Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Have to disagree with you there. But then again, I don't believe in taxes, lol. I'm a Libertarian and Anarcho-Capitalist.
Eh, I have no problem with taxing luxury items...and in my opinion that's what recreational drugs are. But we have now completely hijacked this thread from the original topic...so I'll shut up now.
Having guns in schools held by random people to be able to shoot at any forgiven time (protecting or not)is not going to stop the anger in these sick individuals.
Well the guns aren't really held by random people so much as trained and responsibile adults who have submitted to all the state required background checks. You are not allowed "to shoot at any forgiven time(protecting or not)". A person may only use lethal force to defend against a lethal force attack. This is where the firearms training comes into play. You say later in this post that you've never liked firearms and you don't own any. So that would lead me to believe you have never attended any firearm training. So I see how you might think that anyone can just "whip out their heater and start icing people" but, that is not the case. There are clearly defined laws that dictate when someone may and may not use lethal force.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNITE
If carrying a gun from class to class is legal than it sure would be alot easier just to open fire whenever and whereever.
Once again you can't just go out to the quad and start shooting at a trash can because you're bored. There must be an imminent threat to even remove the weapon from it's holster. As I said before there must be a lethal threat to the life of a person in order to use lethal force in return.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNITE
Then you got the 18 year olds trying to steal these guns from the carriers. THe maturity and wisdom of college kids today is just not there.
where are these 18 year olds that try and disarm people? Do they also try and disarm a police officer who might be on campus? Or do they only go around lifting peoples shirts up to see who is carrying CONCEALED just so they can attempt to disarm them? Trying to take someones gun away from them is a good way to get yourself shot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNITE
What would happen to the gun carrier if the gun accidently hit the floor(in purse,bookbag etc...) and shot someone? You suppose that gun holder would be doing time over an every day event as far as dropping things.
Well ideally the weapon will always be in a holster on your person. I supposed some ladies might rather keep it in their purse for some reason. Even in a purse or bag if it is holstered properly it’s incredibly unlikely. However, in the event that it happens the person in control of the weapon would indeed be responsible for a negligent discharge. Guns do not just "go off". If it always someone’s fault so that person would be responsible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNITE
I've never thought too much about guns, meaning I do not like them. I have never owned one myself. I have stood in front of double barrel, whiskey drunk, wife slept around on him, country hillbilly Oaky's gun. I just told him either use it or put it down and fight like a man. I am a woman. There was nothing smart about it. He did however put the gun away, after he cracked his wife in the head with it. NOt fun.
Since you do not like guns and never owned one it would probably be fair to say that you have no practical experience of your own(aside from the drunken hillbilly) with one, yes? Have you atleast fired one before? I could see how your negative experiences helped to form your opinion of guns and their owners. If you have no experience with them, then you compound that with having some drunken hillbilly stick one in your face and then beat his wife with it. Then you add that to the way guns are used in movies and TV then it's understandable to see why you feel the way you do. I can assure you that most gun owners are NOT drunken hillbillies who beat their wives(or husbands).
Do you know any shooters? Maybe someone who can take you shooting, teach you the safety rules, and show that it is a much safer past time then you might think? If you're in the Phoenix area and you're interested I wouldn't mind having you go along the next time I go out. I've taken several people shooting who have never gone before. They all seemed to enjoy it and felt more comfortable around firearms afterward. A couple of them even bought their own and go shooting by themselves now. One of them includes my mom, she loved it and I bought her a pistol for Christmas...that’s right I'm a thoughtful son In any event, its just a suggestion, but you might find you change your mind about guns and their owners if you went shooting with a responsible shooter and learned a few things about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNITE
I would say no to more guns and yes to more security guards.
Since you say no to more guns does that mean these security guards would be unarmed security guards? If so that adds up to zero if you're looking for someone who can stop some maniac that starts shooting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNITE
It is a shame that this thread couldn't have actually been about EDUCATION. Meaning, it is sad that our college students now have another obstacle in the EDUCATION FIELD to hurdle,as if trying to concentrate on their studies and careers isn't hard or scary enough.
I would agree with that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNITE
I am a firm believer that when it is your time to die then thats all it is. That is the only way I can accept it. I have learned to try and celebrate their life and not mourn their death so hard. My son and I have had this pact since he was 3, where if one of us was leaving to go somewhere without the other we would tell each other,that if one of us died before we got to come together again, than I love you and I will see you in heaven. I don't know how else to handle it.
But no, I would not like to see just everyone carrying a gun. People are too unpredictable. I say concentrate on your studies and if it is your time to go than you will go however is in your destiny.
Does that mean you should let some murderous thug decide when your time is? You shouldn't be able to protect your life? What if someone was trying to kick in your front door screaming that they were going to kill you? Would you just sit on the couch and wait until they get through the door? Maybe that’s your time. Or would you call the police to come and stop the attack? It could have been your time to go.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNITE
To the fallen- May God Rest Your Souls.
