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Just curious but have you ever had a steak from Garufa's, Mi Piaci, 2900 or Dane's (all located in ELP)? They may not be AS great as Cattlemans but they're awesome nonetheless (just not as heavily advertised).
Just because this lifestyle may not appeal to you, does not make it "lame." But hey, everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
Danes is actually pretty good. You're right, it aint Cattlemans, but decent enough.
As for the lifestyle thing....anyone living in a city as large as EPTX that regularly does what i outlined is lame...period, point blank, end of story. Now i know that some things are subject to opinion, but i don't know anyone in their right mind ("right mind" being the operative words here) from a large metro area that thinks mall shopping and eating at chain restaurants represents a high quality of life. In EPTX, that DOES represent good living, and it seems to be the city pastime. That's just the truth. Folks there pride themselves on having the biggest SUV parked outside of the Cielo Vista Mall. That's El Pasoans in a nutshell.
Now that would be fine if we were talking about Odessa, but we're not. EPTX offers no more than Odessa or Midland does (except for even MORE chain restaurants, movie theaters, and shopping centers), and is a million times the size.
Again, EPTX is comparable in size to Tucson, and when you breakdown the comparison, it's shameful relative to what each city offers. The only win for EP is lower crime overall, and that's not enough to sell the city to me. Tucson is dynamic, EP is stagnant....even though its growing more rapidly (which isn't really a good thing, consider that they're just building more of the same stuff).
All that said, i love visiting EPTX if for nothing more than visiting my family there. I find that it's a good place to relax and chill....and enjoy some decent Mexican food. The End. It offers little else.
As for the lifestyle thing....anyone living in a city as large as EPTX that regularly does what i outlined is lame...period, point blank, end of story.
Fair enough. I don't believe 700,000 El Pasoans are living that lifestyle however.
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter
Now i know that some things are subject to opinion, but i don't know anyone in their right mind ("right mind" being the operative words here) from a large metro area that thinks mall shopping and eating at chain restaurants represents a high quality of life. In EPTX, that DOES represent good living, and it seems to be the city pastime. That's just the truth. Folks there pride themselves on having the biggest SUV parked outside of the Cielo Vista Mall. That's El Pasoans in a nutshell.
Is it though? Maybe that is the experience or lifestyle you, your friends, and your family live.
I am a life long El Pasoan yet I haven't been to Cielo Vista Mall in years. Entertainment, to me, isn't shopping capped off with a meal at a chain restaurant. I do drive a very big 4x4 truck though
Tucson is near Phoenix. While separate, it does impact the quality of life. Good for Tucson. El Paso isn't Tuscon, or San Diego, or Houston, or Manhattan. I mention those cities because we have threads like this before where someone from those cities blasted El Paso for not being comparable.
That is not to say El Paso is what you are saying it is. I love checking out all the new dining options up and down Mesa, in Five Points, on Zaragosa. Some are chains but a lot are not. I love taking my little one to all the fairs, exhibits, festivals that happen around town all the time.
If you can't find something to do in El Paso, trust me, it isn't El Paso's fault. No, we don't have Madison Square Garden here. But we have a symphony, an opera, a ton of theaters (and I am not talking about movie theaters). We have Division 1 college athletics. We don't have the Dodgers but we have professional baseball. I can safely say there are more entertainment options than I have a budget for and I make six figures (for reference only, I am not trying to sound like a douche).
Fair enough. I don't believe 700,000 El Pasoans are living that lifestyle however.
Is it though? Maybe that is the experience or lifestyle you, your friends, and your family live.
I am a life long El Pasoan yet I haven't been to Cielo Vista Mall in years. Entertainment, to me, isn't shopping capped off with a meal at a chain restaurant. I do drive a very big 4x4 truck though
Tucson is near Phoenix. While separate, it does impact the quality of life. Good for Tucson. El Paso isn't Tuscon, or San Diego, or Houston, or Manhattan. I mention those cities because we have threads like this before where someone from those cities blasted El Paso for not being comparable.
That is not to say El Paso is what you are saying it is. I love checking out all the new dining options up and down Mesa, in Five Points, on Zaragosa. Some are chains but a lot are not. I love taking my little one to all the fairs, exhibits, festivals that happen around town all the time.
If you can't find something to do in El Paso, trust me, it isn't El Paso's fault. No, we don't have Madison Square Garden here. But we have a symphony, an opera, a ton of theaters (and I am not talking about movie theaters). We have Division 1 college athletics. We don't have the Dodgers but we have professional baseball. I can safely say there are more entertainment options than I have a budget for and I make six figures (for reference only, I am not trying to sound like a douche).
Fair enough.
However, i would never compare EP to Houston, Manhattan, or San Diego because that's not fair. That's a pretty retarded comparison to me, so i could see where you could be annoyed at such a comparison. Those are big time cities. Hell, EP is larger than San Francisco, and one block of San Fran has more culture than the whole city of EP. So you have to be careful when making comparisons and try to be as fair as possible.
That's why i used Tucson....and i think it's a very fair comparison. But you do bring up a good point about its proximity to Phoenix, and when i think about it, it makes sense. Point taken. However, Albuquerque is more dynamic too with a smaller population than EP has....and it's just as isolated as EP is.
That said, you made some good points. I am aware that there is an opera and theater, and that you have Div 1 sports (LMAO...i won't go there, so stop tempting me). The town is clean, safe, and the weather is good. I've admitted as much. So sure, i see the appeal. But i see the appeal much more so for someone who is retired vs a person who is young and vibrant. After all, there is a reason why the young people with educations make the yearly exodus out of that town....and it's not just money. Money is relative. It's a fairly inexpensive town to live in so you don't need to make six figs. But the dynamism just isn't very palpable.
