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Old 11-14-2023, 01:58 PM
 
Location: Sunnybrook Farm
4,314 posts, read 2,490,031 times
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I guess I don't see why this is so "hard".

Parents and students will whine for a while. That's what they do.

The rule is: no cell phones on campus during instructional hours. Put in the locker, or check them in at the office, or otherwise if found they'll be confiscated, placed in the office, where you can pick the phone up after classes end.
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Old 11-14-2023, 02:11 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,040 posts, read 60,063,169 times
Reputation: 60604
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbit33 View Post
I guess I don't see why this is so "hard".

Parents and students will whine for a while. That's what they do.

The rule is: no cell phones on campus during instructional hours. Put in the locker, or check them in at the office, or otherwise if found they'll be confiscated, placed in the office, where you can pick the phone up after classes end.
This is why:
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/educati...bans-at-school
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Old 11-14-2023, 02:54 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,345 posts, read 23,925,697 times
Reputation: 32633
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
lol..I was at one school where an additional "check" was made...for gang colors or gang tattoos showing.
This was middle school
That brought back a memory of when I was a vice principal.

The two vice principals each had one grade level for discipline. One day the principal said to me, "You're going to have to suspend Marlon. He's wearing a gang kerchief on his belt." So I went up to check Marlon in Mrs. Dolt's class (the names have been changed to protect the guilty). I went back to the principal and asked, "So are we going to suspend everyone with that particular style of kerchief?" "Yes we are". "Follow me". I led the principal back to Mrs. Dolt's class and said quietly, "Take a look at the kerchief Mrs. Dolt is wearing as an accessory".
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Old 11-14-2023, 05:07 PM
 
4,359 posts, read 4,202,661 times
Reputation: 5800
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
That brought back a memory of when I was a vice principal.

The two vice principals each had one grade level for discipline. One day the principal said to me, "You're going to have to suspend Marlon. He's wearing a gang kerchief on his belt." So I went up to check Marlon in Mrs. Dolt's class (the names have been changed to protect the guilty). I went back to the principal and asked, "So are we going to suspend everyone with that particular style of kerchief?" "Yes we are". "Follow me". I led the principal back to Mrs. Dolt's class and said quietly, "Take a look at the kerchief Mrs. Dolt is wearing as an accessory".
It's crazy all the ways that colors can be displayed. Some are very subtle. I used to have to take all the red and blue construction paper out of the packets before we could do a class project. I'd have to tell students to put stickers over the drawings they drew on their folders. And I would have to point out to new staff members things like wearing one sleeve/pants leg rolled up, left or right, and other signals that students would use. I would just tell the students to make their sleeves match. It was almost impossible to police every handshake or hand sign thrown. The sheer level of intensity that being observant requires adds another level of stress onto the insane levels that go with working in a challenging setting.
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Old 11-14-2023, 05:49 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,040 posts, read 60,063,169 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lhpartridge View Post
It's crazy all the ways that colors can be displayed. Some are very subtle. I used to have to take all the red and blue construction paper out of the packets before we could do a class project. I'd have to tell students to put stickers over the drawings they drew on their folders. And I would have to point out to new staff members things like wearing one sleeve/pants leg rolled up, left or right, and other signals that students would use. I would just tell the students to make their sleeves match. It was almost impossible to police every handshake or hand sign thrown. The sheer level of intensity that being observant requires adds another level of stress onto the insane levels that go with working in a challenging setting.
Yeah, most commenters have no clue.

Oh, don't forget that a red/blue bandanna wrapped around the left leg meant a member of a different crew than one wrapped around the right leg.

We were fortunate that we mostly had wannabes at the school I spent most of my career at. As one of the (really good) Principals said at an assembly, "You can't be much of a gangbanger when you live in a half million dollar house and your mommy drops you off at school in an E-Class Benz".
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Old 11-14-2023, 06:34 PM
 
4,359 posts, read 4,202,661 times
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Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Yeah, most commenters have no clue.

Oh, don't forget that a red/blue bandanna wrapped around the left leg meant a member of a different crew than one wrapped around the right leg.

We were fortunate that we mostly had wannabes at the school I spent most of my career at. As one of the (really good) Principals said at an assembly, "You can't be much of a gangbanger when you live in a half million dollar house and your mommy drops you off at school in an E-Class Benz".
We, unfortunately, had the real thing. Also generational. No bandanas were allowed. That was one of the easiest calls. The eyebrows with stripes shaved only on one side was the most problematic. No way to fix that.

The only ones with nice cars were the dope boys. Homes in our neighborhood sold for between $12,000 and $40,000 for a shotgun house.

