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Old 06-09-2012, 10:49 AM
 
371 posts, read 443,300 times
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Old 06-09-2012, 11:54 AM
 
3,204 posts, read 2,867,315 times
Reputation: 1547
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
Without corporate and billionaire superpacs the Republicans are in serious trouble. Why do you accept the incestuous relationship between corporations and the Republican Party while denounce the relationship between the Democrats and unions?

It seems to me that unions fight for their working class members and gains that union workers win filter to non-union workers. That's how we got weekends off. While fighting for the interests of corporations -- such overturning minimum wage and child age work laws, encouraging foreign outsourcing and reducing worker safety protections works against the majority of working Americans.

Moreover, unions are the only political funding on the other side the corporate money game. Weaken unions and corporations have a virtual monopoly in political donations and thus will effectively choose elected representatives. That's very bad for democracy.



I wonder if that is why Obama was in Michigan and Chicago but failed to stop in Wisconsin. I wonder if Jeffrey Imelt (GE) will be donating to Romney. Who is Warren Buffet? Who wrote Obamacare? Ever heard of Hollywood? Look to all the failed green businesses we bankrolled and you will see where Obama gets his money.

Obama stopped the pipeline and did nothing in Wisconsin. Should make unions question his loyalty.

Unemployment for Blacks is at least 2 points higher than for Hispander, I mean Hispanics. Obama evolved for gays but pointed out that it's a state issue.

Obama is in it for himself and the one thing he does well is throw people under the bus. He should get a ticket for littering!
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Old 06-09-2012, 12:28 PM
 
Location: NC
1,956 posts, read 1,811,584 times
Reputation: 898
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
Without corporate and billionaire superpacs the Republicans are in serious trouble. Why do you accept the incestuous relationship between corporations and the Republican Party while denounce the relationship between the Democrats and unions?

It seems to me that unions fight for their working class members and gains that union workers win filter to non-union workers. That's how we got weekends off. While fighting for the interests of corporations -- such overturning minimum wage and child age work laws, encouraging foreign outsourcing and reducing worker safety protections works against the majority of working Americans.

Moreover, unions are the only political funding on the other side the corporate money game. Weaken unions and corporations have a virtual monopoly in political donations and thus will effectively choose elected representatives. That's very bad for democracy.
Unions may have been valuable at one point in ancient history, but they sure have abused their existence since then to milk every last cent out of the taxpayer to enrich their own pockets. The taxpayers see through that. Sorry, but being a bus driver is not a highly skilled job and doesn't pay 100K with free healthcare, pensions and benefits in the real world. When a skilled engineer can only make 65K in the private sector and have to fund his own 401k, but a government paper pusher can make 200K from tax money taken out of the pocket of the engineer, that is downright immoral and ridiculous.

Please don't parrot the spiel about the weekends off, 40 hour workweeks & safety standards. I have heard enough and more about that. Those kind of things should be handled by the free market, not unions. You know, if a company doesn't offer weekends off, you go work in a company which does, and so companies compete to retain workers by offering them perks and all that? But, you got to perform at your job a bit for the companies to do this, of course. The slackers and the simps in the public sector who gets to keep their jobs only because they have been in those jobs forever, protected by bloated union contracts, may not be eligible. But then that would mean that they actually have to perform at their jobs and not act like they have a monopoly, don't they?

P.S: There should be no minimum wage and child age work laws. It hurts the workers and the middle class more than it protects them. Again, any implicit minimum wage and child labor standards will be set by the free markets, not unions. You can personally insist on a minimum wage based on what you think your education and experience is, but you cannot set a standard for the market. Neither you nor the government can accurately gauge what that standard is. No one can. You can choose not to allow your 8 year old to work, and that's your personal preference, but you shouldn't get to dictate that to everyone. These lame laws should be repealed. At the minimum, they should be left to the states to decide.
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Old 06-10-2012, 01:19 PM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,214 posts, read 22,351,209 times
Reputation: 23853
Quote:
Originally Posted by steelstress View Post
Complete and utter collapse. And I look forward to it.
Why? What good does a complete California collapse do for the rest of the country? It alone accounts for 13% of America's wealth. That is $1.30 of every $10 dollars we have. It is the largest economy in the United States. It is larger than the nation of Spain's, and if Spain goes bankrupt, it will mess us up badly, even though the rest of Europe will help prop it up. If California fails, we go it alone. The rest of the world cannot help us.

The next largest, Texas, is only 60% as large. California has nearly 40 million people living there. Texas also has a huge deficit of it's own. Do you really want to see 2 in every 10 of us lose their jobs, in addition to the ones who have already lost employment?

