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On one side you have the winning side poo poo'ing all of the reports about potential, and I stress potential, election issues from Russian hacks and Putin's knowledge to the crosscheck where voters kicked off the polls (Michigan for example) etc.
On the other side you have the losing side whining about blatant misjustice to fraud to fixed, rigged etc.
In my mind, all I can say is there is enough noise for me to at least question the results. But until there is hard concrete evidence as opposed to accusations and reports of look likes and maybes, then we should continue to move forward. The only thing I laugh about is Trump was the one whining and screaming about voter fraud long before he got elected, and now once in of course not a peep.
There was no way I was voting for Hillary in any scenario, so full disclosure. Trump wasn't my dream candidate by any stretch of the imagination, but I voted for him. In California a lot of good that did, but....
I'd have a problem if the allegations were that the hack was to plant false information or hack the voting machines. That wasn't the case. The hacked email (as has been pointed out 3,487 times in these forums) revealed the DNC and Hillary to be the biggest bunch of crooks, liars and cheats around. If the Russians were behind the hacks, I don't care. The truth remains. Hillary shafted Bernie, wasn't smart or confident enough to engage in a debate with a man who gets into twitter wars with a comedy show without cheating and is just fine with rioters destroying property without so much as a word.
Most of the people I've talked to, the posts I've read and the media stories I've read ignore the emails. If you read the stories and posts without knowing the full story you would think the voting system got hacked and votes were changed from Hillary to Trump. They do not acknowledge the duplicity and underhanded dealing that went on. The refusal to accept the truth goes hand in hand with the shaking, crying, baby-like behavior of the millennials.
The truth about Trump's victory is that as bad as he is, Hillary is much, much worse. Her support base doesn't fall far from the tree.
There was no way I was voting for Hillary in any scenario, so full disclosure. Trump wasn't my dream candidate by any stretch of the imagination, but I voted for him. In California a lot of good that did, but....
I'd have a problem if the allegations were that the hack was to plant false information or hack the voting machines. That wasn't the case. The hacked email (as has been pointed out 3,487 times in these forums) revealed the DNC and Hillary to be the biggest bunch of crooks, liars and cheats around. If the Russians were behind the hacks, I don't care. The truth remains. Hillary shafted Bernie, wasn't smart or confident enough to engage in a debate with a man who gets into twitter wars with a comedy show without cheating and is just fine with rioters destroying property without so much as a word.
Most of the people I've talked to, the posts I've read and the media stories I've read ignore the emails. If you read the stories and posts without knowing the full story you would think the voting system got hacked and votes were changed from Hillary to Trump. They do not acknowledge the duplicity and underhanded dealing that went on. The refusal to accept the truth goes hand in hand with the shaking, crying, baby-like behavior of the millennials.
The truth about Trump's victory is that as bad as he is, Hillary is much, much worse. Her support base doesn't fall far from the tree.
Voting for President was like calling for a Taxi,
Do you want a driver with a glove box full of tickets or do you want a driver who never drove a car before.
America has chosen the inexperienced to take us for a ride.
Most of the people I've talked to, the posts I've read and the media stories I've read ignore the emails. If you read the stories and posts without knowing the full story you would think the voting system got hacked and votes were changed from Hillary to Trump. They do not acknowledge the duplicity and underhanded dealing that went on. The refusal to accept the truth goes hand in hand with the shaking, crying, baby-like behavior of the millennials.
Great post!
In only one case that I remember; did Podesta challenge whether WikiLeaks information was factual. But, even in that one case; he did not come forward to tell us what was the truth. Obama and Hillary were ready to get us into WWIII simply because the Russians told the truth or, at least, a part of it! Obama's first reaction was to place a No Fly Zone over Syria which could have easily escalated into all out war. Fortunately he backed down. The Russians took him seriously and they were on the verge of war because of it. Both Russia and many in the US breathed a sigh of relief when Trump won.
When it comes to nuclear war, considering how quick you have to respond; it does neither side any good to live in fear or the other side - we want respect and not fear.
