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I'm adding a poll to this thread because uniforms are coming up often in discussion.
Frequently, in the "real" world, one would encounter uniforms worn in retail establishments and by the military. However I think most of the time, one wouldn't see them in nonschool environments. So my question would ask about wearing uniforms in a school environment.
EdX
America used to have de facto uniforms. Look at an old photo of say, a World Series game from the 1960's. Those were day games, and most of the fans were grown men who worked a half day and went to the ballpark in their "work clothes". They are almost all wearing a white shirt and a dark necktie. These are your "white collar" workers. There may not have been written rules, but you had better not show up at the bank wearing a pink shirt with a flowered tie!
Same goes for blue collar workers: machinists, plumbers, construction workers, who typically wore blue work shirts.
School children were at one time dressed by their mothers, and there was a certain de facto mode of dress, depending on class and region. In today's world of "anything goes, and the more anything, the better" more and more school administrators are looking at uniforms, and since they can't legislate de facto, the uniforms are de jure.
I never said that you wrote the dress code standards for my kids' school.
All I did was speak from my experience with dress codes and how the current IP my kids attend give the girls a pass/are less strict with the girls than they are with the boys.
I have a lot of respect for you & agree with you close to 99% of the time.
You aren't understanding where I'm coming from on this particular issue. It's not that big of a deal...my boys still wear dress shoes/pants, etc., to school and the girls still wear leggings and slippers.
(sorry, had to edit b/c the first time didn't convey what I meant)
Thank you for the kind words.
I'm saying that the thinking may be that girls' pants colors are not that important. In the outside world, few men wear pant colors other than navy blue, black and various shades of brown, no patterns, except rarely plaids. Women, OTOH, wear pants in all colors and all kinds of patterns.
I find the slippers kind of odd. As others have said, kids have always found ways around some of the dress code stuff. Uggs do have hard soles, maybe that counts, I don't know. Other than that, I can't say anything about them.
I do think if you really felt this wasn't that "big of a deal" you wouldn't be doing all this posting about it.
America used to have de facto uniforms. Look at an old photo of say, a World Series game from the 1960's. Those were day games, and most of the fans were grown men who worked a half day and went to the ballpark in their "work clothes". They are almost all wearing a white shirt and a dark necktie. These are your "white collar" workers. There may not have been written rules, but you had better not show up at the bank wearing a pink shirt with a flowered tie!
Same goes for blue collar workers: machinists, plumbers, construction workers, who typically wore blue work shirts.
School children were at one time dressed by their mothers, and there was a certain de facto mode of dress, depending on class and region. In today's world of "anything goes, and the more anything, the better" more and more school administrators are looking at uniforms, and since they can't legislate de facto, the uniforms are de jure.
Until kindergarten, maybe. I went to school in the 50s and 60s. My mom did not dress me, ever, that I recall. I remember her thinking it nutty that in Jr. High (ugh!) we wore tennis shoes and nylons, but she let me do it. She "let" my brother wear a T-shirt to high school that said "Budweiser, Breakfast of Champions".
Here are some pictures from the 1960 World Series, from Forbes Field in Pittsburgh. Yes, I do see old, obviously wealthy men in the great seats right near the field wearing sport coats and sometimes top hats. I'd like to see some pictures from farther up in the stands where the average guy and gal were sitting (though they probably couldn't get tickets to this game). https://www.google.com/search?q=1960...QwSARQ7bY6M%3A
The fact that this thread is now 12 pages (for me, using default forum settings) is more than a clear indication that what students wear is garners more discussion than it should in an EDUCATION forum. Just take a step back and think about that for a minute. If it's that much of an issue for parents, teachers, etc. (who were once students themselves), then the easiest solution is uniformity (see what I did there?) in dress code -- not because adults are power hungry, or because were are prudes, but simply because we need to place kids' focus on their education and not what they wear. If you want kids to be able to freely express themselves, have them do it with pen and paper, or a paintbrush, or an instrument, etc. (i.e. let them express themselves through their learning). They are going to school, and not walking down a runway.
The fact that this thread is now 12 pages (for me, using default forum settings) is more than a clear indication that what students wear is garners more discussion than it should in an EDUCATION forum. Just take a step back and think about that for a minute. If it's that much of an issue for parents, teachers, etc. (who were once students themselves), then the easiest solution is uniformity (see what I did there?) in dress code -- not because adults are power hungry, or because were are prudes, but simply because we need to place kids' focus on their education and not what they wear. If you want kids to be able to freely express themselves, have them do it with pen and paper, or a paintbrush, or an instrument, etc. (i.e. let them express themselves through their learning). They are going to school, and not walking down a runway.
And yet, I was in a school district where parents could elect to have a school have uniforms, and as I recall, none did.
