the HS football coach. The head coaches in the Tulsa area make over 100k per year but the average starting salary for a teacher is 32k. They have numerous assistants that also draw high salaries. That's where the bucks go here.
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