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I respectfully disagree, in that the 90's was the big decade for culture to look back to the 60's. I believe that the 80's were the last decade of the evolution of pop culture. The 80's featured bands such as Iron Maiden and Slayer which dwarfed the whole 90's touchy-feely "I wrote a song about how everything sucks" thing. That whole movement was borrowed from the 60's, complete with crappily tuned drum tracks, etc.
However, songs such as Slayer's Raining Blood or Metallica's Master of Puppets don't have such a datemark on them and are considered classics, unlike most 90's stuff which has fallen out of fashion.
You can't be serious? Music took a huge jump in the 90s, especially rock and rap music. Nirvana's Nevermind along with some other early alt rock albums was a catalyst for an entire evolution of rock music that changed the entire game.
Fallen out of fashion? Where the hell do you live? I cannot turn on the radio for more than 10 minutes without hearing a 90s song. We have an entire station in KC dedicated to just 90s music. There are so many albums that were put out in the 90s that will be played for decades to come that I could probably sit here to late tonight listing them.
Perhaps its getting older, and not being young anymore - but it certainly seems like there is no really good music around, films are very derivative and younger people generally bore me - they have nothing original or interesting to say.
- perhaps when you get older you adopt a seen it all before attitude and explore less things, your more cynical therefore you see less joy, when your younger you take joy in small things, as its all new.
I think a decade or the music, or the spirit of a time only becomes recognisable when you look back on it from a distance - like the 90s at the time, I am sure there were people saying 80s were better,
There is a ton of good music around. Tons of it. The problem is that a lot of it isnt found on TV or the radio anymore, you have to dig for it. The internet and digital music has changed the game and finding good and even great music takes effort. The problem with music today is that most pop music is completely crap. Pop music use to be somewhere respectable with people like Michael Jackson but now it is ****.
Despite that, there is tons of good stuff out there, you just have to look for it. The same goes for movies. A lot of the mainstream stuff is terrible but there are creative people making amazing movies.
With TV, most of the good stuff is on cable or movie channels. Network TV is slowly dieing and most it is isnt even watchable.
Pop culture has changed a lot even in the past ten years.
Electro-pop artists dominate the charts today. Granted, electronic music (popularly called "techno") has had times were it rose out of the underground and on to the charts, but they were few. Back in 2002, electronic music (mainly trance and perhaps a slightly modern modern sounding form of eurodance then) was popular in Europe and Canada, but almost strictly relegated to gay clubs and the underground in the U.S., and even the popular songs were different there than the underground tracks here.
(Though there were A FEW exceptions. Anybody remember this song?:
Rappers often rap over upbeat, melodic tracks with a 130 bpm disco beat. That would have been viewed as terribly "homo" even five years ago. (However, the subject matter of their lyrics has arguably changed little). Rap and R & B were actually starting to dominate the charts in 2002, after a few years of rock and pure pop (98 Degrees, Backstreet Boys, Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera, Ricky Martin, Lou Bega "Samba No. 5", etc.). Those artists who would survive would sometimes have to roughen the edges of their images or appear "harder".
On the technology front - which has a lot more influence in people's lives and makes up a lot more of "culture" than many want to give it credit for - there have been MAJOR changes. Smartphones barely existed 10 years ago; now everybody has one, and they do things that couldn't be imagined in a phone in 2002. Text messaging was just arriving onto the US scene; sending text messages across carriers was impossible. Now the main method of communications among young people is SMS messaging.
Broadband connections were beginning to rise in popularity, but most people had dial-up, if they had internet access at all. Most people used their computers only at home, as they were bulky desktops with even bulkier CRT monitors.
YouTube did not exist. Facebook did not exist. A consumer digital camera market existed, although most people still had film cameras, and it was only the rare, mostly foreign cell phone that actually had a CAMERA. Apple was struggling at that time; now they have the iPhone, iPod*, iPad, iTunes, and their computers are "cooler" than anybody else's (and in 2002, a computer could barely be "cool").
As for TV, I don't watch much mainstream network TV, but sitcoms still seemed to be the standard fare then. Reality TV shows like Survivor were relatively new, and American Idol had its first season.
In terms of political issues, gay marriage was becoming an issue, but still did not touch most people's minds. Because of 9/11, most Americans were behind Bush's invasion of Afghanistan (in late 2001) and the majority were behind the invasion of Iraq, though that did not happen until March 2003. Current American society is "greener" than in 2002 - although many people still buy Suburbans, SUVs are not nearly as popular as then. Corporations brag about their "green" and "ecological" efforts, and consciousness and popularity of organic foods are greater than in 2002.