And yet, I was in a school district where parents could elect to have a school have uniforms, and as I recall, none did.
If you were lucky enough to be in a school district where education was in fact the main priority already, and how students dressed was rarely a point of discussion, then I do not see why this is at all surprising.
The fact that this thread is now 12 pages (for me, using default forum settings) is more than a clear indication that what students wear is garners more discussion than it should in an EDUCATION forum. Just take a step back and think about that for a minute. If it's that much of an issue for parents, teachers, etc. (who were once students themselves), then the easiest solution is uniformity (see what I did there?) in dress code -- not because adults are power hungry, or because were are prudes, but simply because we need to place kids' focus on their education and not what they wear. If you want kids to be able to freely express themselves, have them do it with pen and paper, or a paintbrush, or an instrument, etc. (i.e. let them express themselves through their learning). They are going to school, and not walking down a runway.
My purpose in posting is to point out the sexism in so many of these dress codes. Despite Informed Info's experience, in most cases girls are "dress coded" more than boys. The codes for girls are often more elaborate. At the early part of this thread, a mom stated her 8 year old dtr was not allowed to wear yoga pants or even knit pants that were similar to yoga pants. Incidents were pointed out about skirts having to be a certain length, with teachers/principals making girls kneel on the floor (while they looked up their skirts probably) to measure them! Straps have to be at least so many fingerwidths wide, a measurement that varies with the measurer and requires said measurer to be up close and personal. Accidents, such as a shirt riding up while raising one's hand, are considered dress code violations. I do agree with those who say that if girls are allowed to wear shorts, boys should be allowed to as well.
Are you serious. Install electronic devices when not needed? I'm beginning to wonder the purpose behind your threads on this sub-forum. Perhaps you could explain your purpose(s) in your posts and your background in education. It might be helpful to the discussion.
I don't think that the poster that you were responding to was being serious.
I've already given a few theories about that specific incident. Again, I didn't see the girl, I wasn't there, and I don't know the teacher, so I can't say definitively what happened. We only heard one side of the story.
Mmkay! I mean, yeah, we only heard her side, but I've heard many other stories like this. Let me tell you one. (Don't everyone groan at once!) My daughters were both in the HS orchestra together one year, one a freshman and one a senior. They both told me that their conductor, who was a member of a very conservative religion that requires women particularly to dress very conservatively, told the girls that after a concert some "father" complained that he could see up girls' skirts. Now I found this a bit unbelieveable as 1) you could only see the full bodies of the kids in the front row; 2) they were sitting, and there's no way one could look up under their skirts! I think the "father" was him, and I wonder why he was looking up girls' skirts in the first place.
You have no proof that the teacher was the one who was able to see up the girl's skirts. You are making a false accusation against him just because you do not agree with his religion and social conservatism. How would you feel if I started falsely accusing you of things with no proof, because I don't agree with your social liberalism?
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Most employers in NYC require men to wear a suit and tie no matter how hot it is, while allowing women to wear basically anything they want, including midriff shirts.
Seriously? I'd like to hear from some women about that! Women don't dress like that here in Denver, where it gets hotter than NYC.
That's how women dress in NYC.
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It's less about "training" them how to dress for work, but more about wearing appropriate clothing for the job. Midriff shirts should be for the club, beach, gym, etc, and not for school or a workplace.
Well, I wasn't defending midriff shirts. I was saying things happen. Guys can bend over and show their cracks too! What solution do you have for that? Maybe everyone, male and female, wear burkas? https://www.flickr.com/photos/577948...-PCSb26-Na66puThis could happen in a school setting as well.
A guy (or girl) who bends over and shows his cracks should be handled the same way. Depending on whether he/she is intentionally trying to push the envelope, or if it is clearly modest attire that he/she has outgrown.
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It is very frustrating seeing rules being enforced for yourself (or, in this case, her sons) while being ignored for others (in this case, the girls in her school).
Oh, for Pity's sake! You know, my mom had a son and a daughter. She used to say everyone should, because she knew several people who had only girls or only boys who were always complaining about the other sex. The ones with girls, "Boys are so __________". The ones with boys, "Girls are so __________". I'll let you fill in the blanks. That's what's going on here.
Reminds me of my 11th grade math teacher. She said that she once did a study as to what day of the week kids were the rudest: she said it was always Thursday. Somebody in the class then pointed out that perhaps she expects us to behave worse on Thursdays. She threatened to kick him out of class. This teacher was always in a noticeably worse mood on Thursdays compared to any other day of the week. That meant she probably would perceive the same behavior on a Thursday as being worse than if it were any other day of the week. And, since she would be nasty to us on Thursdays, it made us not want to behave well. Perhaps that is what the poster that you are responding to was seeing.
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