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Old 05-09-2014, 09:06 AM
 
Location: Orlando Metro Area
3,595 posts, read 6,910,540 times
Reputation: 2409

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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle19125 View Post
Geez you really wave the pompoms don't you? Huge success??? Trains loaded with non-paying customers hardly register as any kind of success if one possesses the logic of anyone in adulthood. Revenue dollars and ridership numbers combined will determine the real outcome.
So how many days have you used it to get to work? Obviously you've missed the crowds of commuters on the platforms add trains lol.

So how bout you stop the whole cheerleading comments add realize that I'm not here to argue something that's not up for debate.
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Old 05-09-2014, 11:26 AM
 
26,817 posts, read 43,286,237 times
Reputation: 31407
Quote:
Originally Posted by OrlFlaUsa View Post
So how many days have you used it to get to work? Obviously you've missed the crowds of commuters on the platforms add trains lol.

So how bout you stop the whole cheerleading comments add realize that I'm not here to argue something that's not up for debate.
Still not shining very bright are you??? The "crowds" of commuters are joyriding with free fares. Let's see how your crowds hold up when the free rides end.
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Old 05-09-2014, 11:42 AM
 
Location: Seattle, WA
2,975 posts, read 4,914,100 times
Reputation: 1222
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle19125 View Post
Geez you really wave the pompoms don't you? Huge success??? Trains loaded with non-paying customers hardly register as any kind of success if one possesses the logic of anyone in adulthood. Revenue dollars and ridership numbers combined will determine the real outcome.
... and I-4 clogged up with drivers who aren't paying tolls is considered a success?

And these are hardly "non-paying" customers. First of all, they pay taxes which went in to building the system. Same gripe with toll roads, right, "but we already paid to BUILD those roads...." Furthermore, most of these passengers DROVE to the stations, costing them gas, time, and wear and tear. Plus they're paying with their time waiting on the platform and stopping at every stop. Presumably most of these riders could have just driven directly to their destinations. Sure, they may have had to pay a few bucks for parking had they driven all the way, but it is hardly comparable to, say, taking the DC metro vs. driving and parking in downtown DC.

The reality is public transportation doesn't make money on it's own--whether it's a road or mass transit. Public highways don't make money in and of themselves, but they definitely enable individuals and businesses to make money, and thus have public value and should be paid for with taxes. Same with mass transit. Mass transit only makes money when it's coupled with real estate development. In this country, real estate development is generally private and transportation is public. Heck, not even private airlines are profitable based on passenger-paid airfare alone-they depend on cargo for profits! So can we please get beyond this idea that mass transit should not exist unless it is profitable on its own?
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Old 05-09-2014, 01:38 PM
 
26,817 posts, read 43,286,237 times
Reputation: 31407
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurricaneMan1992 View Post
... and I-4 clogged up with drivers who aren't paying tolls is considered a success?

And these are hardly "non-paying" customers. First of all, they pay taxes which went in to building the system. Same gripe with toll roads, right, "but we already paid to BUILD those roads...." Furthermore, most of these passengers DROVE to the stations, costing them gas, time, and wear and tear. Plus they're paying with their time waiting on the platform and stopping at every stop. Presumably most of these riders could have just driven directly to their destinations. Sure, they may have had to pay a few bucks for parking had they driven all the way, but it is hardly comparable to, say, taking the DC metro vs. driving and parking in downtown DC.

The reality is public transportation doesn't make money on it's own--whether it's a road or mass transit. Public highways don't make money in and of themselves, but they definitely enable individuals and businesses to make money, and thus have public value and should be paid for with taxes. Same with mass transit. Mass transit only makes money when it's coupled with real estate development. In this country, real estate development is generally private and transportation is public. Heck, not even private airlines are profitable based on passenger-paid airfare alone-they depend on cargo for profits! So can we please get beyond this idea that mass transit should not exist unless it is profitable on its own?
I-4 clogged with non-toll paying customers isn't a success but welcome to the reality of life in Florida, where many have "escaped" paying tolls and higher taxes in other states and have little intention of contributing to other options here. I have never mentioned mass transit and profitability in the same breath, as having lived in progressive areas where transit is embraced on a daily basis know it's a priceless part of the transportation infrastructure.
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Old 05-09-2014, 02:48 PM
 
Location: Orlando Metro Area
3,595 posts, read 6,910,540 times
Reputation: 2409
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle19125 View Post
Still not shining very bright are you??? The "crowds" of commuters are joyriding with free fares. Let's see how your crowds hold up when the free rides end.
So I'll take that as you have never stepped foot on a SunRail train and heard the conversations amongst riders regarding their plans to utilize the system.

