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This kind of came up in another thread, but really didn't get discussed there. But does pose an interesting issue/dilemma. Given the cost of college today, what is the line between helicoptering and legitimate intervention at the college level?
As anyone who has been through college knows, some professors are simply incompetent or complete and total dirtbags. I'm not talking about professors who are tough and challenging, but those where no learning takes place. Or worse grading is arbitrary and capricious with no relation to the work performed. So you can stick the class out and hope you pass or drop it and spend another semester/summer retaking the class, hopefully with a decent professor.
On the one side of the argument, college students are adults and should fight their own battles, and that they have to learn that sometimes life isn't fair and to deal with it. And that is a good argument.
On the other side however, college has become almost prohibitively expensive. If no learning is taking place, that money is wasted and sets the student up for problems in follow on classes. If dropping adds an extra semester, that's a big cost. And of course the college has no problem encouraging kids to drop classes and add a semester or year = more money.
And that sets the stage for the dilemma: As a parent you want your kids to deal with their own issues. But also as a parent (and taxpayer in the case of public colleges) you don't want to waste thousands/tens of thousands due to professor Dinghead.
This kind of came up in another thread, but really didn't get discussed there. But does pose an interesting issue/dilemma. Given the cost of college today, what is the line between helicoptering and legitimate intervention at the college level?
As anyone who has been through college knows, some professors are simply incompetent or complete and total dirtbags. I'm not talking about professors who are tough and challenging, but those where no learning takes place. Or worse grading is arbitrary and capricious with no relation to the work performed. So you can stick the class out and hope you pass or drop it and spend another semester/summer retaking the class, hopefully with a decent professor.
On the one side of the argument, college students are adults and should fight their own battles, and that they have to learn that sometimes life isn't fair and to deal with it. And that is a good argument.
On the other side however, college has become almost prohibitively expensive. If no learning is taking place, that money is wasted and sets the student up for problems in follow on classes. If dropping adds an extra semester, that's a big cost. And of course the college has no problem encouraging kids to drop classes and add a semester or year = more money.
And that sets the stage for the dilemma: As a parent you want your kids to deal with their own issues. But also as a parent (and taxpayer in the case of public colleges) you don't want to waste thousands/tens of thousands due to professor Dinghead.
The bolded is all true but has nothing to do with parents, those are all issues for the adult student to take care of.
I have sent four through college. We gave them a very small allowance, everything else was up to them. If they had problems with grades, roommates, professors, or money, that was up to them to solve. But, then again, we slowly backed up from managing their education starting about fourth grade, each year handing more and more responsibility and ownership over to them. If they had missing homework in middle school my reaction was to make it clear to them (not the teacher) that it was unacceptable and that it was up to them to fix it. Notice, the teacher and I were not involved in this transaction. If they didn't get along with a teacher it was up to them to figure out how to make it work, although we were available to give advice when asked. Too many parents deny their children autonomy and steal from them the experience of learning how to come up with solutions. It is easier for the parent to take care of it than watch their child cry, when in reality children NEED to experience disappointment and failure when the stakes are smaller and a soft lap and a warm cookie can make everything feel better.
Here's a tip, if you don't like the grades your child is producing in college or their progress let them know if they don't do better you are going to close the checkbook. If you have to intervene for your adult child, whether they are a student or beyond, chances are very good that you didn't properly do your job as a parent. Don't compound it by continuing to rescue them. They need to figure this out before they get a boss and failure means being fired.
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When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
And that sets the stage for the dilemma: As a parent you want your kids to deal with their own issues. But also as a parent (and taxpayer in the case of public colleges) you don't want to waste thousands/tens of thousands due to professor Dinghead.
I suspect that most parents wouldn't have a clue whether a prof was a dinghead or not, only their kid's assertion.
College is not high school. You don't like what your money buys, you go elsewhere.
I think y'all are making the assumption that whatever happens, is always the students fault. Which is not true. I've tried to make it clear I'm not talking about lack of studying or lack of trying. I'm talking things that only the professor and college can fix. And we all know that the college will support the professor regardless. Once they get tenure, they're untouchable regardless of how poor their performance. Had one when I went through that was so bad the entire class staged a walk out and went to the dean. You know the dean's answer? "Yes, we know how bad he is, but he has tenure so there's nothing we can do about it."
