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Again are students who do not show up or are sleeping through class going to use the resources expended on laptops for all for other than gaming?
So you believe that its unnecessary to equitably distribute funds among schools because kids in poor districts don't deserve it?
The U.S. public education system is a failure and not trying to find solutions is not an option for the health and stability of our nation.
DEFUND PUBLIC EDUCATION.
Focus on charters and build a new system not controlled by unions.
(btw, the computers would be for school not home use so no gaming allowed--I meant pc's, not necessarily laptops.)
Attached is a link to an article from the Foundation for Economic Education which outlines how U.S. public education is costing taxpayers more than private schools while producing an inferior education.
In fact, its so inferior that there is a tremendous increase in remedial courses in colleges because students aren't ready for collegiate level courses BECAUSE THE PUBLIC EDUCATION SYSTEM CONTINUES TO FAIL EVEN STUDENTS WHO GO ON TO COLLEGE.
So not only is our money being wasted in public education, its costing us more in higher education as well.
Ridiculous.
Public education is a drain on American citizens.
MORE MONEY DOES NOT NEED TO GO INTO THE CESSPOOL OF PUBLIC EDUCATION - JUST REDISTRIBUTE THE EXISTING MONEY EQUITABLY UNTIL WE CAN RID OURSELVES OF THIS FAILED SOCIALIST EXPERIMENT KNOWN AS THE AMERICAN PUBLIC EDUCATION SYSTEM.
CHARTER SCHOOLS ARE KEY.
Last edited by PerditaPanthera; 03-08-2021 at 12:25 AM..
The US usually spends in the top 5 nations on education. So what do you have to complain about there? Yet, its real results are far less than the other 4 top nations. Far below. And this is DESPITE the fact that the US consistently ranks at or near the top in quality overall on just about every global education index. To hear people complain in the USA on the surface level seems mystifying, considering people in the other top nations don't complain nearly as much about their systems. They're PROUD of them. And most of them spend less too. People in USA complain because they KNOW their system is failing, despite what the rankings say. AND WHAT THE SPENDING INDICATES. The more we SPEND the worse we FAIL. Or at least, people think we fail.
According to the National Center for Educational Statistics (NCES), 21 percent of adults in the United States (about 43 million) fall into the illiterate/functionally illiterate category. Nearly two-thirds of fourth graders read below grade level, and the same number graduate from high school still reading below grade level. This puts the United States well behind several other countries in the world, including Japan, all the Scandinavian countries, Canada, the Republic of Korea, and the UK. By ranking of the last UNESCO survey of 2015, this puts the USA right DOWN AT THE BOTTOM of the world for literacy. The WORST country in 2015 was South Sudan, with a 27 percent illiteracy rate.
In 2019, the top 15 countries in the world for literacy were not the top 15 on GDP or spending as a percentage of GDP. Far from it. Some of them are among the poorest.
It cost absolutely NOTHING to teach a child to read. ATTITUDE is 99 percent of the job. American are NOT serious about education, because they aren't serious about reading first off. They think of it more as day care. They like to TALK about it. Talk talk talk. And most of the talk is COMPLAINING.
You sound like all the other experts. Yet, for all that "expertise", we have what we have. What we see with our eyes is the measure of success. Not factoids. Not rhetoric.
My wife and I see this EVERY DAY for the past 30+ years. Much of it in private schools and charter schools. Where do you think the TEACHERS and administrators in these schools come from? What we've heard is all the rhetoric of the "experts". I'm sure glad these sorts of "experts" aren't the ones fixing my car. Or doing electrical work in my house.
Last edited by Led Zeppelin; 03-08-2021 at 04:52 AM..
This travesty of learning is occurring even in New York City, which is not nearly as deranged as Baltimore. See "Remote" Zoom Learning - Drug Deals or Academics? Rap videos about drug deals are part of the Zoom education.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Led Zeppelin
The US usually spends in the top 5 nations on education. So what do you have to complain about there? Yet, its real results are far less than the other 4 top nations. Far below. And this is DESPITE the fact that the US consistently ranks at or near the top in quality overall on just about every global education index. To hear people complain in the USA on the surface level seems mystifying, considering people in the other top nations don't complain nearly as much about their systems. They're PROUD of them. And most of them spend less too. People in USA complain because they KNOW their system is failing, despite what the rankings say. AND WHAT THE SPENDING INDICATES. The more we SPEND the worse we FAIL. Or at least, people think we fail.
According to the National Center for Educational Statistics (NCES), 21 percent of adults in the United States (about 43 million) fall into the illiterate/functionally illiterate category. Nearly two-thirds of fourth graders read below grade level, and the same number graduate from high school still reading below grade level. This puts the United States well behind several other countries in the world, including Japan, all the Scandinavian countries, Canada, the Republic of Korea, and the UK. By ranking of the last UNESCO survey of 2015, this puts the USA right DOWN AT THE BOTTOM of the world for literacy. The WORST country in 2015 was South Sudan, with a 27 percent illiteracy rate.
In 2019, the top 15 countries in the world for literacy were not the top 15 on GDP or spending as a percentage of GDP. Far from it. Some of them are among the poorest.
