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Old 08-14-2009, 09:04 AM
 
Location: Washington, DC
605 posts, read 2,131,623 times
Reputation: 387

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Ouch. If I were 11/12, this would really sting. If the poster really is in 6th grade, it's ok that he/she writes this way on an informal forum.
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Old 07-27-2010, 11:57 AM
 
1 posts, read 6,909 times
Reputation: 15
I'm currently doing Kumon (level N), and I've only been in it for about 3 years or so, starting in the middle of 7th grade. I'm going into 11th grade, prepared for AP calculus, and had a near perfect math score on my PSATs as a 10th grader.

So, I do believe Kumon is not a waste of time or money and it's worth a try.
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Old 07-27-2010, 01:53 PM
 
Location: Bar Harbor, ME
1,922 posts, read 4,250,609 times
Reputation: 1299
Default not in best practices: no valid studies

As we try to upgrade our math programs in public school, we are required to use scientifically based programs that are researched. At the present time, there are no studies that validate Kumon as a best practice math program.

NCLB has made the use of programs that have no valid studies to back them: IMPOSSIBLE TO BE USED.

At the moment we are using Aimsweb©, and Connecting Math©.

See: Intervention: Kumon Math - Effectiveness and Program Description (http://ies.ed.gov/ncee/wwc/reports/elementary_math/kumon/ - broken link)

Zarathu
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Old 07-27-2010, 05:01 PM
 
Location: So Ca
25,899 posts, read 25,101,775 times
Reputation: 23496
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zarathu View Post
...we are required to use scientifically based programs that are researched. At the present time, there are no studies that validate Kumon as a best practice math program.
That doesn't mean that Kumon is not an effective program. Are you familiar with the program?
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Old 07-27-2010, 05:13 PM
 
Location: Bar Harbor, ME
1,922 posts, read 4,250,609 times
Reputation: 1299
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
That doesn't mean that Kumon is not an effective program. Are you familiar with the program?
It may or may not be an effective program.

However, because this is the education board, I am assuming rightly or wrongly that people here do at least occasionally want to know what professional educators have to say about the issues that are presented here.

Since I am a professional educator for almost 40 years, and since my family have been professional educators back more than 100 years, and since the level has run from the line level of school based mental health and teaching up through principals, superintendents, and even an uncle of mine who was Assistant Secretary of Education for Pennylvania, I do often comment.

The program may be very fine. Unforunately in an era of No Child Left Beyond laws, Average Yearly progress, and Race to the Top, public school cannot use programs to augment their progress toward AYP that cannot show that they have scientifically validating studies, not just anecdotal evidence.

Its unfortunate, but its the way it is. If someone has such evidence for this program, then I would like to see it, since we are in a continuous active search for math methods to augment our core program in mathematics.

Zarathu
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Old 07-29-2010, 09:29 AM
 
Location: In a house
13,250 posts, read 42,151,988 times
Reputation: 20198
But you don't have anything to say about the Kumon method. All you've said in your previous post, is that you and your family have all been educators, for 100 years. Surely in all this time, someone in your family must have heard of Kumon, and have an opinion about it? Or did you merely come here to tell everyone about how your family are all educators and that your school district can't support it because they haven't done any research to prove it's effective?

Even though it's been around since the 1950's, which is longer than you've been teaching. I haven't heard much about the Kumon method, but what little I have heard, seems pretty positive. That it is one of many possible excellent tools to enhance reading and math skills. Certainly not the only one, nor the defining one. But I wouldn't rule it out if I had a kid who needed help above and beyond what they could get in the classroom.
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Old 07-29-2010, 02:19 PM
 
Location: Bar Harbor, ME
1,922 posts, read 4,250,609 times
Reputation: 1299
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonChick View Post

Even though it's been around since the 1950's, which is longer than you've been teaching. I haven't heard much about the Kumon method, but what little I have heard, seems pretty positive. That it is one of many possible excellent tools to enhance reading and math skills. Certainly not the only one, nor the defining one. But I wouldn't rule it out if I had a kid who needed help above and beyond what they could get in the classroom.

MAYBE MY ANSWER ISN'T clear ENOUGH. How can I explain this so you will understand? I said in my previous post that there was no research available to prove that the program really works for more than a handful of kids. This is what I said: NO RESEARCH AVAILABLE...............

The following is the reason why most public schools WON'T AND CANNOT USE IT.

Schools have core programs that they use to teach everyone. These are standard programs which are research based. We are required to do this, because if we don't, when a child fails to make progress, or the building fails to make AYP, we have no leg to stand on with the regulating body of state government. These things are audited by various departments of the State department of education regularly.

Due to your Federal Government's laws which have been passed under the federal law called NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND, we are required(at least in PA) to make some kind of determination whether the child has received appropriate instruction. We are unable to have the child evaluated and placed in any special education program unless the child receives a supplemental program in addition to the core program that is research based.

We don't choose to use you tax payer money on programs which only have somebody's good word behind them. There must be research to show that they work. If there is none, then most public schools, because of the laws like Race to the Top and NCLB, will not touch them with a ten foot pole. Additionally, administration must also show the board of education that the $16000 they spent for some new math program has research to show that it works with a very great number of kids.

There actually are high level repetition math programs out there, one is called Connecting Math©, which are scripted just like Kumon is described, AND WHICH HAS RESEARCH TO SHOW THAT IT ACTUALLY DOES WORK. I've actually seen it work in classroom settings.

If you cannot understand that, then there is nothing else I can tell you. DID YOU EVEN BOTHER TO READ THIS: http://ies.ed.gov/ncee/wwc/reports/e...on/Description

We don't waste taxpayer money on things that haven't been shown by research to work. Would you have it any other way?

Companies that haven't such research probably couldn't get it. Its not that hard to do, nor is it expensive. Most Universities will do it for free or almost. Its not hard to find a Masters or Doctoral student interested in researching it.

Z

Last edited by Zarathu; 07-29-2010 at 02:32 PM..
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Old 07-29-2010, 02:51 PM
 
1,428 posts, read 3,111,747 times
Reputation: 1475
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs. 14th & You View Post
Ouch. If I were 11/12, this would really sting. If the poster really is in 6th grade, it's ok that he/she writes this way on an informal forum.
With all due respect, Mrs. 14th, I don't find it acceptable even in an informal forum. I think it is inconsiderate to other posters to force them to decode textspeak, but I also believe that a tolerant acceptance of textspeak anywhere besides in a text message normalizes and reinforces incorrect punctuation and capitalization as well as nonstandard English.
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Old 07-29-2010, 03:41 PM
 
Location: Bar Harbor, ME
1,922 posts, read 4,250,609 times
Reputation: 1299
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
That doesn't mean that Kumon is not an effective program. Are you familiar with the program?
Yes.... In the real world of education, THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT IT MEANS. Getting research validation for your program is what everybody does.

Failure to have a research proof that it works makes it doubtful that it works for more than just a few kids here and there.

z
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Old 07-29-2010, 05:24 PM
 
13,222 posts, read 32,792,268 times
Reputation: 8029
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stone28 View Post
I am wondering if anyone has any first hand experience with a kumon school. How much did it cost? Was it worth the money? Can it be done at home? What age were the students that attended?

Here's a link.

Kumon North America
Back on topic please. Note that the OP is asking about personal experience, not using Kumon in schools.
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