LIVE LAUGH AND LOVE
I would agree with this as well.
Last edited by RickieInPhx; 02-20-2008 at 01:56 PM..
Reason: Forgot a Word:)
So,UNITE, you would have the disturbed people the only ones with guns? It's already been proven over and over in more than 40 states that people with CCW permits are the most law abiding citizens in the country, but you don't want them armed to confront the sickos. This kind of logic escapes me!
I never said let all the sickos have them. Yes, I do believe in the constitution to bear arms. However, I do believe that our college campuses do not need to be loaded for bear, by the students. What is so bad about having a more safe environment with a few more security guards? We all have a choice. We can either give up a luxury (where money is spent for it) or we can carry on the way it is now, and make guns the answer. I disagree with the latter.
It is my understanding that in some states you can not get a gun permit until you are 21. Ok, so what about the majority of college students due to the fact they are not old enough yet? What about their safety?!? I think the AMERICAN people better get off their duffs and start paying for this extra safety for all. So maybe we should forego going to the Bears football game so that our people can study without the fear of being there. Meaning put the money towards extra guards and equipment if needed.
As far as on the streets or home, that is up to each individual. I have never wanted anything to do with a gun. If I get shot by one, all I can do is die, if it is my time. We all die sometime. Maybe we should be jealous of the dead. They do not have to deal with this world anymore. I often wonder why I am left on this earth, and the only thing I can come with is to help people and spread the word of God. I am not a religious goer. I do not even attend church. But I do know Jesus Christ is my savior and that makes it easier.
With that being said, please no disrespect toward the dead. I have family and friends there too.
Please can't we rethink the college full of guns thing? I would not want my son to have to shoot someone. No, not even to save another. That is something a person has to live with for the rest of their lives. I wonder what the troops in Iraq would say to this question. Hope I haven't offended anyone. God Bless the fallen.
I never said let all the sickos have them. Yes, I do believe in the constitution to bear arms. However, I do believe that our college campuses do not need to be loaded for bear, by the students. What is so bad about having a more safe environment with a few more security guards? We all have a choice. We can either give up a luxury (where money is spent for it) or we can carry on the way it is now, and make guns the answer. I disagree with the latter.
It is my understanding that in some states you can not get a gun permit until you are 21. Ok, so what about the majority of college students due to the fact they are not old enough yet? What about their safety?!? I think the AMERICAN people better get off their duffs and start paying for this extra safety for all. So maybe we should forego going to the Bears football game so that our people can study without the fear of being there. Meaning put the money towards extra guards and equipment if needed.
As far as on the streets or home, that is up to each individual. I have never wanted anything to do with a gun. If I get shot by one, all I can do is die, if it is my time. We all die sometime. Maybe we should be jealous of the dead. They do not have to deal with this world anymore. I often wonder why I am left on this earth, and the only thing I can come with is to help people and spread the word of God. I am not a religious goer. I do not even attend church. But I do know Jesus Christ is my savior and that makes it easier.
With that being said, please no disrespect toward the dead. I have family and friends there too.
Please can't we rethink the college full of guns thing? I would not want my son to have to shoot someone. No, not even to save another. That is something a person has to live with for the rest of their lives. I wonder what the troops in Iraq would say to this question. Hope I haven't offended anyone. God Bless the fallen.
LIVE LAUGH AND LOVE
Name one mass-murder that hasn't happened in a gun-free zone. If you can answer that, your stance at least has something to back it up. If not, you're just pulling the common what if thing and just thinking of all the negatives without seeing the logic behind being armed in public areas.
Well the guns aren't really held by random people so much as trained and responsibile adults who have submitted to all the state required background checks. You are not allowed "to shoot at any forgiven time(protecting or not)". A person may only use lethal force to defend against a lethal force attack. This is where the firearms training comes into play. You say later in this post that you've never liked firearms and you don't own any. So that would lead me to believe you have never attended any firearm training. So I see how you might think that anyone can just "whip out their heater and start icing people" but, that is not the case. There are clearly defined laws that dictate when someone may and may not use lethal force.
Once again you can't just go out to the quad and start shooting at a trash can because you're bored. There must be an imminent threat to even remove the weapon from it's holster. As I said before there must be a lethal threat to the life of a person in order to use lethal force in return.
where are these 18 year olds that try and disarm people? Do they also try and disarm a police officer who might be on campus? Or do they only go around lifting peoples shirts up to see who is carrying CONCEALED just so they can attempt to disarm them? Trying to take someones gun away from them is a good way to get yourself shot.
Well ideally the weapon will always be in a holster on your person. I supposed some ladies might rather keep it in their purse for some reason. Even in a purse or bag if it is holstered properly it’s incredibly unlikely. However, in the event that it happens the person in control of the weapon would indeed be responsible for a negligent discharge. Guns do not just "go off". If it always someone’s fault so that person would be responsible.
