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Economy makes societies closer more than anything else, therefore it is implied that post-communist ideology cosequences are still present in much of the every day lives of peoples who lived in the Eastern bloc countries. I consider no country who got into the European Union since 2004 could be categorized with the "Western" countries; geographical "West" and "East" play just as an arbitrary division.
An example, does South Korea really fit better in a category with North Korea and China than with Brunei, Japan, Hong Kong, Singapore, and Taiwan?
Division of Europe according to the UN's Regional groups:
Pink: Western European and Others Group (Only European Countries)
Blue: Eastern European Group (Only European Countries)
Orange: Asia-Pacific Group (Only European Countries)
Gray: Not Europe
Vatican City doesn't belong to anyone.
Location: Near Tours, France about 47°10'N 0°25'E
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[quote=markovian process;33317668]Western Europe by itself seems to not have that much in common. Not everyone agrees on where to draw the line between Eastern and Western or Western and central. It seems like lumping Spain, Germany and Ireland together doesn't really work on a lot of shared features. The cultures are so different, the food, climate, lifestyle etc. are varied and the languages are in totally different families.
It seems that part of the definition of Western Europe comes from the Cold War, with the capitalist team in opposition to the Eastern bloc. This definition, after the Cold War seems less meaningful now.
The other definition I hear of Eastern vs. Western Europe is that of Eastern and Western Christianity, which is a deeper and more historical split, with the Western branch deriving from the Latin, Roman split and the Eastern, the Greek split, of the Empire and its associated religion. However, there is more to Europe and ways to divide it culturally than just religion (plus, many Europeans are not that religious today in the western part).
Do you think Western Europe is a useful term or way of dividing culture? Or is it just a more geographical term of convenience for referring to different parts of the continent only?[/"Western Europe" nowadays does not means more than just being the countries that are located in the southern half if Europe. Historically "western" had two meanings other than just loosely geographic grouping:
1. It was the areas of western christianity (roman christianism) in opposition to the areas under religious influence of eastern christianity (now orthodox based on byzance). This concept had a cultural meaning until the split of western christianity into catholic (south and central) and protestant (northern) parts of "western Europe".
2. The second meaning related to the times of the cold war, with the opposition of the west part (capitalist) and the eat part (communist). This concept was nor cultural but only geopolitical, ans is now irelevant...
To conclude, i think that it is nowadays totally absurd to somehow assume that "western Europe" relates to a cultural group. It is just a loosely defined geographical definition without much meaning actually.
Remember France and Germany are products of the Charlemagne Empire. The terms "France" comes from the Franks, a germanic people.
A large part of the english vocabulary comes from the French language, and yet it is a germanic language. Italy and France share many things in common as well.
And before the roman empire spread out, the Po vally was occupated by gallic tribes who had come from France.
Western Europe means that France has more ties with germany or Italy than it does with Latvia or Greece.
Again I have never considered Germany or Scandinavia to be in Western Europe.
It has always been Italy, France, British isles, Iceland, and Iberia.
You forgot to include the BeNeLux, Scandinavia is obviously in Western Europe in the larger sense of the word. Even Germany, Switzerland, Austria. Oh well! I would always consider the BeNeLux and Scandinavia to be part of Western Europe much more than Iberia or Italy, which I see as Southern Europe or Mediterranean countries! France is the most Western European country!
Now irrespective of our personal opinions. This is Western Europe according to the United Nations, are the BeNeLux countries, France, Germany, Liechtenstein, Monaco, Switzerland and Austria.
Location: Near Tours, France about 47°10'N 0°25'E
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saxonwold
France is the most Western European country!
This is completly false. Iberia (espacially Portugal) and ireland are for exemple much more western than France. The gravity center of Spain and the UK is far more west then that of France...
This is completly false. Iberia (espacially Portugal) and ireland are for exemple much more western than France. The gravity center of Spain and the UK is far more west then that of France...
It's not! Iberia is in southwest Europe, while the U.K. is in the northwest, but France is the most Western European country.
Remember France and Germany are products of the Charlemagne Empire. The terms "France" comes from the Franks, a germanic people.
A large part of the english vocabulary comes from the French language, and yet it is a germanic language. Italy and France share many things in common as well.
And before the roman empire spread out, the Po vally was occupated by gallic tribes who had come from France.
Western Europe means that France has more ties with germany or Italy than it does with Latvia or Greece.
Location: Near Tours, France about 47°10'N 0°25'E
2,825 posts, read 5,264,432 times
Reputation: 1957
Quote:
Originally Posted by saxonwold
It's not! Iberia is in southwest Europe, while the U.K. is in the northwest, but France is the most Western European country.
I don't understand your logic, western Europe is made of both southwestern and northwestern Europe...
It is illogic to include in western Europe only areas in "middle", especially when geographically places located further north or further south are also further west.
By the way, all the areas south of the Loire valley are located in south-western Europe as well as iberia does, but are located less western than most of Iberia. It has no meaning to consider bordeaux to be in western Europe and not bilbao or la Coruna... Located hundreds of kilometers further west...
There is no reason why been south or been north exclude from been also western. The most western part if the US is not only the area around northern california and oregon... San Diego or Seattle are also western, despite been also in the south or the north.
Of course, the westernmost place in Europe is Finisterre
It's actually Cabo da Roca, in Portugal.
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