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The OPs arguments are like going to the gym and refusing to do any exercises because "When am I going to do 20 curls in a row, or 50 jumping jacks, or downward facing dog?"
Thank you for reading this thread, I'm going to go ahead and junp right in
I'm in highschool right now, so I go through these things day to day, and I know how it is, so let me just say that before I go on my rant.
First off. The things that you "learn" in highschool will never and I mean NEVER be something you will need later on in life. Unless we are talking about something along the lines of woodshop where you learn how to fix household items and things like that. But the math, the science, the reading classes, and the languages, etc are a complete waste of your time. Let me say this though so you don't think I hate school all together. I think some of what you learn in kindergarden to atleast 7th to 8th grade is usefu, (ABC's, 2+2=4) the BASIC knowledge that you will indeed need to know in your life in order to go anywhere, yes, i think that is a must. But the way I feel about highschool... I'm honestly sad to say this myself, in the 3 years I have been in highschool I cannot name a single USEFUL thing that they try to force upon students. Highschool seems to me like just something for kids 14 to 18 years old to do. Like they want to just keep us busy for those 4 years. What I'm about to talk about are my experiences, so my details are just what I have gone through since I started high school.
That's absolutely not true; you will need some of the things you learn in high school throughout your life, especially in college.
I do agree, however, that they could teach it to you in a more effective and interesting way.
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Originally Posted by TheAversion
ENGLISH: Well first off, since 9th grade (3 years ago) We have done just a touch of your basic grammer (things you learned in 5th or 6th grade) and the rest has either been stories that were written so long ago that the teacher has to stop reading between sentences to explain to the class what the hell the character in the story is talking about, or Greek Mythology.... Now I'm no expert on English and grammer, but I am not seeing how Greek Mythology aka things that never happend relates to spelling, writing, etc. How as a teacher are you going to fail me because on a test I dont remember what greek god had what powers? How does that knowledge help me in any way shape or form? It doesn't. And every single year since 9th grade we have read Romeo and Juliet... for 3 years straight I have had to read that god awful story, where they speak in riddles. The point I'm trying to get across here is that English class in highschool really isn't what it is supposed to be i my opinion.
Greek mythology absolutely helps you! For one thing, some scientific terms are taken directly from Greek. For instance, ever hear of arachnophobia or an aphrodisiac? Those words come from Greek. If you know about the myths of Aphrodite and Arachne, those words should be easy to figure out! There's more to it than that, though. Again, I think it's not really that it's being taught, I think it's more how it's taught to you. If the teacher believes it's irrelevant, she or he may teach it as if it is. I think that's one unfortunate result of the Common Core requirements; teachers have to worry so much about covering a topic that they don't have time to really stop and explain things.
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Originally Posted by TheAversion
MATH: I'm going to keep this short and simple. I have never opened a check book and saw (4x+2x= 53x) or anything like that. If you can Add, Subtract, Multiply, and Divide... I think that is all you need to make it in the real world as far as math (depending on your future plans) which doesn't matter in school because you are forced to learn and be tested on it anyway. A normal person doesnt need to know the circumfrence of a trapazoid.
You will be surprised how many supposedly menial professions use Algebra, Geometry, and Trigonometry. For instance, do you think you might be able to make a living cutting lawns during the summer? You will need to know basic Algebra to understand the ratios of oil and gas mixture to put into your equipment. Without knowing the formula, you'll waste a lot of money. Also, if you plan to go to cooking school, you will need to know how to use Algebra to help you correctly modify a recipe. Do you want to learn carpentry? You will need a basic understanding of Geometry and Trigonometry to know how to properly build that barn.
Then, there's always this perfectly acceptable answer: you can't get to college without it! Ever the GED has trigonometry on it these days, so bite the bullet and get it over with. Your teachers might be terrible, but put up with it. If it is really so bad that you can't learn anything, talk to someone who can help, like a counselor or administrator.
