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Yeah i read about that and agree that is a terrible history, but that's a long time ago, it's the past. And I didn't make this comment without thinking.
I was raised the same way to hate/dislike Germans because of what they did to us in the war. Germans were bad people, they were all Nazis, couldn't be trusted and even their language was ugly and mean.
This was because my grandparents were dragged out of their home by Nazis and thrown on the street (with my grandmother pregnant), beaten up, they plundered their house and burned it to the ground. My other grandmother also had a terrible time in the war but never talked about it, but when my aunt met her old friend from kindergarden 40+ year later and she restored the relationship with her old friend, my grandmother broke all contact with my aunt, because apparently the father of that girl was NSB during the war. Now that girl wasn't even born yet at the time of the war, but nevertheless my grandmother didn't speak to my aunt for 8 years!!!
I can understand this hate from old folks that have seen the war, but not from young people that didn't.
Now I've worked for several years in Germany and sometimes vacation there and I've come to know Germans as very good, friendly people from a beautiful country. And i think if a Finn would go to Russia he'd find out there's some pretty nice folks over there as well.
It would be crazy if I would raise my children to hate Germans for something that long ago. And I think the same goes for Finns and Russians. The past is the past.
ive yet to meet a german I didn't like , I love Germany , its the ideal country in every way IMO
It would appear I'm somewhat older and remember well the stories my father brought back with him from serving over 4 years overseas during WWII. Germans rushing to surrender to allied troops from western nations due to the reputation Russians had garnered in areas they had taken. German officers killing allied troops upon capture.
The reason Germans were "rushing to surrender to allies" was because of the "reputation" they have "garnered in areas they have taken" in Russia. Particularly among the civilians.
( I mention this just in case your only sources of knowledge on WWII is American public school or American propaganda.)
I am just a bit older than you but here in the USA we learned much the same about the USSR. We all expected Soviet missiles to come raining down on us any day. We saw President Reagan as our protector, he was strong and built up the military. The movie Red Dawn depicts the American cold war nightmare scenario, a full blown Soviet invasion. The early to mid 80s was the last big hurrah for the cold war, a lot of threats and rhetoric in those days. It was in the late 1980s that the cold war mentality started to lighten up here as well. To be honest back in the early 1980s I could never have imagined that in 35 years I could have a friendly conversation like this with someone who lives where you do. I never thought the Soviet Union would disappear like it did, and in fact I would have guessed the big war would have happened by now. I am so glad the things we expected to happen never did. I really do hope the problems with Putin and Ukraine don't take us back to the bad old 20th century days regarding east vs west. People under 35 just don't get how dangerous those days were.
I've never heard of this view of Reagan as a protector. People were terrified that Reagan might cause armed conflict between Russia and the US, after labeling Russia the "evil empire". That is precisely the reason that so many citizens' cultural exchange projects sprang up in the Reagan era. The public was extremely concerned about the direction in which he was taking relations with Russia, and decided to do something about it. There was similar sentiment on the Russian side, and many "citizens' diplomacy" efforts were launched there, too. From that evolved satellite-linked talk shows between the two countries, so audience members could see and talk with each other. People could not only conceive of having friendly conversations with their counterparts in the other country, they were doing it. By going there in person, as well as by TV.
The reason Germans were "rushing to surrender to allies" was because of the "reputation" they have "garnered in areas they have taken" in Russia. Particularly among the civilians.
( I mention this just in case your only sources of knowledge on WWII is American public school or American propaganda.)
I think I described where I got my info/impressions from and it probably was not from American public school or propaganda due to my Canadian father going overseas from CANADA before America was even in the war.
Canadians were well aware of the German capability for committing terrible deeds.
Every army has been known to commit atrocities upon opposing forces and civilians; however, it takes a rare mindset to commit these atrocities upon your own people as the Russian leadership has demonstrated on many occasions over many decades.
Woah, that comment left on Youtube that you quoted! Is that person and essentially are you saying that Russians born in the early to mid 80s were pro-American?
Yes, that's what that person ( and I) are essentially saying. That generation born in that time ( if not to say the society for the most part as well) became very "pro-Western," more specifically - pro-American. It was the anticipation of times so to speak, when Americans would come to Russia and help them to establish good life.
Here is yet another Russian hit popular in the 90ies - "American boy take me with you." ( Something totally unimaginable only 10 years earlier.)
Cause that's hard to believe given the communist indoctrination that was at the time prior to 1990! Unless that stuff stopped before than that is.
No not "prior to the nineties" but prior to the 1985, when Gorbachev came along with his "Perestroyka." That's when public anti-American rhetoric was put to a stop, and the more time was progressing the more pro-American mentality of Russians have become. (Till the mid-nineties probably?) Then the reality settled in. The epiphany.
I think I described where I got my info/impressions from and it probably was not from American public school or propaganda due to my Canadian father going overseas from CANADA before America was even in the war.
Sorry, but you could have re-educated yourself many times since then.
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Canadians were well aware of the German capability for committing terrible deeds.
Sorry - that's not "terrible deeds." That's war, where soldiers die. "Atrocities" describe more of the actions of the military towards the civil population.
Quote:
Every army has been known to commit atrocities upon opposing forces and civilians;
But not on a scale it happened during the invasion of Russia in 1941, because this particular invasion was not about conquering the territories along with its inhabitants, but about extermination of the local population.
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however, it take a rare mindset to commit these atrocities upon your own people as the Russian leadership has demonstrated on many occasions over many decades.
And this relates to foreign invasion how? Or are you trying to say that foreign invaders ( Germans in this case) came to "liberate" Russians of their own oppressors?
It's actually quite common in the history of mankind tbh.
Depends where and at what time in history.
What Westerners take note of, usually, is that in Russia it was still taking place much later in history than in their own country. ( Except for they keep on forgetting about Germany in this respect, and everything what happened to Germans before they became that "unified nation" in their thrust for "future victories." They tend to forget who went to concentration camps first, who was undergoing some grim "programs" and the rest. ( I am talking about German population of course.)
Sorry, but you could have re-educated yourself many times since then.
Sorry - that's not "terrible deeds." That's war, where soldiers die. "Atrocities" describe more of the actions of the military towards the civil population.
But not on a scale it happened during the invasion of Russia in 1941, because this particular invasion was not about conquering the territories along with its inhabitants, but about extermination of the local population.
And this relates to foreign invasion how? Or are you trying to say that foreign invaders ( Germans in this case) came to "liberate" Russians of their own oppressors?
I'm not saying anything of the sort and you know it!
I'm simply stating that while all armies commit atrocities, Russia has displayed the rare tendency to commit atrocities upon it's own people under more than one leadership regime and over many decades. You disagree. So what?
Your statement about the tactical reason for Operation Barbarossa completely ignores the facts of history and therefore not worthy of an argument.
Your condescending reference to me educating myself says more about you and your ignoring the realities of history to suit your agenda and in that regard, again, not worthy of rebuttal.
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( Something totally unimaginable only 10 years earlier.)
Cause that's hard to believe given the communist indoctrination that was at the time prior to 1990! Unless that stuff stopped before than that is.