If you paid $40K for a car that turned out to be a lemon, would you say "well, life's not fair, guess I'll have to accept it" or would you be raising holy heck over it? That's my point for this -- we let colleges off the hook on too many things because "students need to deal with it" or "they need to learn life's not fair" or similar platitudes that do nothing to fix the underlying problem. Poor performance isn't acceptable in other walks of life -- why is it acceptable in education?
College students get drunk.
Have sex.
Get hazed or haze others.
Go on field experiences all over the country and the world.
Could instead be in the military fighting for our country in Afghanistan.
Could be working a full time job instead.
Can get married, and sometimes do.
Can have children, and sometimes do.
Parents...butt out. Like it or not, if they're in college they're adults.
Let them learn to act like it.
Meanwhile, you go play bingo at the senior center.
Jeez.
So, now that even public college tuition is exorbitant, this opens the door to hordes of parents addressing department chairmen and deans, wanting to micro-manage the college? What a nightmare!
I get it, OP; you have a huge economic stake in this venture. But I think what you're contemplating does cross the line. I think it screams "Helicopter parent alert!" I don't know how long the semester has been going now, at your child's school (some schools start fall semester/trimester in late Sept.), but depending on how long classes have been in session, the student may be able to transfer to a different section of the course, or drop it and jump into a new course; a little late, but could be still doable. Does this college have a summer semester? That could be another option, for "catching up" on credits; student could work through the summer, and take one class on the side.
I don't think there is such a thing as "legitimate intervention at the college level", unless the student has been involved in a crime, or something equally as extreme.
I think y'all are making the assumption that whatever happens, is always the students fault. Which is not true. I've tried to make it clear I'm not talking about lack of studying or lack of trying. I'm talking things that only the professor and college can fix. And we all know that the college will support the professor regardless. Once they get tenure, they're untouchable regardless of how poor their performance. Had one when I went through that was so bad the entire class staged a walk out and went to the dean. You know the dean's answer? "Yes, we know how bad he is, but he has tenure so there's nothing we can do about it."
If you paid $40K for a car that turned out to be a lemon, would you say "well, life's not fair, guess I'll have to accept it" or would you be raising holy heck over it? That's my point for this -- we let colleges off the hook on too many things because "students need to deal with it" or "they need to learn life's not fair" or similar platitudes that do nothing to fix the underlying problem. Poor performance isn't acceptable in other walks of life -- why is it acceptable in education?
I wasn't making that assumption at all, it is simply immaterial whose "fault" it is, the issue is the student's to deal with, not their parents. Offer advice if they ask, such as go to the academic ombudsman or the dean, but it is the adult student's place to decide how to address their own problems. You planning on contacting their boss when they get chewed out for getting behind at work?
__________________
When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
OP: The dean gave you a cop-out answer. Tenured profs can be fired for cause, and incompetence or negligence is cause. If you get an answer like that, you go to the pres. and board of trustees. That said, the vast majority of profs are competent, and the parent is almost never in a position to judge a prof's ability.
I think y'all are making the assumption that whatever happens, is always the students fault. Which is not true. I've tried to make it clear I'm not talking about lack of studying or lack of trying. I'm talking things that only the professor and college can fix. And we all know that the college will support the professor regardless. Once they get tenure, they're untouchable regardless of how poor their performance. Had one when I went through that was so bad the entire class staged a walk out and went to the dean. You know the dean's answer? "Yes, we know how bad he is, but he has tenure so there's nothing we can do about it."
If you paid $40K for a car that turned out to be a lemon, would you say "well, life's not fair, guess I'll have to accept it" or would you be raising holy heck over it? That's my point for this -- we let colleges off the hook on too many things because "students need to deal with it" or "they need to learn life's not fair" or similar platitudes that do nothing to fix the underlying problem. Poor performance isn't acceptable in other walks of life -- why is it acceptable in education?
FERPA will make it almost completely impossible for you to get directly involved. Even if you could discuss some general things with the professor/dean/dept. chair, FERPA will not allow them to discuss specifics with anyone other than the student even if you are footing the bill.
Unless they're financing the lawsuit, there's no place for parents in college.
That would be like your dad coming to your mortgage broker and trying to yell at him. It literally makes no sense.
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