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Old 01-31-2024, 02:38 PM
 
Location: Honolulu/DMV Area/NYC
30,457 posts, read 17,882,071 times
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I was taking Ki-Swahili in college. Cheating was rampant among the students (this was an Ivy League school, too). I reported it to the professor when we were having a one-on-one and discussing what we had learned. I think I was the only one who got an A+ in the class. It wasn't because I was a language master or got the best grades, but more to do with the point that the professor thought I actually had a better grasp on the material than others, despite some of them having higher grades than me.

It was also well-known that fraternities kept banks of old exams for their members to study off of, which provided many with unfair advantages as many professors kept their exams the same year after year.
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Old 01-31-2024, 02:46 PM
 
3,223 posts, read 3,508,243 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lhpartridge View Post
I didn't study or cheat in high school. My philosophy was that I wanted to see how much I knew from just reading the book, paying attention in class, and taking notes. I would look over my notes for the previous day before the current day's lesson started, but not usually before a test because that would jumble up what I already knew. In my mind, studying would alter what I had learned "naturally." I usually had an A or a high B, mostly because the work was just easy for me. I may have decided to study if my grades were lower, but it was never necessary. By my senior year, I was only going to school two or three days a week because that was all I needed to do to keep an A average. (In Mississippi, compulsory attendance went out with integration and wasn't re-instated until the late 1980s, well after I started teaching school.)

I did let someone cheat off me once on a US History test in 11th grade. We both missed the same question, which tipped off the teacher. He gave us the option to retest. I made a 100 the second time, as I got the question right that I had missed earlier on my first attempt. The other student got a 48. I had known that people talked about flunking tests, but I always thought that meant that they just didn't do very well. I didn't realize that they really failed the tests. I learned something that day.
That's studying. You were just doing it proactively instead of trying to cram/refresh it before the test.

I had a Calculus teacher in high school whose suggestion was that every night, you review all of the content you had learned up to that point in the class. His idea was you would review it so much that eventually you wouldn't need to review the older stuff at all because it would already be ingrained in your head. being know it all high school students we ignored the recommendation, but looking back it has a great deal of merit.
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Old 01-31-2024, 05:37 PM
 
Location: Sioux Falls, SD area
4,817 posts, read 6,823,738 times
Reputation: 10078
Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident View Post
I was taking Ki-Swahili in college. Cheating was rampant among the students (this was an Ivy League school, too). I reported it to the professor when we were having a one-on-one and discussing what we had learned. I think I was the only one who got an A+ in the class. It wasn't because I was a language master or got the best grades, but more to do with the point that the professor thought I actually had a better grasp on the material than others, despite some of them having higher grades than me.

It was also well-known that fraternities kept banks of old exams for their members to study off of, which provided many with unfair advantages as many professors kept their exams the same year after year.
Very true. The business school fraternity @ the college I attended had a complete library. I wasn't a frat guy no matter whether it was the B-School frat or one of the many social frats. Yet, my study bunch was mostly in the fraternity, so I usually had access to these tests as well. Depending on the class, they often were invaluable. You had to be careful though because the professors would change a word or two making the answer totally different. It WAS an unfair disadvantage for those who never had them. My study buddies were more than happy to let me have access to them since my notes were usually more complete than any of there's, so they would often photocopy them. I often taped lectures and re-did my notes. I put the time in. My ability to print legibly even now looks almost typed.

Was this cheating? I suppose it depends on your definition.
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Old 01-31-2024, 06:12 PM
 
Location: Argentina
123 posts, read 19,926 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clevergirl67 View Post
You aren't making your people look very well.

To think that the people of Latin America are "my people" would be like interpreting that the people of Europe are "the people" of some Spaniard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mitsguy2001 View Post
Also, they were likely under extreme pressure to get good grades.

