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Even if steroids did not exist, the same people who are bodybuilding champions would still be champions because of their freakish (and I mean that in a positive sense) genetics. All the steroids in the world won't make you a champion without the right genetics.
This is a ridiculous statement.
Did you know that our current Mr. Olympia was a fairly lean division I basketball player into his 20s at the University of Denver? He wasn't some muscle bound freak of nature. It's the steroids and his training and diet that now have him at the top of the (juiced) bodybuilding world. Yes, genetics factor into it but to say these guys would be bodybuilding champions anyway is just completely false.
"A well built physique is a status symbol. It reflects you worked hard for it, no money can buy it. You cannot borrow it, you cannot inherit it, you cannot steal it. You cannot hold onto it without constant work. It shows discipline, it shows self respect, it shows patience, work ethic and passion. That is why I do what I do."-Arnold Schwarzenegger
beautiful quote from Arnold... it is true and well phrased.
Did you know that our current Mr. Olympia was a fairly lean division I basketball player into his 20s at the University of Denver? He wasn't some muscle bound freak of nature. It's the steroids and his training and diet that now have him at the top of the (juiced) bodybuilding world. Yes, genetics factor into it but to say these guys would be bodybuilding champions anyway is just completely false.
For being a college basketball he was far from "lean" compared to a lot of the guys. His arms were bigger playing college basketball than many people could ever obtain, some even with the use of steroids.
I think what the person meant was, if NO ONE took steroids, and they still competed, the same guys winning today and in years past like Ronnie, Jay, and Phil, would likely still be up top if everyone was natural.
There's really no such thing as "muscle bound freaks of nature" all the people that look like freaks, are on steroids.
I feel the same way as Arnold does on the matter.
As to the steroids matter, I agree with houston-dan on the bodybuilder matter. By that, I mean the professionals who compete. These guys all mostly do it anyways and have a long time. I would understand if someone did it to even the playing field (note, I do not feel the same as to professional sports: mlb, nfl, nba, etc).
However, I do hold a great deal of disdain to the average gym goer who takes steroids just to get ripped/big. These guys are nothing but a bunch of posers.
That sounds rather hypocritical. The guys who go to the gym still work out and want to be strong/in shape. Both sets of guys are vain. So what is the difference exactly? Oh wait, the dudes doing steroids for competition want to win trophies and $$$ with the aid of of steroids. And somehow that is a MORE admirable goal than gym goers who don't? Curious. . .
For being a college basketball he was far from "lean" compared to a lot of the guys. His arms were bigger playing college basketball than many people could ever obtain, some even with the use of steroids.
I think what the person meant was, if NO ONE took steroids, and they still competed, the same guys winning today and in years past like Ronnie, Jay, and Phil, would likely still be up top if everyone was natural.
There's really no such thing as "muscle bound freaks of nature" all the people that look like freaks, are on steroids.
How in the world could you ever know this? Just a hunch?
How in the world could you ever know this? Just a hunch?
I admire the old-school bodybuilders of the 1940s and 1950s, most of whom were natural. Guys like Vince Gironda, the Iron Guru, were anti-steroids and built impressive physiques without any steroidal assistance. One of Gironda's trainees was the actor William Smith, who I felt had the perfect physique: he was muscular without being bulky and disproportioned; he had a Steve Reeves-like physique. You didn't see as many of the 'grotesque, gargoyle-looking' bodies back then. Smith was an early training partner of Larry Scott and was surprised when Scott started taking steroids. Smith was perplexed that Scott continued to make impressive gains in size while Smith's gains stalled. He soon learned why. But Smith built an impressive natural physique. Guys like that had more of the classical bodybuilder physique: narrow waist, broad shoulders, and wide back. I know Reeves experimented with steroids when he was older, but not during his initial rise to fame ( at least that is the story).
To me, injecting or ingesting steroids seems dirty or slimy for some reason, but that's just my take. No offense intended to any particular person.
How in the world could you ever know this? Just a hunch?
Which part?
The guys on the Olympia stage are there from their hard work and genetics, they need 100% of both. 90% of one and 100% of the other will not get them there.
So, if NO ONE, took steroids they would still be on the top based on their genetics. So much more than the size and proportions, but also like muscle bellies and muscle insertion points.
The only exception to this would be if someone had those genetic properties, but could not be a top level competitor today because their body could not handle the steroid side effects. That is another genetic factor that comes into play for the top guys, they must be able to handle the insanely large amounts of steroids they take. There are soooo many side effects that prevents most normal people from being able to take remotely close to their doses without serious issues.
In regards to the "muscle bound freaks of nature" comment, anymore, the guys that are so out of the ordinary muscular and cut, are on steroids. That's why the bodybuilders of today look nothing like those 60 or 70 years ago. The dryness, the vascularity, the striations, etc.
My wife and I had a client who was good friends with a uncle of Arnolds and it was amazing what he did. He usd to write letters to his uncle about how he was going to do this and that like body building, acting, politics. Many of us might say we are going to do something, some of us might actually try but only a few have the drive to reach the heights that Arnold did in his life. Amazing.
So, if NO ONE, took steroids they would still be on the top based on their genetics. So much more than the size and proportions, but also like muscle bellies and muscle insertion points.
Again, HOW DO YOU KNOW THIS???? It's impossible to make such a statement because you have no way of knowing if, say, Jay Cutler is a "genetic freak" because we've only seen the bodybuilder side of him when he was juiced up. It would be akin to saying "If so and so was a man, he'd be a great athlete." You're making a huge leap/assumption because of what you're seeing with them being on steroids. No doubt genetics plays a factor, but to say these guys would be bigger than everyone else if steroids did not exist cannot be proven at all.
And to say Phil Health was muscular at U of Denver is just incorrect. Look at any basketball player, they are lean and that is what shows muscle, not being a "genetic freak", lol. Did you not see the photo? Could you have picked him out of 1,000 non-steroid users and said "That's the guy who could be Mr. Olympia!"???? Like I said, ridiculous statements.
Last edited by Florida2014; 10-23-2014 at 07:33 AM..
Again, HOW DO YOU KNOW THIS???? It's impossible to make such a statement because you have no way of knowing if, say, Jay Cutler is a "genetic freak" because we've only seen the bodybuilder side of him when he was juiced up. It would be akin to saying "If so and so was a man, he'd be a great athlete." You're making a huge leap/assumption because of what you're seeing with them being on steroids. No doubt genetics plays a factor, but to say these guys would be bigger than everyone else if steroids did not exist cannot be proven at all.
And to say Phil Health was muscular at U of Denver is just incorrect. Look at any basketball player, they are lean and that is what shows muscle, not being a "genetic freak", lol. Did you not see the photo? Could you have picked him out of 1,000 non-steroid users and said "That's the guy who could be Mr. Olympia!"???? Like I said, ridiculous statements.
Of course, it's impossible to PROVE. I wasn't aware you were looking for someone to prove something impossible, moreso just justify some pretty solid reasoning.
You're right. Jay Cutler is not a genetic freak at all..
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