It cost absolutely NOTHING to teach a child to read. ATTITUDE is 99 percent of the job. American are NOT serious about education, because they aren't serious about reading first off. They think of it more as day care. They like to TALK about it. Talk talk talk. And most of the talk is COMPLAINING.
To be fair, the U.S. has a less homogeneous population than those other countries. The U.S. is about the only country that is trying integration. It's a messy but worthwhile process, but will yield lower average scores and worse metrics on health. It's just the way it is.
This travesty of learning is occurring even in New York City, which is not nearly as deranged as Baltimore. See "Remote" Zoom Learning - Drug Deals or Academics? Rap videos about drug deals are part of the Zoom education.
To be fair, the U.S. has a less homogeneous population than those other countries. The U.S. is about the only country that is trying integration. It's a messy but worthwhile process, but will yield lower average scores and worse metrics on health. It's just the way it is.
According to the National Center for Educational Statistics (NCES), 21 percent of adults in the United States (about 43 million) fall into the illiterate/functionally illiterate category. Nearly two-thirds of fourth graders read below grade level, and the same number graduate from high school still reading below grade level. This puts the United States well behind several other countries in the world, including Japan, all the Scandinavian countries, Canada, the Republic of Korea, and the UK. By ranking of the last UNESCO survey of 2015, this puts the USA right DOWN AT THE BOTTOM of the world for literacy. The WORST country in 2015 was South Sudan, with a 27 percent illiteracy rate.
The US has issues around literacy, but you're conflating a bunch of different things here.
That NCES measure is not the same measure being used to compare literacy rates internationally. By the measures used by groups like the World Bank and UNESCO, the US is up in the 99% percentile in line with other developed nations.
NCES is including the functionally illiterate in their measure, which is people who can decode the written word, but seriously struggle to do useful tasks with it, such as filling out job applications or following instructions. (I believe the NCES figure is also specifically of literacy IN ENGLISH, when the US is a multilingual country. Many of these people are probably literate in their own first languages.) One should also note that many of the people cited in NCES's figure are not necessarily products of the American education system, given the US's comparatively high immigration (both legal and extralegal) rate. Something like 1/6th of the US's population is foreign-born.
I would also note that while this does not excuse the ills of US education, the US has some particular challenges with regard to literacy compared to other high-ranking countries, even besides our huge wealth and education disparities within society. The English language itself is a mess, for one thing. In most Slavic countries, orthography reforms brought the written language into line with the spoken language back in the early 1900s. This is not a major problem for the majority of the population, but for those who have exceptionalities that make literacy more challenging, such as dyslexia, it can be enough to tip the scales. Language in the US is much, much less homogenous than other highly literate countries, which presents obvious literacy instruction challenges. The US is also attempting actually universal public education, so we include kids who in many other countries would probably not be included in school standardized testing data - kids who in many cases wouldn't even be attending mainstream schools.
Some public schools fail, some charter schools fail. The same is true of success. I am not a member of any union, let alone a teacher's union.
Public schools are far from perfect, but even given their deficiencies, they have benefits that far outweigh those of privatized schools. Teacher turnover is lower in public schools. Public schools are the heart of their communities. Many public schools offer lots of choices for classes and many are open late and open on weekends so that children can have a safe place to hang out.
Charter schools often close without a moments notice. Public schools cannot do that.
Some public schools fail, some charter schools fail. The same is true of success. I am not a member of any union, let alone a teacher's union.
Public schools are far from perfect, but even given their deficiencies, they have benefits that far outweigh those of privatized schools. Teacher turnover is lower in public schools. Public schools are the heart of their communities. Many public schools offer lots of choices for classes and many are open late and open on weekends so that children can have a safe place to hang out.
Charter schools often close without a moments notice. Public schools cannot do that.
Did you really say, "Teacher turnover is lower in public schools" ?
Now its my turn: Where is your critical thinking cap or are you just playing games?
Of COURSE public schools have lower turner--they have tenure-- they stay too d@mn long (thanks, Unions!).
Its hard to believe you count that as a pro for public schools.
What bubble are you living in?
And given the state of our kids' education via public schools, I think their "heart" as you put it needs a bypass.
Public school teachers stay longer because they have better salaries and better working conditions. Have you actually worked in any charter schools? There is no job security at a charter school. Teachers in charter schools work very hard to collect mounds of data that have nothing to do with teaching the students. Charter schools are run by corporations, who goal is the make the most profit possible and their products are the students. Some teachers in charter schools are good, but many have limited experience and knowledge about how to teach. Many leave not only the charter schools, but the profession of teaching entirely.
The problem is that *most* charter schools are NOT helping kids. Some are, but a lot are not. Far too many are cash cows for hedge fund investors. Fraud and corruption are the norm. When charter schools overtly, or even unconsciously, urge students to leave – for instance, by not offering services for special education students or English language learners – they send those students back to traditional public schools. They Drain resources from struggling districts.
Mother of three VERY successfully educated children, in a very rigorous neighborhood school system ladder
P.S., I still don't understand why you're using this thread, about a criminally abysmal charter school, to advocate for charter schools.
Agreed. My son got an excellent education in our school district, as did every other neighborhood kid that I knew.
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