Since you do not like guns and never owned one it would probably be fair to say that you have no practical experience of your own(aside from the drunken hillbilly) with one, yes? Have you atleast fired one before? I could see how your negative experiences helped to form your opinion of guns and their owners. If you have no experience with them, then you compound that with having some drunken hillbilly stick one in your face and then beat his wife with it. Then you add that to the way guns are used in movies and TV then it's understandable to see why you feel the way you do. I can assure you that most gun owners are NOT drunken hillbillies who beat their wives(or husbands).
Do you know any shooters? Maybe someone who can take you shooting, teach you the safety rules, and show that it is a much safer past time then you might think? If you're in the Phoenix area and you're interested I wouldn't mind having you go along the next time I go out. I've taken several people shooting who have never gone before. They all seemed to enjoy it and felt more comfortable around firearms afterward. A couple of them even bought their own and go shooting by themselves now. One of them includes my mom, she loved it and I bought her a pistol for Christmas...that’s right I'm a thoughtful son In any event, its just a suggestion, but you might find you change your mind about guns and their owners if you went shooting with a responsible shooter and learned a few things about it.
Since you say no to more guns does that mean these security guards would be unarmed security guards? If so that adds up to zero if you're looking for someone who can stop some maniac that starts shooting.
I would agree with that.
Does that mean you should let some murderous thug decide when your time is? You shouldn't be able to protect your life? What if someone was trying to kick in your front door screaming that they were going to kill you? Would you just sit on the couch and wait until they get through the door? Maybe that’s your time. Or would you call the police to come and stop the attack? It could have been your time to go.
I would agree with this as well.
I guess my question to your first answer would be, How do you know who is carrying or not? It is too easy to get one from the street thugs. Just because a person holds a gun card, doesn't mean the guy standing next to him isn't armed illegally. So yes, there are random people carrying guns all over the world illegally.
MY answer to your second statement. Just because there is a law in place for this, does not mean that everyone is law ibiding citizens. There is a reason this thread got started, random shooting sprees. I don't know of any of the shooters being old. All the shooters are very young. It is not the responsible people who are doing the damage. It is our drugged up (by doctors or streets) kids who are losing it, in the schools. Know who you are dealing with if you are the administration. I am not saying it is the administrations fault this is happening.
Are you kidding me? Kids steal guns everyday from everywhere. I never said they attack the gun holders. Gee.
Accidents happen all the time. Guns do go off when fallen to the floor. Maybe not every time but most generally they do.
I am 44 years old and yes I have shot a gun. My honey owns guns and is an avid gun believer. He can build one from scratch. He was also an avid hunter since the day he was 5. I do know some about guns. I still don't like them. I don't mean for it to sound as harsh as that but I don't know how else to say it.My honey also believes in bearing arms no matter where you are at. I understand that too, but I can't see college kids achieving everything they can from college if they have to worry about who they may have to shoot today because the administration has not put in place a safe environment.
I do appreciate your invite, but I am states away from you. I am in Illinois. Where the last shooting happened. Not right in that town, just in Illinois. I can appreciate you getting your mother to be able to protect herself if ever needed. I also understand that there are people who just enjoy shooting at targets.
Definately arm the guards. Yes.
I guess I don't think of a shooter as my maker just because he shoots me dead. I just believe that a person will go when it is their time, no matter how they go. I really can't tell you how I would react to burglars. Never had one, Thank God. I have been raped several times by different rapers and have always came out alive. I think if I would have handled them differently then I would not be here today.
No, I definately would not like to see the colleges loaded with guns, by the students.
Name one mass-murder that hasn't happened in a gun-free zone. If you can answer that, your stance at least has something to back it up. If not, you're just pulling the common what if thing and just thinking of all the negatives without seeing the logic behind being armed in public areas.
I'm sorry Haaziq, I do not understand the question. What is a gun-free zone? Does that mean the people with the guns or without?
This is not a what if thing. It is very real and serious. It is administrations responsibility to make sure his environment is safe for all these people paying big money to be there. NOT EVERYONE can carry them, mostly due to age, and the majority of college students are under the age of 21. So what about them?
Also this killing didn't happen at a school but when I found it my jaw dropped so I thought I'd share it. This sick and twisted woman killed a pregnant lady...and cut the baby out of her womb! I told you it made my jaw drop!
Woman convicted in case of baby cut from mother's womb - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/law/10/22/pregnant.slaying.ap/index.html - broken link)
Yes there are woman who have used guns to kill. There are 6 year olds, too. And some of these killings occur in states that enable CCW.
My reference was to random killings on the scale of Columbine, Va Tech and NIU.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
). 
Unite
Unite
Unite
