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Old 09-19-2020, 06:53 PM
 
9,478 posts, read 7,971,362 times
Reputation: 4790

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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheerbliss View Post
Nope, not on me. The jobs weren't there. I had very few coworkers my age. When I was laid off from my last engineering job, I'd been sending out resumes for four months without a phone call. Lately? I've met young engineers who took a year to find a job.

Before you argue from disbelief about what transmission mechanics and dental hygienists make, look up their pay.
Apparently there is a lot of Ageism in the STEM fields. In fact, exists in all fields

https://lawkm.com/stem-age-discrimin...and-employers/

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/07/b...bs-hiring.html
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Old 09-19-2020, 07:02 PM
 
Location: NYC
17,630 posts, read 11,232,617 times
Reputation: 21092
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
I never said anything about staying ahead and staying that way.

With the amount of STEM grads India has and had, they really should have been ahead of the curve a long time ago one would think. At least in the IT field, for quite a while, they had enough workers to flood America's labor market in that industry to really drop the price of wage.

That is quite a lot of workers. Or perhaps they were just lagging behind in the other STEM fields until recently.
Except, they are studying to get a job in STEM. Not passionate about STEM. How about Indian IT worker you speak to that are excited in what they're doing and can elaborate on the field. Most are talking about salaries, moving their families to America, and getting away from their country.
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Old 09-19-2020, 07:06 PM
 
Location: Indianapolis, East Side
1,845 posts, read 893,060 times
Reputation: 4527
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
Apparently there is a lot of Ageism in the STEM fields. In fact, exists in all fields

https://lawkm.com/stem-age-discrimin...and-employers/

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/07/b...bs-hiring.html
That did seem to be the case. However, this was when I was in my 20s. Almost all my coworkers were old enough to be my dad.
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Old 09-19-2020, 08:59 PM
 
10,347 posts, read 10,633,787 times
Reputation: 9303
Quote:
Originally Posted by leastwanted View Post
And a career is not *only about money.
An true engineer never wants to be a technician or nurse.
A true engineer should never be driven into those fields unless they want as much.
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Old 09-20-2020, 01:13 PM
 
Location: Shawnee-on-Delaware, PA
4,620 posts, read 4,186,101 times
Reputation: 8970
Quote:
Originally Posted by leastwanted View Post
H1B wages are public data and can be found online. For example, here is the base salary of H1B petitioners from Facebook in 2020:
https://h1bsalary.online/search?sear...ty=&job_title=

They are paid no less than US citizens of the same positions.
OK that's nice for Facebook employees from India. But recently in the news was the Tennessee Valley Authority, a quasi-governmental utility that until the plan was exposed, was going to fire native IT workers and replace them with H1B workers. That's not a lateral move, that's cost-cutting. There have been other reports of H1B workers replacing U.S. born and legal resident workers, at lower salaries in other corporations.

The original purpose of the H1B program was not to make hiring easier for giant corporations. It was to allow those companies to fill positions they otherwise couldn't fill with Americans. There is no reason to think a person from India can write code better than a person from Indiana.

Want to discourage American kids from studying STEM? Fire the ones who graduated and found jobs 5, 10, or 20 years ago and replace them with cheaper foreign workers.
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Old 09-20-2020, 04:34 PM
 
10,347 posts, read 10,633,787 times
Reputation: 9303
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheerbliss View Post
Nope, not on me. The jobs weren't there. I had very few coworkers my age. When I was laid off from my last engineering job, I'd been sending out resumes for four months without a phone call. Lately? I've met young engineers who took a year to find a job.

Before you argue from incredulity about what transmission mechanics and dental hygienists make, look up their pay.
I looked up fresh numbers, although I didn't need to, before my earlier post.
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Old 09-20-2020, 05:06 PM
 
Location: Texas
13,499 posts, read 5,573,780 times
Reputation: 25940
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtab4994 View Post
Quality means more than quantity. If we had 50% of students "studying STEM" then what would that really get us if the students (a) don't have aptitude for the subject matter and (b) don't have any STEM job prospects when they graduate.

There is no shortage of STEM graduates in the U.S. The reason giant corporations are importing STEM workers from India on H1-B visas is to save money, not because of a trained worker shortage.
100% truth.

Its a myth that there is a shortage of STEM degreed people in the USA. American Universities graduate thousands and thousands of STEM workers every year.
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Old 09-20-2020, 06:56 PM
 
10,347 posts, read 10,633,787 times
Reputation: 9303
Quote:
Originally Posted by PriscillaVanilla View Post
100% truth.

Its a myth that there is a shortage of STEM degreed people in the USA. American Universities graduate thousands and thousands of STEM workers every year.
The problem with this discussion is people think in aggregates when the problem areas are very specific.

There are several STEM areas in which we categorically do not produce enough specifically educated US citizens. A few are.............

1). Computer science......please note I'm not talking about coders or analysts.

2). Medical researchers

3). Medical doctors

4). Nuclear and electrical engineers at the Ph.D level. Actually there are legit shortages at the MS and Ph.D levels across several engineering disciplines.
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Old 09-20-2020, 07:54 PM
 
Location: Texas
13,499 posts, read 5,573,780 times
Reputation: 25940
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDS_ View Post
The problem with this discussion is people think in aggregates when the problem areas are very specific.

There are several STEM areas in which we categorically do not produce enough specifically educated US citizens. A few are.............

1). Computer science......please note I'm not talking about coders or analysts.

2). Medical researchers

3). Medical doctors

4). Nuclear and electrical engineers at the Ph.D level. Actually there are legit shortages at the MS and Ph.D levels across several engineering disciplines.
There is a shortage of medical schools/medical school enrollment caps which is part of the problem. Also a shortage of nursing schools.

The fact is that it costs more money to run a medical school than it does a law school. With a law school, all you need is a building a law library. Medical schools (and nursing, dental, etc) require a lot more expensive and sophisticated equipment.

I don't think it's as simple as saying not enough Americans want to be doctors.

https://blog.definitivehc.com/factor...ician-shortage

I would not be opposed to the H1-B program if it required employers to only hire people at the 100K or higher salary level. But there are people coming here on H1-B to do very simple, lower paid jobs. This isn't necessary or helpful.
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Old 09-20-2020, 08:44 PM
Status: "Autumn!" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 108,168,452 times
Reputation: 35831
Quote:
I don't think it's as simple as saying not enough Americans want to be doctors.
Who ever has said that? It is very difficult to get into medical school. Med school acceptance rate overall is 7%.
https://mededits-com.cdn.ampproject....Fstatistics%2F
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