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Old 10-08-2018, 06:25 PM
 
18,172 posts, read 16,392,470 times
Reputation: 9328

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Quote:
Originally Posted by handy99 View Post
$30 a year is very reasonable.
It's not the government doing anything to you. I think it is all in how we look at it. Do I want some person who cannot afford brakes, tires or wheel bearings driving a 75 MPH inches from me? No. Do I want one car to be able to pollute 20X as much as another and have my children breathing it and the results ending up in the water and ground? No.

For $30 a year that is an ultimate bargain. Think about how many millions of motor vehicles are driving around Florida. You are effectively saying that you'd rather have $20 or $30 in your pocket than having less people killed and injured (fact) and having cleaner air, land and water.

Modern cars are computers - and, like computers, they need a hardware and software check once in a while.

If people are frugal, then make it every two years. But the idea of others rolling down the same road in cars which are falling apart does not warm my heart.

Florida is by far the largest state not requiring vehicle emissions and safety testing. That means it is by far where the most unsafe and most polluting cars are. It's not unusual for an inspection to find bad tires, brakes, wheel or axle problems.

While I champion the idea of self-sufficiency, I think those who desire that level of independence should head for the hills of Idaho or WV where it doesn't affect 20+ millions others.

This illustrates the very point discussed earlier about the government. It reflects to some extent what people let it get away with. Gov. Scott may have counted on Floridians being so frugal than they would appreciate him trading cleanliness for savings. He may have been correct.

Aren't there a couple old sayings about that? "Do you want it fast - or do you want it right - or do you want it cheap? Pick two. Florida is not a poor state. In fact, they have amazing amounts of money from the tourism and people who don't send kids to school. Should they spend more of that money to clean things up?

That is a question for the voters. It was already answered by them in the positive, but just because people vote for a ballot initiative doesn't mean the politicians have to do it. Someone has to hold their feet to the fire until they do.
Keep in mind CA has some of the toughest emission laws in effect and FL does not and .. FL has much better air quality.

 
Old 10-09-2018, 11:43 AM
 
11,610 posts, read 10,431,928 times
Reputation: 7217
The recently released U.N. climate change report says that by 2040 the dire consequences of man-made climate change will become prevalent. Due to unchecked greenhouse gas emissions in recent decades (thanks to Republican man-made climate change deniers in the U.S.), the climate panel says a 40-50 reduction in greenhouse gas emissions by 2030 and a carbon neutral world by 2050 is necessary to check global warming within manageable levels.

https://www.npr.org/2018/10/08/65536...climate-change

The U.N. report warns of an environmental crisis by as early as 2040, including the mass die-off of coral reefs, unless unprecedented action is taken soon. An author of past U.N. climate change reports says that consequences such as massive wildfires and coral reef extinctions weren't even known a few years ago.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/07/c...port-2040.html

Are Floridians really going to forfeit their coral reefs and the associated marine life in the immediately coming years without a fight???

Obviously, increasing fossil fuel burning which is the current policy of the U.S. is not the answer, especially for areas on the front lines of accelerating sea level rise, warming oceans and atmospheres, and ocean acidification and marine life extinctions, such as Florida.

Unless Florida experiences a massive shift in its political priorities, which seems a prerequisite for a change in U.S. national policy, Florida's environmental degradation will accelerate with each passing year.

https://www.cbsnews.com/video/u-n-re...years-to-come/

Most Florida newspapers and media likely reported the U.N. report, but have any localized the story by interviewing politicians and writing editorials demanding action.

https://www.tampabay.com/ap/national...fe2b375cf7e4eb

It's shocking that the Tampa Bay Times, likely the Florida newspaper with the most Pulitzer Prizes, didn't even mention man-made climate change in its endorsement of Andrew Gillum for governor.

https://www.tampabay.com/opinion/edi...rnor-20181005/

The same newspaper's endorsement of Bill Nelson for the Senate also makes no mention of man-made climate change.

https://www.tampabay.com/opinion/edi...nate-20181004/

Sadly, the fact that not even the Tampa Bay Times is focused on the consequences of man-made climate change suggests to me that Florida, the U.S. and humanity are doomed to suffer the man-made climate change ravages that now are becoming obvious and will be much more painful in coming decades.