I remember the days before cell phones when only the dope boys had pagers. Things were a lot worse then in some ways and better in others. There is still a high crime rate, including murder. Now, the neighborhoods are all hollowed out from fires and abandonment. Nearly everyone who could have left has left.

The district is about to close over a dozen schools due to the drop in enrollment. It was nearly 60,000 back in the 80s. I think it is barely over 20,000 now, if not less. I can't see the slide in enrollment easing anytime soon. This district has greater issues than just cell phone use by students, although that is a huge problem.
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Old 11-14-2023, 06:34 PM
 
18,494 posts, read 15,471,998 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere View Post
So "mob rule"? Seems to me the school can make its own rules without the majority of kids OR parents agreeing with it, but I haven't read the whole thread.
The school can make such a rule, but having too many unenforced rules can actually send the message that you can ignore whichever rules aren't convenient. It's the same problem as having too many laws that everyone ignores.

The other approach is to make a rule and then (attempt to) enforce it. If most of the students comply, then enforcement can be handled more easily. But if half of the student body just blatantly ignores the rule, how much time do you want teachers to spend on trying to crack down, and how many school aides, etc. do you want to hire to try to "fight" the trend? Finally, is it worth giving students a disciplinary record if they are otherwise good students?
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Old 11-14-2023, 07:15 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,345 posts, read 23,925,697 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Yeah, most commenters have no clue.

Oh, don't forget that a red/blue bandanna wrapped around the left leg meant a member of a different crew than one wrapped around the right leg.

We were fortunate that we mostly had wannabes at the school I spent most of my career at. As one of the (really good) Principals said at an assembly, "You can't be much of a gangbanger when you live in a half million dollar house and your mommy drops you off at school in an E-Class Benz".
I had one of our Latino students come up to me one day and ask to speak with me privately. Always seemed like a good kid. Wanted to know if I could help him get out of a gang. I said I couldn't, but I knew who the country worked with on exactly that, and that I would have that person at the school the following morning. I asked him what he thought he had to do. He said Russian roulette. He promised me he would wait. The next morning I called him down and he said he had gotten out the previous night. "What did you have to do?" "Mr. Victor, you don't want to know".

But I do have to say that sometimes they surprise you. One day leading up to Christmas I was at the local mall and had sat down to combine some packages. I saw one of our very few true gang members (so identified by the local police/fed task force) coming down the mall with an older friend. The kid had always seemed sleazy, but didn't really cause problems at school. When he saw me, he came over, very politely introduced me to his 'friend' (clearly a gang member), and they stood and chatted very nicely with me for about five minutes and then moved on. I couldn't help but think that there were quite a few of our rich white kids who wouldn't have been half as courteous. You never know.
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Old 11-14-2023, 07:19 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,345 posts, read 23,925,697 times
Reputation: 32633
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
The school can make such a rule, but having too many unenforced rules can actually send the message that you can ignore whichever rules aren't convenient. It's the same problem as having too many laws that everyone ignores.

The other approach is to make a rule and then (attempt to) enforce it. If most of the students comply, then enforcement can be handled more easily. But if half of the student body just blatantly ignores the rule, how much time do you want teachers to spend on trying to crack down, and how many school aides, etc. do you want to hire to try to "fight" the trend? Finally, is it worth giving students a disciplinary record if they are otherwise good students?
I've never forgotten something that happened in my high school when I was a junior. This was back in the late 1960s, and our school got a regular allotment of powdered eggs from some federal government food surplus program. So about once a week, one of the lunches would be scrambled eggs and sausage. Trouble was, the eggs were green. So the next time that was on the menu, the student body had bonded together -- and somehow not one kid snitched the plan. That Wednesday, instead of the roughly 750 student lunch sales for a typical day, the total number of sales was...zero. And 750 lunches had to be tossed in the garbage. Guess what...the powdered eggs never showed up again.

If students want to play hardball, they can, and that is often underestimated.
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Old 11-15-2023, 09:09 AM
 
3,570 posts, read 1,545,331 times
Reputation: 5024
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbit33 View Post
I guess I don't see why this is so "hard".

Parents and students will whine for a while. That's what they do.

The rule is: no cell phones on campus during instructional hours. Put in the locker, or check them in at the office, or otherwise if found they'll be confiscated, placed in the office, where you can pick the phone up after classes end.
I'm promoting the exact opposite. Phones are to be encouraged during instruction for the purpose of video/audio recording any instruction/teacher. And only used for this purpose. So the student has a copy of class instruction for study/review purposes. Optional for the student.

You can't use your phone if it disrupts class, or distracts you from participating in class.

Put a large message on a poster in class:
"Phones Must Be Silenced During Class
Phones Can Not Be Used For Calls, Messaging, or Entertainment During Class."
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