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Old 02-20-2016, 06:56 AM
 
18,549 posts, read 15,598,983 times
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If everyone knows that using standardized test scores to evaluate a school creates a perverse incentive to "teach to the test", then why on EARTH do parents looking at buying a house look at TEST SCORES?

1) Isn't it hypocritical to evaluate based on the very factor that you yourself know has caused damage to the American school systems because of its evaluation?

2) Are there truly no other options, for instance, college admission rates of those graduating from that school district?

3) Why would parents think that high-scoring schools are actually better at "real" education, as opposed to simply better at teaching to the test?
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Old 02-20-2016, 07:02 AM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
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Like it or dislike it, it doesn't matter. What you described is national education policy, encouraged by influential CEOs, passed by Congress and signed into law by two different Presidents.
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Old 02-20-2016, 07:15 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,557,277 times
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When I was an engineer I designed products to the test all the time because I knew they'd have to pass the test before going to market. The difference between this and education is that most of the time the test actually was a good measure of how the part needed to function. Our problem in education isn't testing or teaching to the test it's having the right test to teach to. You can't do stupid things like pick 6 standards out of 140+ for one subject (like they do in chemistry) and say you've tested that subject. What we need are exit exams for every grade and subject that actually measure what the child knows and determine whether the child knows what they need to know to move on. If you expect me to teach 140+ standards then test them all. If they're worth learning they're worth testing. Our problem is the test we're teaching to is garbage and doesn't really measure what our kids know or need to know. Fix the test and you'll fix the problem.
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Old 02-20-2016, 07:22 AM
 
18,549 posts, read 15,598,983 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Like it or dislike it, it doesn't matter. What you described is national education policy, encouraged by influential CEOs, passed by Congress and signed into law by two different Presidents.
No law forces parents to use test scores to evaluate a prospective school for their child(ren).
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Old 02-20-2016, 07:24 AM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,437 posts, read 60,638,057 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
No law forces parents to use test scores to evaluate a prospective school for their child(ren).

No, but the law forces school systems to test and publish those results so parents use the tools available.
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Old 02-20-2016, 07:52 AM
 
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If I knew a school was considered a good school, but it had lower test scores compared to others in the same league, I'd consider that they might not teach to the test and I might be more interested in that school.

However, if I knew nothing about a school system other than it's test scores, then very low scores might make me think it wasn't a very good school as it would be the only information I had to go on.

When we were deciding what to do for middle school for our kids, stay in a charter school that had top test scores, or switch to the regular public with average scores, we switched them. The test scores were only a small part of our decision, but we did factor in the teaching to the test and it did sway us the other direction.
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Old 02-20-2016, 08:14 AM
 
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Because for good or bad, it's one of the few bits of information available about schools. I don't agree with it, but it's what's available. As someone who has spent a good bit of time doing scientific test, I'm kind of appalled at what passes for standardized testing in the educational system.


Ivory, I do have to disagree with you about designing to the test. The proper approach is to design to the requirements and then test to the requirements. It might seem like a meaningless distinction, but in reality the gap is huge. That why we have several levels of test -- development test and operational test. The same lesson could be applied to schools in that teaching to the test gets the student past the first part -- developmental test if you will -- but often leaves them unprepared for real world challenges -- the operational test.
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Old 02-20-2016, 09:33 AM
 
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Judging by the people I meet the ones who judge schools by test scores are not the same people who view standardised testing as a bad thing.
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Old 02-20-2016, 10:05 AM
 
Location: A coal patch in Pennsyltucky
10,379 posts, read 10,675,257 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
If everyone knows that using standardized test scores to evaluate a school creates a perverse incentive to "teach to the test", then why on EARTH do parents looking at buying a house look at TEST SCORES?

1) Isn't it hypocritical to evaluate based on the very factor that you yourself know has caused damage to the American school systems because of its evaluation?

2) Are there truly no other options, for instance, college admission rates of those graduating from that school district?

3) Why would parents think that high-scoring schools are actually better at "real" education, as opposed to simply better at teaching to the test?
I agree with TNFF. Parents looking at buying a house look at test scores because they are available. I would look at any other available data such as percentage of students going to college, average SAT/ACT scores, number of National Merit finalists/semifinalists, scores and number of students taking AP exams, etc.

Test scores do reflect something about a school or school district. The thing is, it mainly reflects the socioeconomic level of the school or district. But isn't that something you're taking into consideration when buying a house?
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Old 02-20-2016, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,531,102 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
If everyone knows that using standardized test scores to evaluate a school creates a perverse incentive to "teach to the test", then why on EARTH do parents looking at buying a house look at TEST SCORES?

1) Isn't it hypocritical to evaluate based on the very factor that you yourself know has caused damage to the American school systems because of its evaluation?

2) Are there truly no other options, for instance, college admission rates of those graduating from that school district?

3) Why would parents think that high-scoring schools are actually better at "real" education, as opposed to simply better at teaching to the test?
If not scores then how would you evaluate a school ?
By its looks ?
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