[masssachoicetts]

Originally Posted by Dave_n_Tenn

For some, but not in totality. Funny how Texas and Florida are growing so much... wonder why?

For me it was the water. I'm a marine engineer by discipline so...

Baby Boomer population is reaching its retirement years, and coupled with falling birth rates the Northern states (Where theres the most upper-middle-class population) .. Boomers are flocking south to states like North Carolina, Delaware, Florida, Texas and Arizona. Why? Yu can turn in your 800k home and get a cheaper 250k condo/townhome in these states and bank the rest for retirement while enjoying nice weather for 6 months of the year, and flock back up north for the summer months in your vacation home/downsized seasonal estate.

Another point to make is families up north are having less and fewer kids. The total fertility rate is ~1.5-1.6 children per woman in Massachusetts, New York, Vermont, New Hampshire and I think Maryland? Well anyway... the fewer kids you have, the less your margin of growth will be. So the population of retirement-aged people coupled with lower fertility rates as couples decided to have fewer children (A phenomenon seen across the Western world and Japan), the population will inevitably shrink. The only things keep some states growing up North are the influx of young people looking for stable and good jobs from the Southeast and New York area, and International Migration. Fertility is lowest in the most developed and highest quality nations like Sweden, Switzerland, Finland, the Netherlands and Germany.

Without an absolute doubt, Florida, North Carolina, and Arizona are great states to retire too and at least two of those states don't tax your retirement pension plans. So it makes so much sense for older folks to list their permanent address in Florida and come down either permanently or seasonally. That is why the population in the Northern half is flat (Not shrinking yet) and the Southeast population is growing at a moderate pace.

Raising your kids up north/mid atlantic down through NC, retiring to the Southeast to have a heightened quality of life seems the way to go in 2020.

Of course there are outside factors that play a role, but thats the summary of whats going on demographically in the US.

However in the tax discussion, you really have to break the state's down individually.. Illinois and New York State offer the WORST bang for your tax buck in the country in my opinion. Illinois is heavily corrupt and the City of Chicago is royally screwed on a financial note. New York State only cares about NYC, and if you live anywhere else, youre royally screwed. They have started paying attention to Upstate NY, but it really is too late. However, if you livein Minnesota, Massachusetts, parts of Northern New Jersey or New Hampshire.. you probably get the best bang for your buck tax dollar over dollar. All four of these states rank top 10 for education, have amazing institutions, are impeccably clean (Except NJ) and are generally the healthiest states in the lower 48. Theres a biiiiiggg difference between NY State and NH State and MA state and MD state. They all run completely different. I believe my taxes in MA go to great things. Funding a 10 billion dollar fix to the T, approving a 31 billion dollar electrification of the commuter rail, high teacher, cop and FF pay and a phenomenal education system. Recently, the infrastructure projects have been approved and started in record numbers and we've knocked up a few rankings in that. We have a R governor, but hes not doing a bad job. He is socially liberal and keeps the communities together of all races, sexual orientations and ethnicities.. which I'm very okay with. He not all for the rich, he's done his fair share in his part in the affordability crisis, but Im pleased with what my tax dollars have gone too. Even if 25k of my income is being sent to state/fed. In NYC? I was not satisfied with my tax dollars, the city was a dump. Its all depends where you live in. But again, I would call it the farthest thing from a failed system.

[Dave_n_Tenn]

If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it.

[masssachoicetts]

Originally Posted by Dave_n_Tenn

If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it.

Never heard that one/nor is this a 'not simple' description. But I have you cornered on this one

[Dave_n_Tenn]

Originally Posted by masssachoicetts

Never heard that one/nor is this a 'not simple' description. But I have you cornered on this one

lol... Albert Einstein Quotes
If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.

[Dave_n_Tenn]

The corner is lonely.

[RMESMH]

Originally Posted by beach43ofus

https://www.foxbusiness.com/money/bi...ead-to-florida

https://www.bdb.org/news/2019/05/24/...rthern-states/

Really? You had better tell these 2 publications. 1 focuses upon 5 Billionaires that moved to Florida recently, and the other says the average income of those moving to Florida from 10 states is $100,000+, and those moving from Connecticut average $253,000/yr.

After you read these artcles, are you still so sure?

And another billionaire (fed up with the taxes in NY) preceded those 5....Tom Golisano, the founder of Paychex and husband of Monica Seles.

[masssachoicetts]

Originally Posted by Hyper-Duel

Debatable. I'm going to use Maine for my example, the state has generous benefits if you lost your job (a lot better than FL), that's because a good chunk of the state have workers who are poorer and work two/three jobs depending on the season. However, if you are making $50K+ your taxes increases. It all comes down to will you use the state's benefits when you need it the most. Or for some residents like the last Maine Gov Paul Lepage they just move to FL because they don't want to pay for other people's benefits. Can't blame him honestly, in retirement your money goes a lot farther in FL than up there.

I still don't mind moving back north (I prefer Spring/Summer/Fall so much more up there), but even with the pay increases my spending power decreases a bit due to the COL and of course taxes.

Im not too familiar with taxes in Maine. Most of my family is in Middle Connecticut and Rhode Island, or Boston. The ones from CT look down on anybody from outside Coastal Haven lol. Not throwing shade at Ct here, but theres a lot of uneeded pride. Im just glad their sox fans lol. But anyway, I really dont understand why Maine doesnt follow a tax system like New Hampshire?

NH seems to be a state on the table for most ma ssholes who dont want to perish in FL Heat.. but again its NH. People rather move to Maine. Maine could attract a lot more folk if they lowered their income tax so they could get some retirees. One of, if not the prettiest state in the Eastern Half of the country

[bmw335xi]

Unless you are low income, you dont really see the benefits of high taxes in most cases.

[Scottamemnon]

Originally Posted by masssachoicetts

Im not too familiar with taxes in Maine. Most of my family is in Middle Connecticut and Rhode Island, or Boston. The ones from CT look down on anybody from outside Coastal Haven lol. Not throwing shade at Ct here, but theres a lot of uneeded pride. Im just glad their sox fans lol. But anyway, I really dont understand why Maine doesnt follow a tax system like New Hampshire?

NH seems to be a state on the table for most ma ssholes who dont want to perish in FL Heat.. but again its NH. People rather move to Maine. Maine could attract a lot more folk if they lowered their income tax so they could get some retirees. One of, if not the prettiest state in the Eastern Half of the country

There are people in CT who still have state pride, in the middle of the state no less? I could understand if you were in the Greenwich area. Wow, must be the last suckers there. I am from Western MA and worked in CT for 15 years up until 2018 when I got the hell out by going Remote with my job. Now all I hear about from my co-workers and network up there is where they are planning to move to because of all the new taxes each year. CT and NJ are the poster children of government mismanagement of funds. All the wealth in the world, yet their debt is insane... eventually the whole house of cards will come crashing down.

When it comes to retirees, in CT there has been a long standing issue with elderly people having to leave the state because the property taxes have increased at a rate that they cannot keep the homes they have owned for 50+ years. I don't understand all the hate against such people for leaving you see on boards like this.

[bmw335xi]

From my experience in high tax states, the majority of the money goes to government officials and government employees to their pensions. California gets a massive amount of tax revenue, yet infrastructure in Florida I find better, even my liberal uncle who did a cross country bike trip from San Francisco to St. Augustine said he was surprised that Florida had some of the best if not best quality roads during the entire trip. I remember seeing local news articles when I lived in California about the crazy pensions government employees and officials were receiving, many have 6 figures for life. That’s where the money ends up.