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Old 07-08-2023, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
10,004 posts, read 7,145,779 times
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I think a mistake people make is thinking that people who are not good at college skills are automatically good at trade skills.

If some kid fails out of high school or college because he didn't try or couldn't do it, is he going to succeed at a trade that takes a lot of commitment and skill to do well?
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Old 07-08-2023, 11:51 AM
 
Location: NMB, SC
41,746 posts, read 17,322,982 times
Reputation: 34211
Quote:
Originally Posted by redguard57 View Post
I think a mistake people make is thinking that people who are not good at college skills are automatically good at trade skills.

If some kid fails out of high school or college because he didn't try or couldn't do it, is he going to succeed at a trade that takes a lot of commitment and skill to do well?
Nearly 40% of student loan borrowers dropped out of college.
No skills and saddled with debt.....not a great way to start off adult life.
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Old 07-08-2023, 11:58 AM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
10,004 posts, read 7,145,779 times
Reputation: 17096
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
Nearly 40% of student loan borrowers dropped out of college.
No skills and saddled with debt.....not a great way to start off adult life.
For lots of reasons, many of which would be similar barriers to holding a demanding job regardless of education requirements.

I suppose if you "fail" at a trade the worst that happens is you don't have a job anymore. So there's that.

My point was, the trades aren't easy. Every successful tradesperson I've known was a generally competent person with skill and wherewithal.
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Old 07-08-2023, 12:05 PM
 
11,409 posts, read 7,726,965 times
Reputation: 21907
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
Nearly 40% of student loan borrowers dropped out of college.
No skills and saddled with debt.....not a great way to start off adult life.
That certainly makes starting out harder, but at least the average debt of those who do not complete a degree is under 14k. It’s a chunk of money, but not an insurmountable amount of debt.
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Old 07-08-2023, 12:09 PM
 
11,409 posts, read 7,726,965 times
Reputation: 21907
Quote:
Originally Posted by redguard57 View Post
For lots of reasons, many of which would be similar barriers to holding a demanding job regardless of education requirements.

I suppose if you "fail" at a trade the worst that happens is you don't have a job anymore. So there's that.

My point was, the trades aren't easy. Every successful tradesperson I've known was a generally competent person with skill and wherewithal.
Depends on where you’re getting trained for a trade. Certification programs for auto mechanics cost 10-25k. A coworker was shocked her son couldn’t get a job at an auto repair shop as an apprentice and instead had to spend 2 years and about 20k to get the certifications needed to get hired. Maybe that differs in other places, but that’s the norm where I live.
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Old 07-08-2023, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,193 posts, read 23,824,373 times
Reputation: 32581
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
USG has data as of 2021

https://www.census.gov/newsroom/pres...ttainment.html

8.9% had less than a high school diploma or equivalent.
27.9% had high school graduate as their highest level of school completed.
14.9% had completed some college but not a degree.
10.5% had an associate degree as their highest level of school completed.
23.5% had a bachelor’s degree as their highest degree.
14.4% had completed an advanced degree such as a master’s degree, professional degree or doctoral degree.
My point wasn't there was data available, but rather that mostly what has been posted in this thread is pure opinion. Nothing wrong with that...except where some posters state their opinion as fact.
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Old 07-08-2023, 12:30 PM
 
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,576 posts, read 57,515,730 times
Reputation: 45967
Quote:
Originally Posted by redguard57 View Post
I think a mistake people make is thinking that people who are not good at college skills are automatically good at trade skills.

If some kid fails out of high school or college because he didn't try or couldn't do it, is he going to succeed at a trade that takes a lot of commitment and skill to do well?
or the mistake (common here)

College is a better path (personally, pay or skillset, Quality of life, or community contribution)
College grad could have made the alternative choice to develop a skilled trade (unlikely)
College is of value (+/-)

or...
Skilled trades is a better path (?) How many in skilled trades successes have time or interest to comment on a EDU forum populated by those having to justify their existance and value? (because they spent the time and money to go to college)

Or... that everone has the choice;
Skilled trade > College > Grunt

Many (if not most) do not have much of a choice. Their path is not optional.
Ironically. They succeed!

Congrats to those!
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Old 07-08-2023, 01:20 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,193 posts, read 23,824,373 times
Reputation: 32581
Quote:
Originally Posted by StealthRabbit View Post
or the mistake (common here)

College is a better path (personally, pay or skillset, Quality of life, or community contribution)
College grad could have made the alternative choice to develop a skilled trade (unlikely)
College is of value (+/-)

or...
Skilled trades is a better path (?) How many in skilled trades successes have time or interest to comment on a EDU forum populated by those having to justify their existance and value? (because they spent the time and money to go to college)

Or... that everone has the choice;
Skilled trade > College > Grunt

Many (if not most) do not have much of a choice. Their path is not optional.
Ironically. They succeed!

Congrats to those!
I think you're a bit obsessed about this topic.
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Old 07-09-2023, 12:34 AM
 
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,576 posts, read 57,515,730 times
Reputation: 45967
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
I think you're a bit obsessed about this topic.
or to add relevant content to this subject:
Quote:
If the trades are such great jobs, then why isn’t trade school more heavily promoted ?
I work, hire, and educate in Skilled trades, and in college STEM grads.

I am educated and experienced in each, and stay engaged daily.

Just came in from the shop from doing a skilled trade procedure for a neighbor that he could not find a business capable or willing of doing.

Helped a tenant hire an engineer and architect this week.

Spent time reviewing a curriculum for a skilled trades program.

Assisted in a Green Card application for both STEM person and a skilled trade (that is no longer available to hire in the USA labor force).

just normal stuff for me.

I don't need to ask or insinuate other poster's comments. They are self evident (and incriminating for those who know anything about skilled trades careers, employment and training.)

Try to make each post have something of value to a potential reader who is seeking information.
That's how public forums work and stimulate thoughts and conversation and provide resources (and value) to readers.
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Old 07-09-2023, 10:48 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,193 posts, read 23,824,373 times
Reputation: 32581
Quote:
Originally Posted by StealthRabbit View Post
or to add relevant content to this subject:


I work, hire, and educate in Skilled trades, and in college STEM grads.

I am educated and experienced in each, and stay engaged daily.

Just came in from the shop from doing a skilled trade procedure for a neighbor that he could not find a business capable or willing of doing.

Helped a tenant hire an engineer and architect this week.

Spent time reviewing a curriculum for a skilled trades program.

Assisted in a Green Card application for both STEM person and a skilled trade (that is no longer available to hire in the USA labor force).

just normal stuff for me.

I don't need to ask or insinuate other poster's comments. They are self evident (and incriminating for those who know anything about skilled trades careers, employment and training.)

Try to make each post have something of value to a potential reader who is seeking information.
That's how public forums work and stimulate thoughts and conversation and provide resources (and value) to readers.
Yes, but we all tend to be repetitive, at least sometimes.
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