Does it make sense to use the term Western Europe (does "Western Europe" have anything in common other than geography?) (life, country)

[markovian process]

Western Europe by itself seems to not have that much in common. Not everyone agrees on where to draw the line between Eastern and Western or Western and central. It seems like lumping Spain, Germany and Ireland together doesn't really work on a lot of shared features. The cultures are so different, the food, climate, lifestyle etc. are varied and the languages are in totally different families.

It seems that part of the definition of Western Europe comes from the Cold War, with the capitalist team in opposition to the Eastern bloc. This definition, after the Cold War seems less meaningful now.

The other definition I hear of Eastern vs. Western Europe is that of Eastern and Western Christianity, which is a deeper and more historical split, with the Western branch deriving from the Latin, Roman split and the Eastern, the Greek split, of the Empire and its associated religion. However, there is more to Europe and ways to divide it culturally than just religion (plus, many Europeans are not that religious today in the western part).

Do you think Western Europe is a useful term or way of dividing culture? Or is it just a more geographical term of convenience for referring to different parts of the continent only?

[Maksim_Frolov]

In Russia, Eastern Europe usually called the state of the Slavs (Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, Poland, Czech Republic, Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia, Macedonia, Slovakia, etc.), but sometimes have means only the Eastern Slavs (Russia, Ukraine, Belarus). Under Western and Сentral Europe understands the other EU countries.

[dunno what to put here]

Western Europe is mostly an economic and political term I think, as opposed to anything else.

[bale002]

Originally Posted by dunno what to put here

Western Europe is mostly an economic and political term I think, as opposed to anything else.

I agree: political economy first, which then shapes ideology and culture.

People invent words as tools of communication. As people, economy and politics change, people can adapt their tools, and so words can change meaning.

A playwright once wrote, "history is geography over time".

"Europe", whatever that is, is complicated geography over a long period of time.

It is difficult to synthesize it, though not impossible.

In my book, the father of "Europe", that is western Europe, is still Charlemagne.

But that view could change in 10, 100, 1,000 years and each one has the opportunity to write his own book, and then the sequel.

Life is seldom a simple either/or proposition, there is an abundance of both/and, both/and, both/and.

You can answer your own questions by defining your own political economy and how your ideological and cultural outlook fits into that.

Don't hurt yourself - take a careful measure of reality first -

... and ...

Good Luck!

[french user]

'western Europe' is a very loosely defined concept. Here in France it is just has been used in opposition with the former communist countries of the eastern block. Culturally speaking there is not a 'western European block' that would be culturally homogenous and distinct to a 'eastern European culture'.

Cultures in Europe are firstly and mainly defined in linguistic and/or religious background zones. On these points 'western Europe' has never formed on cultural unique entity, but two. The catholic-based countries about in south-western Europe and the protestant-based countries in the northern half of it. The same with linguistic groupings (which overlap with religious groups but not exactly), the romance/latin countries in the southern half if western Europe and the germanic countries in the northern half.

Geographically, yes, western Europe would be the part of Europe closer to the Atlantic, but this is a very relative definition (where yo draw the limit?)
Climatically the climate are more oceanic the more close to the ocean, but that us very progressive with progressive transition to mediterranean or more continental climates. Even within the group of places officially classified in oceanic climate zone there are huge differences in climatical conditions (basque country climatical conditions have very few to do with western norway ones, etc.

Now that the eastern block doesn't ecist anymore the whole concept if western Europe has lost the few things that made their little sens of 'homogeneity' in the past (capitalist, democracies, etc)

[erasure]

Originally Posted by dunno what to put here

Western Europe is mostly an economic and political term I think, as opposed to anything else.

To Russian intelligentsia the term "Western Europe" has not only political, but cultural connotation as well;
the Age of Enlightenment, the poets/writers and philosophers, the history.
Russian intelligentsia still remembers what Europeans already tend to forget.

[Rob Allen]

"Western Europe" is a geographical phrase that often gets conflated with "Western culture" or "Western society". The latter phrases refer to the distinctive hybrid of Germanic, Romance and Celtic cultures that developed after the collapse of the Western Roman Empire. Anyone whose language and culture derive from a country that is now or once was Roman Catholic can be described as culturally Western, no matter where they live.

[erasure]

Originally Posted by Rob Allen

"Western Europe" is a geographical phrase that often gets conflated with "Western culture" or "Western society". The latter phrases refer to the distinctive hybrid of Germanic, Romance and Celtic cultures that developed after the collapse of the Western Roman Empire. Anyone whose language and culture derive from a country that is now or once was Roman Catholic can be described as culturally Western, no matter where they live.

That's not exactly how Russians see it. While "Western Europe" is very much a cultural term, "West" ( with inclusion of the US and other countries of the New world) is considered purely political term, since Russians consider those countries to be culturally inferior to European ones, and thus not strongly connected to Europe in that sense.

[Elkai]

Western Europe makes sense to me. But there are so many ways to classify Europe. For example, Germany can be Western Europe, Central Europe, Western-Central Europe, Northern Europe (only from Hamburg northernwards) and Germanic Europe if you classify Europe culturally and linguistically. And Romania can be Eastern Europe, South-Eastern Europe, Balkan, Orthodox Europe or Romance Europe.

It really depends on what standards you're using. And all of these standards are surely wrong and/or confusing anyway...

[bale002]

Originally Posted by french user

Here in France it is just has been used in opposition with the former communist countries of the eastern block.

So by this definition, the history of western Europe begins in 1917.

Originally Posted by french user

Cultures in Europe are firstly and mainly defined in linguistic and/or religious background zones. On these points 'western Europe' has never formed a cultural unique entity, but two. The catholic-based countries about in south-western Europe and the protestant-based countries in the northern half of it.

So by this definition, western Europe begins in 1517.


Just saying ... it's quite normal for the definition to change over geography and time.

In my view, it begins in 800, but it has more to do with military security than religion, but the religion helped solidify the military bond, at least for around 700 years or so until global circumnavigation and the emergence of the Atlantic as the economic superhighway. Funny how the ideology changed around that time. Hilarious.

Indeed, perhaps the military bond, or loosening of it, will shape the definition in the next epoch.

We'll see (or maybe we won't).