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Originally Posted by TheAversion
OTHER THOUGHTS: Who do you know who speaks a foreign language and is GOOD AT IT because of highschool? I'm going to guess none, because they don't teach you to speak the language, they teach you sentences and such, which is difficult (the way they teach it) and its just plain useless, again depending on your future plans.
Again, this may be your school's fault. You should demand a more intensive study of the language. High school foreign language classes seem to assume that regulars just take the class for an easy A. You need to let them know that you really are there to learn; otherwise, they will cheat you by teaching to the lowest achievers in the room. Also, request to learn via immersion, not grammar-translation. Translation is a slow process that really hinders your speaking ability. When you see an apple, you should be able to recall "manzana," quickly, for instance. You should not struggle to think, "now, what is the word for "apple" again?" It should be automatic.
Most high schools persist in teaching foreign languages using grammar-translation, because they hold that learning how to use grammar and constructions in your language is more important than actually learning the language. You complained about not learning grammar. Well, if you are taking a foreign language, you should be learning tons of it. Most high school foreign language courses are nothing but exhaustive courses on English grammar in disguise; that's why you aren't learning the language well. The course isn't even meant to teach it to you; it's meant to teach you how to use English better.
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Originally Posted by TheAversion;36991291[B
School rules are also stupid, you are forced to go to school, just to be slapped in the face with rules like: wearing an ID, uniform, no facial hair, no talking, no phone, no eating (while your teacher eats a bag of chips and drinks a diet coke),hair length, hair color, etc. Just ridiculous rules that no kid should have to deal with.
I could go on all day about the things wrong with the educational system now adays, but I will end it at that. Feel free to comment your opinions, and Thank You for reading.
If you think the rules are stupid, you should go to some of the schools I've subbed. You would be happy to have order and structure in your life afterwards.
Wear an ID--this is so that you can easily be identified in case anything happens to you or in case you try to hurt anyone else. Without student IDs, people from other campuses could come onto school grounds and pretend to be another student, cause trouble, and leave an innocent student with the blame.
Wear a uniform--again, this is partially to help us identify you quickly. It's also intended to help prevent bullying by giving dignity to poor students and discouraging rich students from flaunting their wealth by wearing expensive fancy clothes. In practice, though, they do find other ways to flaunt it.
No facial hair--this rule depends on the school. Sometimes exceptions are made for certain religious beliefs.
No talking--If you talk while the teacher is talking, you won't get your lessons. Talking is actually a huge distraction that can really excite students, especially if gossiping and bullying is involved. It's hard to tell if you guys are just socializing or harassing one another, so a blanket rule of "no talking" is used to address this. That way, no matter what is said, the student is punished for just opening his or her mouth. The "no talking" rule addresses verbal harassment, distractibility, and clowning. You would be surprised how many students abuse the privilege when "no talking" isn't the rule.
No phone--those phones can be a quiet distraction. You could be surfing the internet instead of listening to the teacher, and no one would ever know; it happens even in lecture halls. If cell phones distract college students, what do you think they can do to you?
No eating or drinking--Your teacher shouldn't be eating and drinking in front of you, unless she has some kind of health problem that requires it, but eating in class is very distracting. It makes other students hungry, for one thing, and causes them to concentrate on your food, not the lesson. The eater also has less time to take notes or get other important things done. Also, don't get me started on clean-up. Grease and sugar can be a nightmare that attracts cockroaches and ants to the room. It's best to leave these things at home. Not to mention, immature students could engage in fights with food and drink; I've seen it happen. It's not a pretty sight.
Hair color--again, the idea is that some students will take irrational liberties, like dye an obscene word to their heads. Plus, during Halloween, you can probably wear silly hair colors without a problem.
Hair length--this is done to prevent bullying again. A young man with long hair might look odd to some of his classmates. A girl with her hair to the floor might be teased by her classmates.
Numerous other posts pointed out some of the fallacies in your thinking, but this one has gone unaddressed and bothers me so I feel I need to bring it up.
Your statement above displays an enormous lack of understanding regarding basic algebra. Basic mathematical skills are NOT all that you need to "make it" in the real world.
