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And not representative of the public. I think a lot of the public's frustration is because of how the schools handled covid. They closed. But they are supposed to be institutions of public service and support. People felt abandoned. Hell, everyone involved felt abondoned - staff, faculty, students, parents, the public.
I typically defended the system. But even I feel like it let me down during covid. I never felt like wanting to quit so bad.
That was a difficult call. If they would have remained open, what percent of families would have kept their kids home. My guess -- a majority, so that wouldn't have worked.
We do NOT "HATE" public schools. We see problems that need to be addressed and public school officials that not only refuse to address them but deny that the problems exist.
I wouldn't necessarily interpret it to mean that the grading method isn't accurate. I simply see it as another version of the bias against high performing students and a societal preference for "average" or "C" students. We've noticed a tendency of teachers and school systems to focus more on the lower third than the rest of the class. Even here in this thread there have been those who point out that "C students run businesses" while trying to imply that A students don't. How often have you heard some version of that?
I believe the point is there are teachers who give easy A's, even to those who do poorly. Just as there are teachers who refuse to give an A no matter the performance is because "no one is perfect."
Both of these scenarios are common throughout school and college. Heck even as far back as Kindergarten there were parents juggling teachers because they knew that how a student does in those early grades can set them up for success or failure later on.
1. Interesting that you presume I was talking about YOU. I mentioned not one poster's screen name.
2. Who are these posters -- be specific -- who are denying that problems exist?
I believe the point is there are teachers who give easy A's, even to those who do poorly. Just as there are teachers who refuse to give an A no matter the performance is because "no one is perfect."
Both of these scenarios are common throughout school and college. Heck even as far back as Kindergarten there were parents juggling teachers because they knew that how a student does in those early grades can set them up for success or failure later on.
It is much more common for teachers to give easy A's. It is extremely rare for a teacher to refuse to give an A. I've only encountered one teacher in my entire life who refused to give an A and it was a college professor. She was my English I professor and nobody in the class received an A.
A high school teacher would have parents calling the principal complaining about the teacher. I have first hand experience with this. Last year I hand a 9th grader with a 92% average. He needed a 93% for an A. His mother called the principal a couple of times complaining that my tests were too hard, I hadn't covered material in class, etc. I had to justify to the mother and principal why he was getting a B and not an A.
The problem with public schools is that we pay for them to exist, and not for the outcomes they produce. Funding should be based solely on the school's performance year on year, and if the school's performance is unsatisfactory (based on benchmarks set in advance), the school should be shut down.
That goes for EVERY government program out there. Pay for outcomes, not for existence. If a program fails to deliver the promised (or satisfactory) outcomes, shut them down.
Same thing with teachers. Make it EASIER for people to enter the profession, and FIRE poorly performing teachers. High barriers to entry with poor pay (because you're paying for a bunch of dead weight) makes for a stagnant profession and the shortage that everyone refers to. The best teacher I had when I was in high school used to be a sales rep for IBM and taught Econ.
Same with students. HOLD BACK or EXPEL students who aren't making satisfactory progress. At some point, the lost causes are a waste of time and resources and take resources away from students who actually want to learn.
Last edited by albert648; 10-02-2022 at 01:04 PM..
The US public educational system is broken. The people that run it are doing generations of kids, a HUGE disservice. It's incredibly sad to see, the graduates are unemployable.
The 4th graders in the US are choosing which bathroom to use, while the public schools in China (4th graders) have already learned 4 languages (2 fluently,) physics/math and other sciences.
I wish I were being facetious, but rest assured, I am not.
The US public educational system is broken. The people that run it are doing generations of kids, a HUGE disservice. It's incredibly sad to see, the graduates are unemployable.
The 4th graders in the US are choosing which bathroom to use, while the public schools in China (4th graders) have already learned 4 languages (2 fluently,) physics/math and other sciences.
I wish I were being facetious, but rest assured, I am not.
I agree. But the people in charge have one reason or another to explain it away...
I learned very early on as a parent that it was better for me to put my efforts and energy into my own children rather than take on "the way things are done" in the school system.
I made sure that they read the classics at home and we did math practice. I printed out released standardized tests for our school district and made sure that the kids were up to speed on their concepts. I made sure that the kids completed every homework assignment.
I could have spent my time butting heads with administrators, teachers, specialists, etc but often their hands are tied by red tape and there is a very real limit as to how much they can help individual children.
Too often, parents hand it all over to the schools and then complain when their child falls behind. But the fact is, parents have been helping their kids at home for generations, especially in the elementary school years. If a kid gets to middle school with a good educational foundation that is half the battle. Parents need to do their part, too.
I learned very early on as a parent that it was better for me to put my efforts and energy into my own children rather than take on "the way things are done" in the school system.
I made sure that they read the classics at home and we did math practice. I printed out released standardized tests for our school district and made sure that the kids were up to speed on their concepts. I made sure that the kids completed every homework assignment.
I could have spent my time butting heads with administrators, teachers, specialists, etc but often their hands are tied by red tape and there is a very real limit as to how much they can help individual children.
Too often, parents hand it all over to the schools and then complain when their child falls behind. But the fact is, parents have been helping their kids at home for generations, especially in the elementary school years. If a kid gets to middle school with a good educational foundation that is half the battle. Parents need to do their part, too.
I worked in Title 1 schools. The majority did NOT help their kids and depended on the schools to supply everything, do everything and be everything.
You had parents that could not speak English, never graduated HS, in and out of jail. You had kids being shuffled among family members for one reason or another.
And in most cases, there is only so much a teacher can do in 45 minutes.
1. Interesting that you presume I was talking about YOU. I mentioned not one poster's screen name.
2. Who are these posters -- be specific -- who are denying that problems exist?
I didn't presume anything. I did however contradict your implication that those who find problems in schools do it because they hate public schools.
While I'd love to be more specific, I don't want to run afoul of the ToS. But in general, just look through this thread. It should not be difficult to figure which point of view most people support.
The problem with public schools is that we pay for them to exist, and not for the outcomes they produce. Funding should be based solely on the school's performance year on year, and if the school's performance is unsatisfactory (based on benchmarks set in advance), the school should be shut down.
That goes for EVERY government program out there. Pay for outcomes, not for existence. If a program fails to deliver the promised (or satisfactory) outcomes, shut them down.
Same thing with teachers. Make it EASIER for people to enter the profession, and FIRE poorly performing teachers. High barriers to entry with poor pay (because you're paying for a bunch of dead weight) makes for a stagnant profession and the shortage that everyone refers to. The best teacher I had when I was in high school used to be a sales rep for IBM and taught Econ.
Same with students. HOLD BACK or EXPEL students who aren't making satisfactory progress. At some point, the lost causes are a waste of time and resources and take resources away from students who actually want to learn.
No child or teenager should be considered a "lost cause", and to treat them as such will only cost society more in the long run. I have known many students who turned themselves around after high school, sometimes long after, and the education they received was part of their 'recovery'.
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