Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Pets > Fish
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 06-21-2011, 04:19 PM
 
Location: SE Michigan
6,191 posts, read 18,156,856 times
Reputation: 10355

Advertisements



I have a small pond in my back yard, not aerated but does have lily plants. And, had about 15 or so goldfish - feeder fish bought for a dime each. Some were about 4 years old and had become quite large...in winter I bring them inside in a big aquarium (the pond isn't deep enough for them to survive a Michigan winter in leaf mulch.) I've lost very few fish over the four years I've done this.

Every few days, I run the hose for 5-10 minutes to aerate the water and "top off" the little pond.

On Saturday I did this, but accidentally didn't turn the water completely off, so it trickled into the pond until I noticed it Monday morning. Four fish were floating dead. I shut off the water, that evening when I checked I'd lost several more. I talked to a friend who is very knowledgeable about fish and her theory was: I essentially did a fast and complete water change, not a good thing especially with city water. She suggested testing the water for pH and other things (no time, no place nearby) and also putting in some chlorine/chloramine neutralizer. I got some of that this morning and dosed the pond; this evening I still have three surviving fish. Hopefully they make it!

Anyone who's kept fish knows that it's bad to do complete or major water changes, especially with water that hasn't been "aged" and I guess I just found out what happens when you do that. My poor fiddies. They even survived the move to a new house/pond last summer and spending the winter in a tank inside; then I unwittingly committed pescicide.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-22-2011, 09:12 PM
 
196 posts, read 696,817 times
Reputation: 130
I did pretty much the same thing this spring. In my case the goldfish survived, but the young african cichlids I had just put in the pond did not.

It can help if you add the chlorine/chloramine neutralizer as soon as you realize the problem. I never age the water, just add the neutralizer. Last summer I pumped a pond almost dry - another senior moment - and did about a 95% water change without seeming to cause too much harm.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2011, 04:43 AM
 
Location: SE Michigan
6,191 posts, read 18,156,856 times
Reputation: 10355
Well I learned my lesson....usually I don't do much to the little outdoor pond except the minimal aeration & topping off (the dogs drink out of it LOL) because it's got plants and seems to stay pretty healthy without much intervention.

I am happy to report that the three remaining goldfish are fine.

Uplander you must live somewhere quite warm to put cichlids outside....wouldn't they have eaten the goldfish, though?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uplander View Post
I did pretty much the same thing this spring. In my case the goldfish survived, but the young african cichlids I had just put in the pond did not.

It can help if you add the chlorine/chloramine neutralizer as soon as you realize the problem. I never age the water, just add the neutralizer. Last summer I pumped a pond almost dry - another senior moment - and did about a 95% water change without seeming to cause too much harm.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2011, 01:37 PM
 
5,064 posts, read 15,896,837 times
Reputation: 3577
That is a hard lesson to learn. I have forgotten to turn off the hose before, but only after a matter of minutes. I always add a de-chlorinator, too. I'm glad to hear your remaining fish are alive.

That's interesting to mix cichlids and goldfish! Of course goldfish get to be over a foot long, so they wouldn't be a snack unless they were babies. Some kinds of cichlids can be pretty big and nasty as adults, though. Not sure how they'd do with even full-grown goldfish. Chiroptera, eventually you might have to dig a bigger pond if you want to over-winter your goldfish, you'd need a really big aquarium for them in a few more years.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2011, 01:54 PM
 
1,028 posts, read 3,082,059 times
Reputation: 959
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uplander View Post
I did pretty much the same thing this spring. In my case the goldfish survived, but the young african cichlids I had just put in the pond did not.

It can help if you add the chlorine/chloramine neutralizer as soon as you realize the problem. I never age the water, just add the neutralizer. Last summer I pumped a pond almost dry - another senior moment - and did about a 95% water change without seeming to cause too much harm.
How can you mix the two considering the goldfish and cichilids have different diets, different tolerance for water temps, different ph needs, etc? I also heard that a goldfish urine can be quite toxic to other fishes.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2011, 02:38 PM
 
Location: SE Michigan
6,191 posts, read 18,156,856 times
Reputation: 10355
Yeah....my knowledeable fish friend convinced me to stay with 3-4 goldfish for the space I have available. At a previous house I had a pond deep enough for goldfish to live through a Michigan winter and perhaps I should do this here!