I also love that the liberal side loves whales, trees, pets and all things green. But they are willing to turn the Northern Hemisphere into an uninhabitable atomic wasteland because they do not want us to hear the truth! Even today Obama is planning an appraisal against Russia for telling us the truth!
The garbage is that "you all" believe 100%, without a shred of anything, that all was clean as a whistle. Basically the entire other side is 100% throwing conspiracy theories in the air. 100%. Not even 99.99% Ivory Pure. That's the garbage. Too afraid to even think for a second, hmmm, who knows? That's ALL I said in my OP.
"In my mind, all I can say is there is enough noise for me to at least question the results. But until there is hard concrete evidence as opposed to accusations and reports of look likes and maybes, then we should continue to move forward. The only thing I laugh about is Trump was the one whining and screaming about voter fraud long before he got elected, and now once in of course not a peep."
As the title of the thread states, we may never know the whole truth. "You all" on the other hand just are 100% positive sure. That's garbage, and you are sheep. At least I have some objectivity in me, to at least keep my eyes open, questioning both sides, regardless of whom I voted for. That's irrelevant to the topic. Garbage.
So, by your standards, how can we be 100% sure of anything? People say things without any proof all the time. That shouldn't create doubt in a rational person.
How do we know the 2012 election wasn't hacked by Canada?
How do we know that Hillary isn't into snuff films?
People can say anything they want about anything or anyone. When there is zero evidence to back it up, why would a rational person believe it?
The garbage is that "you all" believe 100%, without a shred of anything, that all was clean as a whistle. Basically the entire other side is 100% throwing conspiracy theories in the air. 100%. Not even 99.99% Ivory Pure. That's the garbage. Too afraid to even think for a second, hmmm, who knows? That's ALL I said in my OP.
"In my mind, all I can say is there is enough noise for me to at least question the results. But until there is hard concrete evidence as opposed to accusations and reports of look likes and maybes, then we should continue to move forward. The only thing I laugh about is Trump was the one whining and screaming about voter fraud long before he got elected, and now once in of course not a peep."
As the title of the thread states, we may never know the whole truth. "You all" on the other hand just are 100% positive sure. That's garbage, and you are sheep. At least I have some objectivity in me, to at least keep my eyes open, questioning both sides, regardless of whom I voted for. That's irrelevant to the topic. Garbage.
Congrats on your self-proclaimed objectivity. We'll continue to move forward whether or not you or anyone else question the results. Regardless of how WikiLeaks got the emails, the publication of private emails may, or may not have, affected the results. Who knows, if nobody had recorded Romney's '47%' comment maybe he'd have beaten Obama; maybe if Trump's audio had not been made public, he'd have won by a bigger margin.
In 2012, pre-election polling, exit polling, the electoral margin and the popular margin all pointed to an Obama victory. In 2016, only one of them pointed to a Trump victory and it was by the slimmest of margins imaginable. With certain Russian meddling, Trump's narrow electoral college win will always be suspect and his legitimacy as president will be questioned.
Speak for yourself. It's only suspect because you lost. You and your media pals were tricked and it pisses you off.
The polsters that were reliable in the past were making false assumptions based on polling from mostly democrats.
Neither one of the candidates were any good. It was a disgrace to this country.
You are correct.
The two parties have lowered the bar so low, it disgusts me to think about it. What is sad, there are plenty of good, capable people on both "sides" who could be running, but are put off (or out) by corrupt party practices.
If by "they," you mean Hillary supporters? "We," may never "stop." Believing, that Hillary is the true winner with over 2.8 million votes. Some day the electoral college will change. It has never been more evident, than now, change is necessary, for our democracy.
No matter what anyone thinks, or believe they know, Hillary was by far the most qualified candidate. A man with the same credentials would be the president elect; not some rich, spoiled kid that tweets like a kid that should be in school. Scary, very scary.
Maybe, while we are at it; the president and commander in chief positions should be two different jobs. I think Trump may be an average president and America, may able to overcome his one sided, closed minded views. However; as commander in chief, he falls flat.
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