Has anybody seen any Florida endorsement editorials that emphasized the impact of man-made climate change and the necessity of major policy changes to contain it???

My belief is that no American who understands the consequences of man-made climate change, and most certainly, no Floridian, can afford to vote for man-made climate change deniers, nor even politicians who are not proactive in dealing with the problem, if given the choice. Until voters send the message to politicians to attack greenhouse gas emissions, there is little hope for mitigating the disastrous onslaught.

Meanwhile, Florida is living in blindness, ignorance and denial, under the influence of its man-made climate change deniers practicing Nazi-era "big lie" propaganda, such as that man-made climate change is a "hoax" or that news reports about man-made climate change are "fake news."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_lie

Last edited by WRnative; 10-09-2018 at 12:04 PM..
 
Old 10-09-2018, 01:43 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,317 posts, read 4,205,117 times
Reputation: 2822
@ WRnative: without citing your very lengthy posts (no issue):

1- You stated the although California has been under Democratic control for only the last 25 years, California’s bad environmental record is due to Republicans before then.

With same token, Democrats have dominated FL politics since Civil war until the 1990s when FL flipped to red. Why wouldn’t FL democrats be the ones we should blame, just like we, according to you, we should blame CA’s republicans of yesteryear?


2- You mention Nazis — are you aware that Nazis and Hitler were left-wing activists? Their ideology (and practice) was establishment of an iron-fisted central Govt, where a few dictate the rest how to live, work and think? It was also the Nazis who required political correctness, and did not tolerate dissent, and assassinate (politically or literally) their opponents.

Sound familiar?

Last edited by Henry10; 10-09-2018 at 01:53 PM..
 
Old 10-09-2018, 02:03 PM
 
12,017 posts, read 14,320,226 times
Reputation: 5981
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10 View Post
@ WRnative: without citing your very lengthy posts (no issue):

1- You stated the although California has been under Democratic control for only the last 25 years, California’s bad environmental record is due to Republicans before then.?
We all know we can blame Florida's republicans for their failure in the environment here.

Rick Scott was ready to drill off the Florida coast until it became politically unpopular to do so
 
Old 10-09-2018, 02:20 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,317 posts, read 4,205,117 times
Reputation: 2822
Quote:
Originally Posted by chopchop0 View Post
We all know we can blame Florida's republicans for their failure in the environment here.

Rick Scott was ready to drill off the Florida coast until it became politically unpopular to do so
25 years is not a short time. At least we need to see things move into the right direction. But just like California’s previous rule (GOP until 1990s) is not blameless, neither are FL Democrats who ran the state for 125 years, until 25 years ago. At least they could have fixed the sewers. But they didn’t.
 
Old 10-09-2018, 02:30 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,317 posts, read 4,205,117 times
Reputation: 2822
It takes decades to replace or upgrade sewer systems. It has to be done methodically and gradually. Democrats had 125 years and “did nothing.” Now we realize that sewers fuel the algae blooms! Duh!!!

South Florida Faces A Costly Sewage Problem | WLRN
 
Old 10-09-2018, 03:37 PM
 
11,610 posts, read 10,431,928 times
Reputation: 7217
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10 View Post
@ WRnative: without citing your very lengthy posts (no issue):

1- You stated the although California has been under Democratic control for only the last 25 years, California’s bad environmental record is due to Republicans before then.

With same token, Democrats have dominated FL politics since Civil war until the 1990s when FL flipped to red. Why wouldn’t FL democrats be the ones we should blame, just like we, according to you, we should blame CA’s republicans of yesteryear?


2- You mention Nazis — are you aware that Nazis and Hitler were left-wing activists? Their ideology (and practice) was establishment of an iron-fisted central Govt, where a few dictate the rest how to live, work and think? It was also the Nazis who required political correctness, and did not tolerate dissent, and assassinate (politically or literally) their opponents.

Sound familiar?
The baloney in this post is exemplified by the claim that the Nazis, who executed Communists, were "left-wing activists." Sadly, such "big lies" likely are gaining traction among Americans who have a palpable lack of knowledge of the history of American democracy, and the liberal democratic political philosophy undermining its creation.