What possible thing can be looked forward to if our unemployment reaches 20% or more? Are you nuts?
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Old 06-11-2012, 09:41 AM
 
6,497 posts, read 11,812,088 times
Reputation: 11124
Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
Why? What good does a complete California collapse do for the rest of the country? It alone accounts for 13% of America's wealth. That is $1.30 of every $10 dollars we have. It is the largest economy in the United States. It is larger than the nation of Spain's, and if Spain goes bankrupt, it will mess us up badly, even though the rest of Europe will help prop it up. If California fails, we go it alone. The rest of the world cannot help us.

The next largest, Texas, is only 60% as large. California has nearly 40 million people living there. Texas also has a huge deficit of it's own. Do you really want to see 2 in every 10 of us lose their jobs, in addition to the ones who have already lost employment?

What possible thing can be looked forward to if our unemployment reaches 20% or more? Are you nuts?
Why give all the above? I look forward to it because that's the only way the stupid CA voters and legislators will learn. No other reason. Everything above (though legitimate) means nothing to the CA lefty voter. Nothing. I just look forward to the opportunity to say to them "I told you so".
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Old 06-11-2012, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Reality
9,949 posts, read 8,849,970 times
Reputation: 3315
Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
Why? What good does a complete California collapse do for the rest of the country? It alone accounts for 13% of America's wealth. That is $1.30 of every $10 dollars we have. It is the largest economy in the United States. It is larger than the nation of Spain's, and if Spain goes bankrupt, it will mess us up badly, even though the rest of Europe will help prop it up. If California fails, we go it alone. The rest of the world cannot help us.

The next largest, Texas, is only 60% as large. California has nearly 40 million people living there. Texas also has a huge deficit of it's own. Do you really want to see 2 in every 10 of us lose their jobs, in addition to the ones who have already lost employment?

What possible thing can be looked forward to if our unemployment reaches 20% or more? Are you nuts?
Because it's the only way things in CA will ever get any better. Sometimes the best way to rebuild a forest is to burn it down.
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Old 06-11-2012, 10:15 AM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,214 posts, read 22,351,209 times
Reputation: 23853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Backspace View Post
Because it's the only way things in CA will ever get any better. Sometimes the best way to rebuild a forest is to burn it down.
No it's not. The best way to rebuild a forest is to carefully thin and manage it.
I live in the middle of pine forests, and have seen what happens when a forest burns down. There is nothing but charcoal for the next 10 years, and it takes another 30 for it to even start looking like a forest again.

Burning down the state of California would burn down the nation. This reasoning is simply crazy. Do you want a depression that would last into 2025?
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Old 06-11-2012, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,214 posts, read 22,351,209 times
Reputation: 23853
Quote:
Originally Posted by steelstress View Post
Why give all the above? I look forward to it because that's the only way the stupid CA voters and legislators will learn. No other reason. Everything above (though legitimate) means nothing to the CA lefty voter. Nothing. I just look forward to the opportunity to say to them "I told you so".
Wow. That's a mighty high price for just being able to say neener neener neener. That kind of thinking is usually left behind on the school ground, so I guess you haven't graduated out of the 7th grade yet.

If you believe California going bankrupt will not affect you, me, and all the rest of us deeply, and in ways you are not going to like at all, you're sadly mistaken.
Such a failure would not only drive the US into a real and long-lasting depression, it would affect the rest of the world. This kind of thinking is immature, simplistic and dangerously wrong-headed.
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Old 06-11-2012, 10:25 AM
 
16,345 posts, read 18,051,721 times
Reputation: 7879
Quote:
Originally Posted by steelstress View Post
Why give all the above? I look forward to it because that's the only way the stupid CA voters and legislators will learn. No other reason. Everything above (though legitimate) means nothing to the CA lefty voter. Nothing. I just look forward to the opportunity to say to them "I told you so".
Wow... As if you can't be a reasonable person and not just say you hope that they figure out how to fix their problems without massive unemployment. It doesn't have to be one or the other. Real classy there, though.
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Old 06-11-2012, 11:09 AM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,214 posts, read 22,351,209 times
Reputation: 23853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Backspace View Post
Because it's the only way things in CA will ever get any better. Sometimes the best way to rebuild a forest is to burn it down.
No it's not. The best way to rebuild a forest is to carefully thin and manage it.
I live in the middle of pine forests, and have seen what happens when a forest burns down. There is nothing but charcoal for the next 10 years, and it takes another 30 for it to even start looking like a forest again.

Burning down the state of California would burn down the nation. This reasoning is simply crazy. Do you want a depression that would last into 2025?
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