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We have a two-party system - Either a Republican or Democrat will be elected.
Voting for an independent candidate or not voting at all does not make the 'statement' many imagine it will. It is the same as voting for the candidate of the opposite party one would otherwise have voted for. That was the major concern of the Republicans with Trump choosing an independent candidacy if he did not win the Republican nomination.
I remember the bumper stickers of people who smugly imagined they had beaten the system ("Don't blame me, I voted for Perot"). It is totally inexplicable that so many otherwise intelligent Americans just don't seem to understand this very simple fact of life.
If people had thought that way back in the 1800's Abraham Lincoln never would have become President. Afterall, the Republican party hadn't been around that many years before he joined it.
To some degree I agree with you. Many of the people who voted for Perot admittedly would have voted for the Republican candidate if Perot had not been running. But things are much different today in the sense that people are absolutely fed up with both parties, knowing they both have been corrupted by big money, and that neither party espouses their viewpoints or holds their values. Those values are traditional American values that politicians and the two main parties have ignored for a long time now.
To explain it another way, imagine the worst Republican and Democratic candidates you've ever seen, ones that you couldn't have held your nose and voted for. Now imagine those are your two choices for President. Could you pull the lever for one of them? Maybe you could if you belong to one party or the other, but today many people can no longer pull the lever for either party's candidate because they see the damage both have done and want no more of it, and the candidates themselves do not represent their views on issues - at least not enough of them. And the issues they disagree with them on are major issues and are polar opposites on.
Over the past year I let my Senator Rob Portman and my Rep. Bob Latta know if they voted a certain way on key votes that I could no longer vote for them, as I had in the past. They ignored me, so they'll pay the price by not getting my vote in the future. Only thing working in their favor is I'll never vote for a Democrat again.
So where does that leave me? Third party or no party, and the third party and candidate better be awful good. I refuse to ever pull the lever for a candidate or party I feel is not worthy, or that has burned this country badly in the past. Believe me, I've turned a blind eye to the Republican Party's sins of the past because the other side was so bad, but it's time for them to straighten up and fly right, or go home. I have absolutely no hope that the Democratic Party can or will change for the better.
Only thing saving both parties at this time is they have no viable competition that I've noticed yet, but it'll be coming down the road. It's inevitable.
I take voting to be me saying "Him/her, that's the person I want representing me". What's the sense if I want 'none of the above' representing me?
I hear what you are saying and I agree, but I also can't bring myself to waste a vote and voting 3rd party to me, is wasting a vote. I always find one of the major party candidates closer to my views than the other, but I do feel if it were Clinton versus Trump, I really don't know what I would do.
If people had thought that way back in the 1800's Abraham Lincoln never would have become President. Afterall, the Republican party hadn't been around that many years before he joined it.
Sure, we would have - Abraham Lincoln ran in the two party system of the Democratic and Republican Parties.
Yes, the Republican Party was a fairly new party, but it was one of the two major parties in 1860. It was formed in the vacuum left by the disintegration of the Whigs (of which Lincoln was one). Neither major party now remotely resembles the Whigs, and none of the myriad minor parties remotely resembles the Republican Party of 1854 - the year it won its first seat in Congress (that seat was in the Senate - it did not win a single House seat that year). Anyway, by 1856 the Republican Party had won 20 Senate seats, becoming the third-largest block in the upper house (the largest blocks being the Democratic Party and the so-called 'Opposition Party', the latter holding a mere one more seat than the Republicans), and easily took the second-most Electoral College votes in the Presidential election. By 1858, the Republicans had captured the House.
For all the fantasies of some Libertarians and Greens, those parties are not the 2016 version of the 1854 Republicans. And independent candidates like Perot or, potentially, Trump (or, historically, Theodore Roosevelt in 1912), merely represent movements built around individuals, not parties or ideologies.
The only way a third-party could ever succeed would be to replace either the Democratic Party or the Republican Party, because the American electoral system inevitably results in two major parties, for reasons explained in Duverger's Law. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duverger%27s_law
And despite the ebbs and flows of the fortunes of the Democrats and Republicans, each party ultimately responds to ebbs by making the necessary corrections to woo back enough of the electorate to again become competitive. This is precisely the reason that neither party has been replaced by another party in the past 160 years.
That's just the reality of the system and the way the parties function.
Very good and informative, Unsettomati. While I agree with your premise, the truth is many voters are so disgusted with both of our ruling parties that they can't take it any longer. Its way too obvious they are bought and paid for by big money, and are not there to truly represent our best interests or the best interests of the nation. It's troubling.
If a new party obliterated one of the Big 2 now it would have to be the Republican Party that would fall to the wayside, although they might survive as a fringe party holding a limited number of seats in the House and Senate. The Democratic base is too entrenched: unions, feminist women, blacks, gays, the climate change crowd (although they would prefer the Green Party I'm sure), and any other liberal group not mentioned. It would be hard to get them to vote for another party, I believe. Unfortunately, too many Republicans are in it to represent the rich, but expect to get the vote of people who know the candidates wont truly represent them.
If I could wave a magic wand and create a party that others should want to follow, it would represent all classes of our citizens. Problem is not many people would like it. I'd get rid of all tax credits and deductions and lower tax rates, but people would not be willing to give up the child tax credit, for example, or whatever they are benefiting from. But you know what??? If I ever have money I will try to create that party. Maybe it needs to start with some unknown guy in a state like Ohio, because nothings going to change in D.C. in the near future from what I can tell. At least not for the better. Although I doubt it can get much worse.
We have a two-party system - Either a Republican or Democrat will be elected.
This. People can delude themselves into thinking they have other options, but we have a two party system, like it or not. That's just how it is. People should work to change one or both of the parties, rather than pretending they have other real options.
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