No person with a knowledge of liberal democratic political regimes, and the philosophers who influenced the founding of the United States, would confuse a totalitarian political movement, such as Nazism, with a liberal democracy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Totalitarianism

Are you actually able to provide a source (e.g., perhaps some Fox News talking head) for your ignorant statement, or did you just create it out of your warped imagination? I'm curious, because many Americans likely won't be surprised to some day hear Donald Trump proclaim that "Nazis and Hitler were left-wing activists." Of course, then it would be fun to hear his explanation as to his tolerance, if not support, for American neo-Nazis.

Please don't pretend again that you're a conservative. You're an ignorant individual who doesn't even understand that true American conservatives seek to defend and promote liberal democratic values. I know this concept confuses you, but perhaps these articles will help you understand the grandeur of the American political experience and how it differs markedly from totalitarianism. The great political philosophers who inspired the American Revolution were deemed liberal because they sought to overthrow monarchism and the absence of democratic and other civil rights. Have you ever read John Locke, Rousseau, or Voltaire??? If not, please do so before dumping more manure on social media.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_democracy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_liberal_theorists

It's disturbing, even disgusting, that man-made climate changer deniers, such as yourself given your earlier posts in this thread, also have such a muddled understanding of American democracy and its sources.

Last edited by WRnative; 10-09-2018 at 04:10 PM..
 
Old 10-09-2018, 04:08 PM
 
11,610 posts, read 10,431,928 times
Reputation: 7217
Default Anticipated impacted of Hurricane Michel on red tide

Hurricane Michael is anticipated to break up the red tide off the west coast of Florida. If it doesn't, or if the red tide rapidly re-establishes itself, this likely will be a very bad foreshadowing of persistence of toxic algal blooms in the Florida environment.

https://www.accuweather.com/en/weath...break/70006295

One likelihood that I haven't seen discussed is Michael's impact on ocean temperatures. Hurricanes reportedly cool ocean areas over which they pass, and a cooler ocean should suppress algal growths.
 
Old 10-09-2018, 06:45 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,317 posts, read 4,205,117 times
Reputation: 2822
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
The baloney in this post is exemplified by the claim that the Nazis, who executed Communists, were "left-wing activists." Sadly, such "big lies" likely are gaining traction among Americans who have a palpable lack of knowledge of the history of American democracy, and the liberal democratic political philosophy undermining its creation.

No person with a knowledge of liberal democratic political regimes, and the philosophers who influenced the founding of the United States, would confuse a totalitarian political movement, such as Nazism, with a liberal democracy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Totalitarianism

Are you actually able to provide a source (e.g., perhaps some Fox News talking head) for your ignorant statement, or did you just create it out of your warped imagination? I'm curious, because many Americans likely won't be surprised to some day hear Donald Trump proclaim that "Nazis and Hitler were left-wing activists." Of course, then it would be fun to hear his explanation as to his tolerance, if not support, for American neo-Nazis..
You have no clue, do you!? LOL.

Hitler was a member and then leader if the German Workers Party, which was just another flavor of several left wing parties in Germany. German Workers Party, with Hitler at its helm, became the National Socialist Workers Party, a.k.a. NAZI.

Hitler and Nazi were anti-capitalist and anti-communist, because he considered both Jewish-driven. Secondly, Hitler believed communists stabbed Germany in the back during WWI, and third communism (with its three Internationals) was against Hitler’s ideas for Nazi Nationalism.

About Locke, Russeau, and Voltaire — again, you are confused because you have no idea, but simply are throwing names around.

And BTW Russeau enlightened Karl Marx with his political philosophy. Russeau attacked private property rights, and representative Republic. Many think that Russeau influenced Marx greatly.

But you wouldn’t know that, would you?

Let me get this thru your thick skull - Marxism is alive and well, in you, and many others who, although clueless, buy the garbage of all too powerful central Govt.
 
Old 10-09-2018, 07:05 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,317 posts, read 4,205,117 times
Reputation: 2822
You bought another Socialist lie — “Hitler killed communists. See? That makes Hitler a right wing!!”

You bought this BS hook, line and sinker.

Likewise, Stalin also killed Trotsky. Trotsky was a true communist, even led the 4th Communist Internationale. Does killing Troysky make Stalin a right-winger too?

The stupidity is beyond words...
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