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Old 02-08-2024, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,797 posts, read 24,297,543 times
Reputation: 32935

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Quote:
Originally Posted by tgbwc View Post
Maybe we can address the fact that some are still referring to it as “gym class”.
I always found that there were 'physical education teachers' and that there were 'gym teachers'. Two slightly different species.
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Old 02-08-2024, 04:29 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,797 posts, read 24,297,543 times
Reputation: 32935
Quote:
Originally Posted by Threestep2 View Post
Would you be so kind to drop the hidden insult? Thank you.
Do you do any research on who offers such resources for students? Have you volunteered to teach life skills? Then you would know that you are generally dealing with students whose understanding of math is marginal and the attention span is that of a gnat. Why do I need to balance a check book when I pay by phone? Sew a button to a shirt, do laundry, cook a meal, ... . Not to forget - allow others their opinion.
Oh, it was hidden? My mistake.

Having worked with kids for 33 years, I'm quite aware of the variations in ability and experience.

Has anyone here stopped someone else from expressing their opinion. How is that accomplished?
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Old 02-08-2024, 05:21 PM
 
15,592 posts, read 15,665,527 times
Reputation: 21999
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
-High schools not offering many classes on the trades, driver's ed, or ANY skills on money management
-No classes on impulse control, self-discipline, conflict resolution, etc.
-University not offering job training or white-collar apprenticeships, forcing graduates into the catch-22 involving jobs and job experience (I'm sure you know exactly what I am talking about). Why?

Serious question.
Seems to me that most of those are things I'd consider the parents' task.

Since when would teachers be expected to teach impulse control? Unless you're thinking about 19th century schoolmasters who administered whippings? Colleges presumably offer school jobs - I had one - but it's not for them to provide apprenticeship. You learn job-training when you have a summer job.
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Old 02-08-2024, 06:12 PM
 
Location: North Dakota
10,350 posts, read 13,936,640 times
Reputation: 18267
Parents need to do their jobs and parent. The argument about two working parents is bull. Two working parents has been the norm for decades. Figure it out.

I'm impressed nobody has mentioned indoctrination or grooming. We have some rational people on this forum.
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Old 02-08-2024, 08:21 PM
 
Location: WA
5,442 posts, read 7,735,145 times
Reputation: 8554
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
I'm not disagreeing that those graduation standards are there; just trying to have a discussion if those are the most appropriate standards. Yes, we want students to be proficient; the question I'm asking is why does it take that many years to be proficient? What does "proficient" mean in this context? That's one of the discussions we need to have. From the point of view of a lot of us, adding more time isn't increasing proficiency. By the measures available, general proficiency seems to be going down, not up. That would say the current process isn't working and suggest a new process is needed.

I agree electives can be limiting. All I'm asking is why are we limiting the choice of electives available in so many schools? Why, for example, are art and music often required, but basic cooking and minor repairs not required? These are discussions we need to have about the goals of our education system. But it seems we can't.
Those conversations are happening ALL OF THE TIME within the world of educational administration and policy at much higher levels than the average teacher.

A lot of it is driven by people with vested interests like the massive test company conglomerates who have a vested interest in pushing standards and standardized testing and lots of high priced lobbyists in every state capital. I mean sure, knock yourself out. But when these sorts of policy issues come up in state legislatures every 10 years or so it is an absolute feeding frenzy of deep pocketed vested interests. Most of whom don't really care about the kids.
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Old 02-08-2024, 08:25 PM
 
Location: WA
5,442 posts, read 7,735,145 times
Reputation: 8554
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
I always found that there were 'physical education teachers' and that there were 'gym teachers'. Two slightly different species.
Is this 1962 California high school doing gym class or PE?

https://youtu.be/NGa6BPj3Mcw?si=oiWQVI6WH3w9IBlD
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Old 02-08-2024, 09:32 PM
 
2,064 posts, read 1,003,799 times
Reputation: 6225
^^ That video is nuts! Like military basic training. "The colors of the shorts the boys wear is determined by their ratings on performance charts..." Sadly that would open up a slew of legal issues nowadays. I'm not sure that would be beneficial to those who aren't athletically inclined or interested, which is probably one way how disgruntled school shooters are fomented.

As a side note, I didn't see one chubby or obese student in that video. I know it was a production film, but also representative of the general population at the time.
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Old 02-08-2024, 09:34 PM
 
7,789 posts, read 3,803,815 times
Reputation: 14709
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
Who are "you folks?"
Welcome to the club.

Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
People like you...
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Old 02-09-2024, 07:28 AM
 
12,846 posts, read 9,045,657 times
Reputation: 34914
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgbwc View Post
The title of this thread is, “Why do schools STILL not want to teach “life”?”. It is not, “Why do schools in my local area STILL not want to teach “life”?”. The original post is pretty broad in its coverage and I put it the same category as, “Schools don’t teach spelling” and “Schools don’t say the Pledge”. I posted to show that there are schools that do indeed still want to “teach life” and there are courses that address what the OP thinks should be covered. I know the number of offerings may be exemplary, but I’d be surprised if the schools completely lack any instruction in the trades or personal economics.
One way to understand and fix problems is to recognize that just because some schools do things wonderfully, does not mean all or even most. Rather what is the typical experience of the typical student around the country. Afterall consider the number of people who rate the quality of the school by the quality of the football team. Or the ones who consider their high school above average because they had a great social life and then graduated.

Look at how often here on CD someone describes an inner-city school in basically a war zone. But then extends that depiction to all kids at all schools. Or describes an excellent school and then extends that depiction to all kids at all schools. Two extremes. Most schools and most kids are somewhere in between. The education system can't fix the problems in the "war zone" schools. And they don't need to fix the top performing schools. Hence, I try to focus on the parts of the system that need to do better and where the problems can be fixed within the education system, if it wants to fix them.
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Old 02-09-2024, 07:37 AM
 
12,846 posts, read 9,045,657 times
Reputation: 34914
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
So you've been a member of these boards and committees and failed to move the needle. Sounds like you failed. Take responsibility. OR understand that your view of what education should be is not shared by others.
I know that my view isn't shared by most of those inside the education bureaucracy. As far moving the needle, it's moving slowly. Vo-Tech, or CTE, is increasing in popularity. When our current governor was elected that was one of his key points and the state board has changed policies to encourage rather than discourage it. Still don't have enough availability, but it is growing. Locally we've made some changes to the school board, but election cycles take time, and entrenched bureaucracies take time to change.

As said about science, change in education happens one funeral at a time. But I'm playing the infinite game here.
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