BTW...i don't think Dallas is much better. But that's another topic.
However, i would never compare EP to Houston, Manhattan, or San Diego because that's not fair. That's a pretty retarded comparison to me, so i could see where you could be annoyed at such a comparison. Those are big time cities. Hell, EP is larger than San Francisco, and one block of San Fran has more culture than the whole city of EP. So you have to be careful when making comparisons and try to be as fair as possible.
That's why i used Tucson....and i think it's a very fair comparison. But you do bring up a good point about its proximity to Phoenix, and when i think about it, it makes sense. Point taken. However, Albuquerque is more dynamic too with a smaller population than EP has....and it's just as isolated as EP is.
That said, you made some good points. I am aware that there is an opera and theater, and that you have Div 1 sports (LMAO...i won't go there, so stop tempting me). The town is clean, safe, and the weather is good. I've admitted as much. So sure, i see the appeal. But i see the appeal much more so for someone who is retired vs a person who is young and vibrant. After all, there is a reason why the young people with educations make the yearly exodus out of that town....and it's not just money. Money is relative. It's a fairly inexpensive town to live in so you don't need to make six figs. But the dynamism just isn't very palpable.
BTW...i don't think Dallas is much better. But that's another topic.
It's all relative. I am on the Houston threads often and it's funny when people from Manhattan, or LA, or Miami dump all over the city because it's not like where they came from (i.e. not cosmopolitan enough for them)
It's all relative. I am on the Houston threads often and it's funny when people from Manhattan, or LA, or Miami dump all over the city because it's not like where they came from (i.e. not cosmopolitan enough for them)
Yea, i can understand. I try not to compare cities based on something as frivolous as it "not being like where i come from" and instead i try to focus on objective observations and use what limited knowledge i have about different places based on my visits there. If i've lived in a certain place, i find that it's easy to be biased when doing comparisons.
I mean, anyone looking for "cosmopolitan" in Texas is going to be sadly disappointed anyway once you leave Austin. You'll find it sporadically in Houston, Dallas and San Antonio (S.A. surprisingly feels more hip than both of those towns) but Texas is a different animal altogether on that count. But at least Houston has some big time things going on. It's nothing like EP.
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But the main difference is culture. El Paso is great for people who want to wake up and go to IHOP for breakfast, then go to the mall to shop, and have dinner at Applebees. Lame...yes, but tens of millions of Americans like that lifestyle.
I am a newly- minted doctor who moved to El Paso to work at the medical school. Although it's a nice town, I have never been to a place where so many ppl are content to live at home with their mom and dad, not obtain an education and make $8/hour for the rest of their lives.
The mentality is very much "live for today." I would like to stay here, but if I ever plan on meeting a professional, I had better move someone else.
I am a newly- minted doctor who moved to El Paso to work at the medical school. Although it's a nice town, I have never been to a place where so many ppl are content to live at home with their mom and dad, not obtain an education and make $8/hour for the rest of their lives.
The mentality is very much "live for today." I would like to stay here, but if I ever plan on meeting a professional, I had better move someone else.
It's not that there isn't a desire to do so, it's that there isn't the opportunity. If mom and dad made minimum wage their whole lives, they definitely aren't going to pay for little john to go to medical school. And even if someone has the desire to better themselves, chances are they won't be able to find good work in El Paso. El Paso exports a LOT of talent that will never make it back to the city because the professional job market is so tight there. I should know, I grew up in El Paso, got my degree, and had to move out to find work.
[quote=vjsoto;19662355]It's not that there isn't a desire to do so, it's that there isn't the opportunity. If mom and dad made minimum wage their whole lives, they definitely aren't going to pay for little john to go to medical school. And even if someone has the desire to better themselves, chances are they won't be able to find good work in El Paso. El Paso exports a LOT of talent that will never make it back to the city because the professional job market is so tight there. I should know, I grew up in El Paso, got my degree, and had to move out to find work.[/quot
Nobody pays for medical school out of their pockets. They take out loans... Also, plenty of people go on to get an education despite their parents not having a professional degree. This isn't a caste system
Nobody pays for medical school out of their pockets. They take out loans... Also, plenty of people go on to get an education despite their parents not having a professional degree. This isn't a caste system
Perhaps your missing my point. As I stated earlier, many El Pasoans that end up getting a professional degrees also end up moving out of El Paso due to the crappy professional job market there. Even with a good GPA and an engineering degree, the absolute best you could expect to make in El Paso with an entry level job is <$40k (I was offered almost double that in Tucson, entry level). This is why so many educated people tend to leave El Paso. There is much better money to be made elsewhere and you face much less competition for those few jobs that are available. What you are left with is people with strong ties to the area who are either satisfied making low wages, or people who no longer have the opportunity to return to college (due to marriage, kids, family, etc...).
I also never meant to imply that you couldn't get a loan to pay for college. But if you have plans to stay in to a city where you could never hope to make more than a $45k, it's hard to justify spending $50k+ on an education. The cost of education in these cases is just too prohibitive and repayment of the loans too demanding. For the average Joe it would take 10+ years to pay off $50k in loans at almost $600/month. With the interest rates for student loans rising closer to 7% this year, taking out a loan is less attractive than ever.
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). The town is clean, safe, and the weather is good. I've admitted as much. So sure, i see the appeal. But i see the appeal much more so for someone who is retired vs a person who is young and vibrant. After all, there is a reason why the young people with educations make the yearly exodus out of that town....and it's not just money. Money is relative. It's a fairly inexpensive town to live in so you don't need to make six figs. But the dynamism just isn't very palpable.