* The iPod existed in 2002, though it was just released.
Pop culture has changed a lot even in the past ten years.
Electro-pop artists dominate the charts today. Granted, electronic music (popularly called "techno") has had times were it rose out of the underground and on to the charts, but they were few. Back in 2002, electronic music (mainly trance and perhaps a slightly modern modern sounding form of eurodance then) was popular in Europe and Canada, but almost strictly relegated to gay clubs and the underground in the U.S., and even the popular songs were different there than the underground tracks here.
(Though there were A FEW exceptions. Anybody remember this song?:
Rappers often rap over upbeat, melodic tracks with a 130 bpm disco beat. That would have been viewed as terribly "homo" even five years ago. (However, the subject matter of their lyrics has arguably changed little). Rap and R & B were actually starting to dominate the charts in 2002, after a few years of rock and pure pop (98 Degrees, Backstreet Boys, Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera, Ricky Martin, Lou Bega "Samba No. 5", etc.). Those artists who would survive would sometimes have to roughen the edges of their images or appear "harder".
On the technology front - which has a lot more influence in people's lives and makes up a lot more of "culture" than many want to give it credit for - there have been MAJOR changes. Smartphones barely existed 10 years ago; now everybody has one, and they do things that couldn't be imagined in a phone in 2002. Text messaging was just arriving onto the US scene; sending text messages across carriers was impossible. Now the main method of communications among young people is SMS messaging.
Broadband connections were beginning to rise in popularity, but most people had dial-up, if they had internet access at all. Most people used their computers only at home, as they were bulky desktops with even bulkier CRT monitors.
YouTube did not exist. Facebook did not exist. A consumer digital camera market existed, although most people still had film cameras, and it was only the rare, mostly foreign cell phone that actually had a CAMERA. Apple was struggling at that time; now they have the iPhone, iPod*, iPad, iTunes, and their computers are "cooler" than anybody else's (and in 2002, a computer could barely be "cool").
As for TV, I don't watch much mainstream network TV, but sitcoms still seemed to be the standard fare then. Reality TV shows like Survivor were relatively new, and American Idol had its first season.
In terms of political issues, gay marriage was becoming an issue, but still did not touch most people's minds. Because of 9/11, most Americans were behind Bush's invasion of Afghanistan (in late 2001) and the majority were behind the invasion of Iraq, though that did not happen until March 2003. Current American society is "greener" than in 2002 - although many people still buy Suburbans, SUVs are not nearly as popular as then. Corporations brag about their "green" and "ecological" efforts, and consciousness and popularity of organic foods are greater than in 2002.
* The iPod existed in 2002, though it was just released.
I'm guessing you're not that old. That's why you see rappers rapping over higher tempo stuff as a "huge shift".
Guess what, lots of hip-hop used to be high tempo back in the day. It actually slowed down during the "gangsta rap" era of the early '90s.
And the Ipod is not a CULTURAL shifter. It's a piece of technology. It's just an improvement on the Walkman that made music portable. That's not the same as changing how people talk, dress, and act.
Facebook, Myspace, and Twitter are the children of things like Friendster, and Black Planet, and all the chat rooms of the '90s. They're not new inventions, just improvement of things that already had science.
Last edited by Lake County IN; 03-13-2012 at 05:42 PM..
And the Ipod is not a CULTURAL shifter. It's a piece of technology. It's just an improvement on the Walkman that made music portable. That's not the same as changing how people talk, dress, and act.
Facebook, Myspace, and Twitter are the children of things like Friendster, and Black Planet, and all the chat rooms of the '90s. They're not new inventions, just improvement of things that already had science.
It is true that some rap tracks had a fast tempo in the late 80's (even some of Ice Cube's stuff is at 160 bpm), but they have a totally different beat than some of the stuff that's come out in the past three years, and for the most part an almost absent melody. You definitely didn't hear the electro-disco-glam-rap that you do today.
Technology is a major part of culture. It's the tools people use, which I think would come under the heading of the way they "act".
