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Old 04-15-2010, 01:47 PM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,795 posts, read 7,250,635 times
Reputation: 5194

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In my area teachers only work 160 days, (2+ mos. off in summer, and 2 weeks off both Christmas and spring break) that is 100 days less per year and 2 hrs less per day that a 40hr per wk employee. I do not know anyone anymore who is a 40hr a week employee. Personally I am now working 55 hrs a week, six days. Stop whining, you are working part time, and you get paid full time + benefits and very generous retirement. You are lucky you are not being paid by your results considering the test scores and knowledge base of the students in this country.
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Old 04-15-2010, 03:44 PM
 
2,605 posts, read 4,669,667 times
Reputation: 2194
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
You are lucky you are not being paid by your results considering the test scores and knowledge base of the students in this country.
Good point. If teachers were paid commensurate with performance (how much the student actually learns), they would be working nearly for free.

Those who think they're doing such a bangup job only have to take a look at student test performance and results.

If teachers were fired for job performance like everybody else, maybe they would finally EARN what they get.

Oh, wait... It isn't THEIR fault kids don't learn. It's the PARENTS. Teachers complain that they have the kids more hours every day than parents do, yet they blame poor student performance in school on the parents.
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Old 04-15-2010, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Northern Virginia
4,489 posts, read 10,892,151 times
Reputation: 3697
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoExcuses View Post
Good point. If teachers were paid commensurate with performance (how much the student actually learns), they would be working nearly for free.

Those who think they're doing such a bangup job only have to take a look at student test performance and results.

If teachers were fired for job performance like everybody else, maybe they would finally EARN what they get.

Oh, wait... It isn't THEIR fault kids don't learn. It's the PARENTS. Teachers complain that they have the kids more hours every day than parents do, yet they blame poor student performance in school on the parents.
If businesses weren't allowed to fire their poorly performing employees, I'd hazard a guess that their bottom lines would fall off too. If teachers could hand pick the students they wanted to teach they way businesses get to select employees, I'd be more likely to agree with you.

I've been doing observation hours in a middle school for the past month. These kids come to school hungry, sleep deprived, late...they "lose" their homework, don't have a pencil to complete worksheets, and of a class of 30, only 4 parents signed their child's reading logs for the week acknowledging that they were aware of the assignment and would help make sure their kid spent some time each evening reading.

How is any of that the teacher's fault?

There are some horrible teachers out there (I observed a math teacher last month who just couldn't handle more than 2 or 3 kids at a time, and ignored the rest--he was BAD), but most of them are doing everything within their power to reach these kids who come from all walks of life and all situations.
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Old 04-15-2010, 04:23 PM
 
6,293 posts, read 10,520,253 times
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I don't get a lunch break. I have to eat with my students.
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Old 04-15-2010, 05:17 PM
 
9,803 posts, read 16,092,532 times
Reputation: 8265
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliTerp07 View Post
If businesses weren't allowed to fire their poorly performing employees, I'd hazard a guess that their bottom lines would fall off too. If teachers could hand pick the students they wanted to teach they way businesses get to select employees, I'd be more likely to agree with you.

I've been doing observation hours in a middle school for the past month. These kids come to school hungry, sleep deprived, late...they "lose" their homework, don't have a pencil to complete worksheets, and of a class of 30, only 4 parents signed their child's reading logs for the week acknowledging that they were aware of the assignment and would help make sure their kid spent some time each evening reading.

How is any of that the teacher's fault?

There are some horrible teachers out there (I observed a math teacher last month who just couldn't handle more than 2 or 3 kids at a time, and ignored the rest--he was BAD), but most of them are doing everything within their power to reach these kids who come from all walks of life and all situations.

If one were to compare teachers to factory workers, here is a major difference.

The factory owner would insist that the raw product he starts out with is of good quality and be consistant.

If he was forced to accept whatever raw product gets shipped to him and he had no control or recourse over the raw product, he would not succeed.
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Old 04-15-2010, 05:26 PM
 
Location: Destrehan, Louisiana
2,189 posts, read 7,026,481 times
Reputation: 3636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spazkat9696 View Post
I don't get a lunch break. I have to eat with my students.