Someone else already pointed out the enourmous error of your coment regarding the "circumference of a trapezoid", but what about this formula that you wrote: (4x+2x= 53x)
That is a mathematical impossibility... which you clearly don't understand.
(4x+2x) = 6x . So rewriting it... if (4x+2x) = 6x then according to your formula (6x = 53x)
How can (6x = 53x) ever ? <--- let me guess that you still don't even understand that. Even a basic cashier making change needs to understand that much.
If you want to do anything more with the rest of your life, beyond working at some minimal wage job, then you need to develop your basic skills well beyond their current level.
While I personally agree with the op about it being a waste of time I also feel that it depends entirely on what the person chooses to do with their high school time, and exactly what school they go to. The high school I went to for example was one of the most overpopulated in the state and I had my fair share of bullying and other things that made it quite the negative experience and a waste of time in my eyes. However I'm sure some people loved it there, so it's really dependent on the individual.
In Germany what they do is start tracking kids at 11 or 13, and by high school they are specializing already.
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Originally Posted by Murk
I'm 40, have two teenage sons, and actually agree with many of your points!
I also think the educational system is completely screwed up overall: teaching to tests, emphasis on regurgitation of facts rather than understanding of the connectivity between things, etc.
By 16ish, a kid should have some idea of what their strengths and weaknesses are. They should be past the "I want to be a ballerina!" phase and actually be thinking of their future.
Instead of having a standard progression of classes that every kid has to pass in order to graduation, I'm in favor of a much more focused education based on strengths and interests. Kids who are pretty sure they want to go into hotel management or work at their father's plumbing company or become a lawyer shouldn't have to learn how to map the genetic divergence in fruit fly populations. Basic genetics should have been covered already so the kid doesn't look like an idiot when it comes up in the news or in conversation in the future.
Now, that being said, I'm a great fan of adults having a proficient general knowledge about how things work, history, civics etc. Of course kids need to be taught stuff. High school should be preparation for the real world, not just a place to get scores so you can get into college.
I like beer. I don't like the fact that the beer that I enjoy is pretty expensive. I do like the fact that I can figure out that a 22oz "bomber" of said beer that sells for $4.99 is a significantly worse deal than a 6-pack for $9.99, even though the latter is twice the price. I thank basic algebra for helping me figure that out.
I just look at the unit pricing label below the items on the grocery shelf, and compare.
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Originally Posted by almostjay;
I also thank it for helping me figure out how much my commute costs, and whether or not my wife and I should switch to a family plan for our cell phones, or to help me pick a stock I might want to invest in. I guess I also thank it for establishing a solid mathematical foundation in my brain that allowed me to get my Masters degree in engineering, which in turn allowed me to get a job that pays pretty well. I think my friends in the business world, analysts and accountants, and my wife who is an elementary school teacher, all of whom didn't major in a STEM field in college, have a similar feeling of gratitude.
The problem isn't that kids are forcibly taught needless things. It's that many teachers lack the knowledge or ability to adequately demonstrate to these kids why these things aren't needless. That's the unfortunate reality in my opinion.
Additionally, life is too damned easy. If the OP was busting his ass plowing fields all day, and learning math represented a path out of poverty, he'd be singing a different tune. But the reality is that he probably has a nice home to live in, video games to play, food to eat, and a loving family that is willing and able to continue to provide those things to him in perpetuity. I understand how it can be hard to motivate oneself under those circumstances.
I can do most of that stuff without algebra, and I'm a good stock-picker. I don't need a family plan for my cell phone, so--meh. But you make a good point about teachers needing to relate that stuff to everyday life. I'll give you that.
On a further note, breaking news: I have a friend who just started studying for his journeyman's license in construction. The algebra's killing him, but he's managing. Struggling, but passing the tests, barely. So it goes to show that dropping out of HS and getting a job in the trades doesn't necessarily mean you get to avoid math. What it means is you'll get the lowest pay, and you'll be the first fired in a downturn, if you can't do the work that professional licensing requires. A warning to the OP.