As for Facebook, Myspace, and Twitter descending from chat rooms? Were you around in the 90s? There was absolutely nothing like those sites back then. (And Friendster as well as Xanga, etc. are legitimate "ancestors" to Facebook, - but Friendster opened up in 2002)
Chat rooms were where you chatted, live, with strangers, whom you might get to know after a while if you regularly frequented the chat room. Facebook and Myspace are sites where you interact with friends, family, and acquaintances you already know from "real" life. The internet culture of, say, 1996 and that of 2012 are TOTALLY different.
I think a better candidate for the forerunner of those sites would be the "personal" pages that were very popular with middle and high school students in the early 2000s - those hosted by Expage, AOL Hometown, etc. They usually had a little information about the creator, a section of "shout outs", and a guestbook in which people, usually friends from real life (since they were the only ones who would typically be interested in such pages) could post public messages (kind of like a "Wall").
And Twitter...there was nothing quite like it in the past. It's essentially a site where you tell everybody how you're doing or what you're thinking in a short sentence - often (probably the majority of times) without anything approaching "live" interaction.
It is true that some rap tracks had a fast tempo in the late 80's (even some of Ice Cube's stuff is at 160 bpm), but they have a totally different beat than some of the stuff that's come out in the past three years, and for the most part an almost absent melody. You definitely didn't hear the electro-disco-glam-rap that you do today.
Technology is a major part of culture. It's the tools people use, which I think would come under the heading of the way they "act".
As for Facebook, Myspace, and Twitter descending from chat rooms? Were you around in the 90s? There was absolutely nothing like those sites back then. (And Friendster as well as Xanga, etc. are legitimate "ancestors" to Facebook, - but Friendster opened up in 2002)
Chat rooms were where you chatted, live, with strangers, whom you might get to know after a while if you regularly frequented the chat room. Facebook and Myspace are sites where you interact with friends, family, and acquaintances you already know from "real" life. The internet culture of, say, 1996 and that of 2012 are TOTALLY different.
I think a better candidate for the forerunner of those sites would be the "personal" pages that were very popular with middle and high school students in the early 2000s - those hosted by Expage, AOL Hometown, etc. They usually had a little information about the creator, a section of "shout outs", and a guestbook in which people, usually friends from real life (since they were the only ones who would typically be interested in such pages) could post public messages (kind of like a "Wall").
And Twitter...there was nothing quite like it in the past. It's essentially a site where you tell everybody how you're doing or what you're thinking in a short sentence - often (probably the majority of times) without anything approaching "live" interaction.
But Twitter hasn't changed the way people live, neither has Facebook or Ipods. These things just document the music, movies, opinions, it hasn't changed any opinions.
That's why I don't look at those things as culture changes. Everybody's is essentially the same person they were BEFORE these things.
Yes, nothing like Twitter existed (Thank God), but what do people tweet about ? The same crap they always have. There's not really new information being spread, just more ways to express vapidity and narcissism that was already happening.
I would argue that something like "Reality TV" has made more of a mark than Twitter, Facebook, and Myspace, because the narcissism exhibited on these sites are just basically extensions of a culture when "everybody's famous" and even "normal" people think they're important.
I don't think most people would have wanted inventions like Twitter and Facebook BEFORE reality TV became the cancer that it's become. Most people who weren't complete jerks used to value privacy.
But Twitter hasn't changed the way people live, neither has Facebook or Ipods. These things just document the music, movies, opinions, it hasn't changed any opinions.
That's why I don't look at those things as culture changes. Everybody's is essentially the same person they were BEFORE these things.
Yes, nothing like Twitter existed (Thank God), but what do people tweet about ? The same crap they always have. There's not really new information being spread, just more ways to express vapidity and narcissism that was already happening.
I would argue that something like "Reality TV" has made more of a mark than Twitter, Facebook, and Myspace, because the narcissism exhibited on these sites are just basically extensions of a culture when "everybody's famous" and even "normal" people think they're important.
I don't think most people would have wanted inventions like Twitter and Facebook BEFORE reality TV became the cancer that it's become. Most people who weren't complete jerks used to value privacy.
Yes, it has. I don't see how something that many people spend one to two hours on daily and always check hasn't made a change in their life.
"The same crap they always have"? What's "always have" in reference to tweeting? "Tweeting" or updating your Facebook status is a NEW thing. It's a way of constantly broadcasting, instantly, your mood or thoughts to an audience of friends and family who may be located thousands of miles apart. Nothing quite like it existed before the introduction of Facebook and Twitter.
The way a society "documents" things is part of their culture, as much a part as superficial things like tastes in movies and music.
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