I don't get a lunch break either. I have to pickup materials for the job I'm working on. I also have to work nights, weekends, holidays, etc. in order to complete remodeling projects as fast as possible.

And most people complain about how much it cost thinking I'm keeping every penny they pay me.


busta
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Old 04-15-2010, 06:59 PM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,613,266 times
Reputation: 20851
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
In my area teachers only work 160 days, (2+ mos. off in summer, and 2 weeks off both Christmas and spring break) that is 100 days less per year and 2 hrs less per day that a 40hr per wk employee. I do not know anyone anymore who is a 40hr a week employee. Personally I am now working 55 hrs a week, six days. Stop whining, you are working part time, and you get paid full time + benefits and very generous retirement. You are lucky you are not being paid by your results considering the test scores and knowledge base of the students in this country.
1. I work 10 months a year and get paid for 10 months.

2. I work from 7:30 am to 3:30 pm. (NO PREP! 20 min for lunch)

3. I tutor, mentor, coach, etc 3 days a week until 5:00 pm for which I am NOT PAID. In the summers I mentor student research, prepare kids for the SAT IIs and take students to symposiums all UNPAID.

4. I teach in the NUMBER FOUR PUBLIC SCHOOL IN THE COUNTRY. My students regularly go to the ivy league, get perfect SAT scores, have published research so if we are going by results how much should I get?

The irony is my students are amazingly gifted so I am as responsible for their success as I would be failures in a non-academy public school. Education is a joint venture between teachers, students, parents and staff. All of them are needed for success yet any single one can cause failure. Just something to keep in mind.
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Old 04-15-2010, 07:02 PM
 
Location: Suburbia
8,781 posts, read 15,216,960 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoExcuses View Post
Good point. If teachers were paid commensurate with performance (how much the student actually learns), they would be working nearly for free.
They couldn't afford it. I'd be very wealthy. They perform very well on tests and are usually motivated in the classroom. My students come to me with a lot of background knowledge, two parent households, and parental support.
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Old 04-16-2010, 07:22 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,371,980 times
Reputation: 14691
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
In my area teachers only work 160 days, (2+ mos. off in summer, and 2 weeks off both Christmas and spring break) that is 100 days less per year and 2 hrs less per day that a 40hr per wk employee. I do not know anyone anymore who is a 40hr a week employee. Personally I am now working 55 hrs a week, six days. Stop whining, you are working part time, and you get paid full time + benefits and very generous retirement. You are lucky you are not being paid by your results considering the test scores and knowledge base of the students in this country.
Only if that 40 hour a week employee has no holidays or vacation time off. I see you took creative debat math 101 Most people have a couple of weeks vacation and a few holidays off per year. I don't know a single person who works 260 days per year who isn't working a lot more than 40 hours a week. (Just taking weekends off gets you down to 261 days)

Where are you located that the teachers work only 160 days per year? That would mean the students are only going to school about 140 days per year (Many of the days students are off are in service days for teachers). Honestly, I've never heard of a school year that short.

And no we don't get full time pay and generous retirement. I make 1/3 of what I did when I was an engineer and have no retirement now. Yes, some teachers are well paid with good retirement plans but not all of us enjoy those perks.
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Old 04-16-2010, 07:36 PM
 
Location: Maine
190 posts, read 464,037 times
Reputation: 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
In my area teachers only work 160 days, (2+ mos. off in summer, and 2 weeks off both Christmas and spring break) that is 100 days less per year and 2 hrs less per day that a 40hr per wk employee. I do not know anyone anymore who is a 40hr a week employee. Personally I am now working 55 hrs a week, six days. Stop whining, you are working part time, and you get paid full time + benefits and very generous retirement. You are lucky you are not being paid by your results considering the test scores and knowledge base of the students in this country.
do you really think teachers are done for the day as soon as that bell rings and do nothing work related on weekends and breaks? trust me they work just as much as the rest of us and they are extremily under paid. a bartender with 0 college dept makes more than most teachers do.
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