Well, if your school isn't challenging you, then try learning stuff on your own. I learned Russian on my own and although I can't speak it very well, I could go to Moscow and ask directions, order in a restaurant, and book myself into a hotel.
Want to learn new words, how to spell, and (mostly) correct grammar? READ. All the time. Everything. National Geographic, Joseph Wambaugh, Jon Krakauer, Laura Ingalls Wilder, James Burke, Laurie Garrett. I'll pick up Cottage Living and Discover magazines at the same time (cashier thinks I am a schizo reader and she may be right!).
Don't forget some of the neat TV shows like The Nature of Things or Nova. You can probably get the Connections and The Story of English series from your library. And there are plenty of "science" and "math" books out there that are now being written to give the layman a clearer understanding of those subjects instead of dry formulas. Want to know more about the "chaos" part in Jurassic Park? Pick up "Chaos" by James Gleick. Want to learn about Ebola and other diseases? Pick up 'Fever" by John G. Fuller and "The Coming Plague" by Laurie Garrett. Want to read something intelligent about ghosts for a change? Try "Ghosts of the Air" by Martin Caiden.
You get my point. Sometimes you need a professional to teach you something. But most times you just need a little initiative.
Basic grammer is spelled grammar. "Grammer" is Kelsey's last name. I have horrible grammar skills because I was not taught any. My teachers were lazy. I find the literature completely useless. I hate Shake Sphere (I don't care how to spell his name either.) I will never understand his importance so don't even bother to explain. The required literature shoved down our throats is just overrated and many other authors deserve recognition.
They don't teach good languages in high school. Usually it is Spanish. I am not interested in Spanish! I want to learn Japanese or Russian! But this is not going to be taught in an average high school and it never will be. Other nations speak fluent or almost fluent multiple languages. (or at least Japan can speak Engrish lol) I believe that learning a language should be taught in Kindergarten (which is a German word, and was interested in learning German. I was ripped off in High School.) Because when you are younger that is when you learn languages the best. This explains why there are feral children. They did not learn any language when they were younger and it is slightly more difficult to learn a language when you are older. Perhaps I will study a few lanugages at University. But you don't necessarily need to learn it in school, you can just study it on your own time.
A worthy topic for another thread. More and more, children are beginning school years behind what is developmentally appropriate for their age. In Mississippi, all kindergarten children were just evaluated for readiness. Only 1 out of 3 was found to be prepared for the kindergarten-level skills they were to learn. Mississippi allows parents to keep children at home until first grade, so this survey did not even include all 5-year-olds. I fear that the ones who were not sent to school would be found to be even less well-prepared.
I find that most of my students are operating somewhere between 5th and 10th-grade levels for most of their knowledge and skills. The younger students tend to be somewhat more skilled than the older ones, most of whom have been retained once or twice. Many of the seniors will fail one or more of the tests required for graduation every single time they take it. This year, the state began allowing senior to graduate without the state tests if they score at least 17 on the ACT.
The school experience the OP is enduring is likely to be heavily influenced by the testing obsession. Many schools in the country have dropped anything interesting in order to meet AYP on abstruse formulas that include test scores, attendance, and graduation rates. As a result, the curriculum has been narrowed to the point where I fear I would have been tempted to drop out too. I have the freedom of teaching a non-tested subject, but one which is required for graduation. So I experience the pressure to pass students who haven't mastered the first bit of the content.
It's a shame that more schools won't trust that children will learn more if they are motivated and interested. Instead, they try to coerce the students into mastering these isolated skills and knowledge and motivate them with dances and pizza. I'd be angry too, if I were a student these days.
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I have horrible grammar skills because I was not taught any. My teachers were lazy. 
I find the literature completely useless. I hate Shake Sphere (I don't care how to spell his name either.) I will never understand his importance so don't even bother to explain. The required literature shoved down our throats is just overrated and many other authors deserve recognition. 
But you don't necessarily need to learn it in school, you can just study it on your own time.