In the past I've had tropical tanks with Oscars and Dempseys (sp) and I fed them feeder goldfish, earthworms and bits of frozen beef heart. I've also had Bettas who thrived on a diet of bloodworms and mosquito larvae. These days I am more into more mellow, vegetarian, low-maintenance fish ownership.

The three remaining goldfish are frisky and active so I think they'll be fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andthentherewere3 View Post
That is a hard lesson to learn. I have forgotten to turn off the hose before, but only after a matter of minutes. I always add a de-chlorinator, too. I'm glad to hear your remaining fish are alive.

That's interesting to mix cichlids and goldfish! Of course goldfish get to be over a foot long, so they wouldn't be a snack unless they were babies. Some kinds of cichlids can be pretty big and nasty as adults, though. Not sure how they'd do with even full-grown goldfish. Chiroptera, eventually you might have to dig a bigger pond if you want to over-winter your goldfish, you'd need a really big aquarium for them in a few more years.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2011, 07:08 PM
 
196 posts, read 696,817 times
Reputation: 130
I put the tropicals in the ponds in mid June and take them out around Labor Day. In general I want the pond temps to be 70 or above. I never heard that goldfish urine is toxic and I have read quite a few books and magazines in the nearly 50 years I've kept fish. Diet and water temps seem to overlap OK in the ponds.

Some cichlids don't seem to do well in ponds - angelfish are an example and those from Lake Tanganyika. I have had good luck with all of the ones I've tried from Lake Malawi.

I've also summered platies, rosy barbs, tiger barbs, giant danios, rainbowfish, and black skirt tetras in the ponds. Last summer I put 6 platies in a pond with goldfish, koi, and cichlids and recovered more than 200. The water hyacinth was pretty thick. The tiger barbs and rosy barbs also had a few young.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-12-2012, 03:51 AM
 
1 posts, read 6,054 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uplander View Post
I put the tropicals in the ponds in mid June and take them out around Labor Day. In general I want the pond temps to be 70 or above. I never heard that goldfish urine is toxic and I have read quite a few books and magazines in the nearly 50 years I've kept fish. Diet and water temps seem to overlap OK in the ponds.

Some cichlids don't seem to do well in ponds - angelfish are an example and those from Lake Tanganyika. I have had good luck with all of the ones I've tried from Lake Malawi.

I've also summered platies, rosy barbs, tiger barbs, giant danios, rainbowfish, and black skirt tetras in the ponds. Last summer I put 6 platies in a pond with goldfish, koi, and cichlids and recovered more than 200. The water hyacinth was pretty thick. The tiger barbs and rosy barbs also had a few young.

How big was the pond? Did it have any sort of mechanical filtration or aerator? Or did you just use lots of plants?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-12-2012, 07:10 AM
 
2,873 posts, read 5,850,398 times
Reputation: 4342
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uplander View Post
I put the tropicals in the ponds in mid June and take them out around Labor Day. In general I want the pond temps to be 70 or above. I never heard that goldfish urine is toxic and I have read quite a few books and magazines in the nearly 50 years I've kept fish. Diet and water temps seem to overlap OK in the ponds.

Some cichlids don't seem to do well in ponds - angelfish are an example and those from Lake Tanganyika. I have had good luck with all of the ones I've tried from Lake Malawi.

I've also summered platies, rosy barbs, tiger barbs, giant danios, rainbowfish, and black skirt tetras in the ponds. Last summer I put 6 platies in a pond with goldfish, koi, and cichlids and recovered more than 200. The water hyacinth was pretty thick. The tiger barbs and rosy barbs also had a few young.
Goldfish urine isn't toxic in that it differs dramatically from the urine of other fish. That said, the problem with goldfish is that they make MORE of it than other fish. Goldfish have a very high bioload relative to their size, so they are considered 'dirty' fish. You want to keep less of them in a tank than you would, say, tetras.

To have common goldfish in an outdoor pond, you don't want to overstock for the same reason. You also have to keep in mind the adult size of the fish, not the size you buy them at.

Keeping cichlids in with them is a risky bet. They need buffered water and may either need the water chilled or heated. They are more sensitive than goldfish to ammonia levels and changing conditions. So as the goldfish grow and the ammonia level rises, you can have a die off of the cichlids. The die off would itself raise ammonia levels, which could in turn finish off the goldfish.

All of that said, some people have successfully raised them together, but the successful stories I've read usually involve a heater and filter system. Also, many raise cichlids in above ground systems because it is easier to control the temp.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Pets > Fish
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top