Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Most if not all countries have compulsory education for 15 year-olds.
Students at that age are not pulled out anywhere.
For example, in China 9 years of schooling are required by law. In European countries, it is usually 12 years.
I know I have not been in school in the 1980s, but plenty of kids as young as 12 were being kicked out of school. They still were legally required to get an education <i>somewhere</i>, just not at our school. But the reality was that most of them were violating the compulsory education laws.
And before the right to education was created in the late 60s, early 70s, these students simply went into the work force. The current state of compulsory education in the US is a very new thing (as it is in many other countries).
How many of the countries ranking above the US have a child poverty rate of nearly 1 in 4? The scores are strongly correlated with family socioeconomic status. The students from middle class and wealthy families do just fine on international comparisons. In countries with high levels of poverty, many students leave school to help boost the family income. Just in my school alone, I have known many students over the last two decades who are the primary breadwinners for their families. When you are having to work nights to keep the lights on, school becomes less of an immediate priority.
How many of the countries ranking above the US have a child poverty rate of nearly 1 in 4? The scores are strongly correlated with family socioeconomic status. The students from middle class and wealthy families do just fine on international comparisons. In countries with high levels of poverty, many students leave school to help boost the family income. Just in my school alone, I have known many students over the last two decades who are the primary breadwinners for their families. When you are having to work nights to keep the lights on, school becomes less of an immediate priority.
What does that matter though? In the end the US has to work with what exists.
Globalization has made the world much smaller.
Either keep up or be left behind.
The first problem (amongst many other problems) with PISA is that countries are being compared to cities as if that's apples to apples.
I read on a forum in Chinese that one province (Zhejiang) also disclosed the results. It is said that 80% schools chosen in that province are from rural areas. However Zhejiang is one of the most developed province in China.
According to the report, the math score of Zhejiang is 2 points lower than that of Shanghai, so it would be ranked #2 if it is listed. The reading score is #6 or something, lower than a few countries.
What does that matter though? In the end the US has to work with what exists.
Globalization has made the world much smaller.
Either keep up or be left behind.
Making excuses will get you nowhere. The fact is we must compete in a global economy and we must do it with the resources we have available. Given that our child poverty rate is so high, we really need to be helping our top reach the heights they can, while working on that child poverty problem of course. We, however, keep robbing our top to teach to our bottom and that is NOT WORKING.
Location: Chapel Hill, NC, formerly NoVA and Phila
9,777 posts, read 15,783,646 times
Reputation: 10886
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person
That's news to us (or would have been last year). The PISA guys used our alphabetized roster and picked the kids themselves. If those testers were just supposed to be 10th graders they missed that mark, too, since there were kids from each class pulled out.
This particular assessment is based on age not grade and students are randomly sampled.
Last year they listed state by state results and MN and MA were 5th and 6th globally respectively....
I also want to see results removing any of the low income stats to compare. When all of the parents in the US put as much emphasis on education as Asian families do, that will solve our "education crisis" in the US overnight....
What does that matter though? In the end the US has to work with what exists.
It matters because many people are using the PISA results as an indictment against the American educational system and suggesting radical reforms to how children are taught in schools in this country. However the PISA and other global educational measurement tools indicate educational outcomes, and the reality is that there are a number of variables that effect these outcomes. If our goal is to improve average educational outcomes across the board in the U.S., making changes to in-school variables will only do so much to reach that end. And that's assuming that the changes to in-school variables are actually the right changes and aren't actually making things worse (which is what I believe is really happening).
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Making excuses will get you nowhere. The fact is we must compete in a global economy and we must do it with the resources we have available. Given that our child poverty rate is so high, we really need to be helping our top reach the heights they can, while working on that child poverty problem of course. We, however, keep robbing our top to teach to our bottom and that is NOT WORKING.