Most commuters I talk to ON THE TRAIN have waited years to ditch their cars and have time to now read a book or check email.

As a naysayer you're entitled whatever flawed opinion you'd like, but that doesn't change the fact that SunRail is, and will continue to work.
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Old 05-09-2014, 05:41 PM
 
35,309 posts, read 51,983,690 times
Reputation: 30997
i guess success or failure of this venture will come down to how convenient it is for the regular commuter, do you want to be stuffed like a sardine in a railway car or do you want the comfort of your own car albeit potentially a bit longer and much traffic congestion, personally i'll take my car,
coffee? check,
Music? check
A/C check/
drive straight to work instead of waiting for a crowded bus to take me the rest of the way to work..
Repeat in reverse at the end of the day..
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Old 05-09-2014, 11:32 PM
 
Location: Orlando Metro Area
3,595 posts, read 6,910,540 times
Reputation: 2409
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
i guess success or failure of this venture will come down to how convenient it is for the regular commuter, do you want to be stuffed like a sardine in a railway car or do you want the comfort of your own car albeit potentially a bit longer and much traffic congestion, personally i'll take my car,
coffee? check,
Music? check
A/C check/
drive straight to work instead of waiting for a crowded bus to take me the rest of the way to work..
Repeat in reverse at the end of the day..
After taking the train for a few days to work, I had to use my car again because I had a funeral to go to after my shift in an odd part of town.

Driving was not only a pain in the neck because of traffic, but also I realized that I arrived to work more agitated than when I was able to relax and read a book, or converse with a stranger.

Maybe to you driving is more "comfortable," but I'll take a nice stroll to the station, and a stress-free ride any day over my car.

Oh and BTW, I can bring coffee, and music onto the air conditioned SunRail trains so I'm not sure I see your point.
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Old 05-10-2014, 03:25 AM
 
35,309 posts, read 51,983,690 times
Reputation: 30997
I guess if the station is a walk away and your destination is walkable at the other end and you dont mind rubbing shoulders with others this train is a godsend for you,Lets hope its a godsend to enough people to make it worth the money spent on the venture.
I think the vast majority of potential passengers would have to make a lengthy drive to the station then sit on a crowded train for an hour then try to find transport to their destination that maybe some miles away.

Last edited by jambo101; 05-10-2014 at 03:55 AM..
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Old 05-10-2014, 06:40 AM
 
Location: Orlando Metro Area
3,595 posts, read 6,910,540 times
Reputation: 2409
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
I guess if the station is a walk away and your destination is walkable at the other end and you dont mind rubbing shoulders with others this train is a godsend for you,Lets hope its a godsend to enough people to make it worth the money spent on the venture.
I think the vast majority of potential passengers would have to make a lengthy drive to the station then sit on a crowded train for an hour then try to find transport to their destination that maybe some miles away.
I see what you're saying, BUT first off the train has been busy not sardine packed in the morning so I've always had a seat and some space.

Two, you don't have to hope about enough people, because the train literally hits the heart of at least 3 major employment centers in Fl Hosp, ORMC, and DT Orlando, so walking after the train is easy.

Does anybody know how many people commute to downtown for work? My hunch is that if SunRail can even get a fraction of Fl Hosp, ORMC, and DT workers, ridership will be sufficient.
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Old 05-10-2014, 06:50 AM
 
35,309 posts, read 51,983,690 times
Reputation: 30997
Quote:
Originally Posted by OrlFlaUsa View Post
I see what you're saying, BUT first off the train has been busy not sardine packed in the morning so I've always had a seat and some space.

.
I was just going by a couple of pics in post 39 that seemed to jog my memory of what my experiences of public transit used to be.
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