I think students cheat due to a combination of too much pressure to get good grades, and exams or grading practices that they (rightly or wrongly) perceive as unfair. I am not defending the students who cheat, since 2 wrongs don't make a right.
That was exactly my argument. I perceived that as unfair. In case I was caught (although it never happened), I had already thought about my defense, in case it was necessary, and I really believed that I had the right on my side. Who can memorize that many formulas? Don't professionals turn to books?
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Old 01-31-2024, 06:22 PM
 
Location: Argentina
123 posts, read 19,926 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Marcinkiewicz View Post

To the OP: congrats on being the reigning World Cup champs! I've been a soccer fan my entire life, and a participant for most of it...
Thank you! We are also first in the world in inflation with a record 200% per year. But the latter is by no means a source of pride, of course.
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Old 01-31-2024, 06:37 PM
 
Location: Argentina
123 posts, read 19,926 times
Reputation: 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by mitsguy2001 View Post
Valid questions would be, is there more pressure in Latin America to get good grades, or are the stakes higher (maybe less of a safety net)? Or, is the penalty for being caught cheating generally milder in Latin America? Or, is what's considered cheating in the US more culturally accepted in Latin America? I have heard that things that would be considered a bribe in the US are acceptable in Latin America, so maybe something similar is going on?
You can't really put all of Latin America in one bag.
There are many differences from country to country, from city to city, or even from school to school.
But what I can tell you, at least in my experience as a student, was that there was a certain corporation among us. Kind of like teachers versus students. Reporting a student who was cheating was unthinkable. Something that would be considered high treason towards all students.

Last edited by Luis Antonio; 01-31-2024 at 06:48 PM..
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Old 01-31-2024, 07:55 PM
 
35,512 posts, read 17,680,674 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texasdiver View Post
I avoid cheating by making all my tests open-note. I let them use their hand-written notebooks and the tests are on Chromebooks in which I lock down the browser so they can only access the test and nothing else on the Chromebook until they are finished.

In the modern world, one can look up anything they want in a heartbeat. So I'm not so concerned about whether they have formulas memorized or vocabulary memorized. The more difficult thing that demonstrates you really understand the science is being able to decide HOW to solve a particular problem (what formula to use and how to set it up). Or how to apply a certain principle in biology to a new situation that you haven't seen before.

In the end what happens is the A students still get As, the C students still get Cs, and the F students still fail. But I don't stress about whether students are cheating.

Plus, it gives them a big incentive to take detailed notes and keep legible notebooks. The smart students figure out that it is far to their advantage to keep detailed and perfect notebooks which is what I want them to do in the first place. Since writing things down pencil to paper and doing detailed diagrams with colored pencils and such is one of the best ways to learn material.
Exactly. Teachers who allow open-note tests realize the main goal is to get the students to master the material. And master the process of working out problems. If the students carefully make notes that they know they can refer to (as is how real life works - at your job you aren't expected to fly solo with no resources) they're learning. And learning how best to succeed.
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Old 01-31-2024, 08:12 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
44,878 posts, read 59,858,372 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
Exactly. Teachers who allow open-note tests realize the main goal is to get the students to master the material. And master the process of working out problems. If the students carefully make notes that they know they can refer to (as is how real life works - at your job you aren't expected to fly solo with no resources) they're learning. And learning how best to succeed.
Here's the problem, at some point life, or your job, gives you a no notes test.

I've related before that towards the end of my career many kids, including some of the top ones, absolutely could not work independently, they'd been doing cooperative "learning" for so long they'd forgotten, or never learned, how to do something by themselves.

The downside to open note/book tests is that the ones that count, IB/AP/SAT/state tests, etc., aren't. Yes, aids like calculators are allowed for some of them (in fact the tests are designed with calculators in mind) but for most the students have to individually interpret the questions and structure the answers.
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Old 01-31-2024, 08:20 PM
 
15,457 posts, read 15,429,065 times
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I never cheated, I never knew anyone who cheated, and I have no idea how a machete enters into it.
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Old 01-31-2024, 08:29 PM
NCN
 
Location: NC/SC Border Patrol
21,656 posts, read 25,491,377 times
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No cheating for me. I once let a classmate copy my math homework because he had a sad story as to why he didn't have his done. Next day he wanted to copy my homework again. I told him "no." He ended up a district manager in a company you might know if I told you the name of it. I laughed because I realized he had been studying how to get others to do all the work for years. I guess we all have our special talents.
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