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Old 03-26-2016, 11:13 AM
 
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You know what...you're right: 9/11 and the Boston bombings proved a high level of integration among the Muslims in America.

#osamaforamerica, #dontberacist.
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Old 03-26-2016, 01:04 PM
 
Location: Somewhere in Southern Italy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Northeastah View Post
probably because welfare in the US is not as generous as is Europe. They need to get off their lazy butts and work if they want to make ends meet.
Integration has little to do with the existence with welfare state. Welfare state actually encourages integration, take places such as Molenbeek, the French banlieues, ecc. where extremism has taken a hold, they are all places that had been abandoned to themselves by the State.

In fact, i would argue that without welfare state there would be increased chances for immigrants (usually without degrees and part of the lower classes) to enter periods of economical hardship, being forced to resort to criminality or extreme ideologies
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Old 03-26-2016, 02:04 PM
 
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Because:

1. The U.S., has proportionally, fewer Middle Eastern Muslims (most ME migrants to the U.S. are Christian, in Europe they're overwhelmingly Muslim)

2. The U.S., speaking, very generally does a better job at integrating foreigners into a national identity. Belgium doesn't even have a national identity so there is nothing really to integrate.

3. Europe isn't a country and so you have dozens of entities with competing agendas not sharing info/intelligence. The U.S. has a unified security apparatus.
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Old 03-26-2016, 02:06 PM
 
10,275 posts, read 10,348,051 times
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Originally Posted by Northeastah View Post
since when are Muslims the most successful people in the US? have you ever been to Dearborne?
Dearborn, MI, the most Muslim city in the U.S. is a prosperous suburb of Detroit.

It's a desirable city with good schools, safe, good neighborhoods. It just happens to be Muslim.

No, U.S. Muslims aren't "the most successful people in the U.S." but they are generally more successful than their equivalents in Europe.
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Old 03-26-2016, 04:39 PM
 
Location: Somewhere in Southern Italy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post
Because:

1. The U.S., has proportionally, fewer Middle Eastern Muslims (most ME migrants to the U.S. are Christian, in Europe they're overwhelmingly Muslim)

2. The U.S., speaking, very generally does a better job at integrating foreigners into a national identity. Belgium doesn't even have a national identity so there is nothing really to integrate.

3. Europe isn't a country and so you have dozens of entities with competing agendas not sharing info/intelligence. The U.S. has a unified security apparatus.
Agree with the first and third points. As for the second, it must be pointed out that while Belgium doesn't have a national identity, Wallonia has a French identity so an immigrant coming to Wallonia would have to learn French language and culture, the same goes for Flanders and Dutch.

Aside from that, Belgium and Switzerland are the only countries where there isn't a defined national identity. The difference is that Switzerland's different national identities have coexisted for centuries under the same umbrella whether there are still issues in Belgium
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Old 03-26-2016, 06:08 PM
FBF
 
601 posts, read 933,273 times
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Originally Posted by seixal View Post
Judaism unlike Islam and Christianity is matrilinear transmitted. Being Jewish has nothing to do with believing and being religious. That is a concept projected from Christianity and its universal perspective.
You are a Jew if your mother is Jewish or if you convert.

Judaism accepts converts, they just do not openly encourage and preach like Christians and Muslims due to historical persecutions and because their religion is like being part of a "nation."

It has to come from the convertees own will or accord if he/she wants to be part of Judaism. The rabbi traditionally refuses a few times until the fourth and fifth time and if the person still wishes to become Jewish, then the conversion process begins which can take months or maybe a few years to complete.

Last edited by FBF; 03-26-2016 at 06:18 PM..
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Old 03-26-2016, 06:13 PM
 
Location: Somewhere in Southern Italy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seixal View Post
Judaism unlike Islam and Christianity is matrilinear transmitted. Being Jewish has nothing to do with believing and being religious. That is a concept projected from Christianity and its universal perspective.
How does someone know about being a Jew if his mother and grandmothers were atheist or held another belief? How would he know about being part of the Jewish nation if he didn't look back his family tree or does this transmission stop after a precise number of generations?

Either way, this seems an updated concept
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Old 03-26-2016, 06:19 PM
 
1,600 posts, read 1,890,147 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by improb View Post
Integration has little to do with the existence with welfare state. Welfare state actually encourages integration, take places such as Molenbeek, the French banlieues, ecc. where extremism has taken a hold, they are all places that had been abandoned to themselves by the State.

In fact, i would argue that without welfare state there would be increased chances for immigrants (usually without degrees and part of the lower classes) to enter periods of economical hardship, being forced to resort to criminality or extreme ideologies
Almost all Muslim communities in Western Europe, specifically France and Belgium, overwhelmingly relies on welfare and benefit from it.
To say that Muslims are socioeconomically discriminated is ludicrous given that they fully enjoy the welfare state other European taxpayers fund.
In the US they are more integrated because:
a) They are much fewer
b) They are generally more educated
c) They are more scattered
d) The US do assimilate their immigrate whereas in Europe that doesn't happen and we have parallel societies
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Old 03-26-2016, 06:29 PM
 
Location: Somewhere in Southern Italy
2,974 posts, read 2,816,932 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xander.XVII View Post
Almost all Muslim communities in Western Europe, specifically France and Belgium, overwhelmingly relies on welfare and benefit from it.
To say that Muslims are socioeconomically discriminated is ludicrous given that they fully enjoy the welfare state other European taxpayers fund.
In the US they are more integrated because:
a) They are much fewer
b) They are generally more educated
c) They are more scattered
d) The US do assimilate their immigrate whereas in Europe that doesn't happen and we have parallel societies
There are definitely places where the State doesn't ease in integration with projects, school courses, ecc. or has let them concentrate in a single neighbourhood creating an ethnic area which also discourages integration. Welfare isn't only benefits but also offering them a chance to succeed into their new society

Anyway, once again i don't agree with the last point, if the USA was so successful, ethnic neighbourhood wouldn't exist, there wouldn't be such a gap between the average GDP of an American and the the average GDP of a first or second generation Mexican/Salvadorean/ecc.
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Old 03-26-2016, 06:31 PM
FBF
 
601 posts, read 933,273 times
Reputation: 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by improb View Post
How does someone know about being a Jew if his mother and grandmothers were atheist or held another belief? How would he know about being part of the Jewish nation if he didn't look back his family tree or does this transmission stop after a precise number of generations?

Either way, this seems an updated concept
People who are atheists descended from Mothers who are Jewish will still be considered "Jewish" yet cannot be buried in a Jewish grave if they are atheist or no longer frequent a synagogue....kind of an odd thing.
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