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Old 07-27-2012, 08:11 AM
 
18,094 posts, read 16,365,547 times
Reputation: 25191

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spring Hillian View Post
There is no way "right to work" laws has anything to do with being fired.


People don't usually loose jobs for "no reason". Employers usually value competent employees while wedding out the incompetent. It makes no sense for an employer large enough to be covered under federal laws to discriminate due to the reasons you stated.

In my 40 years in the workforce, I've never seen somebody "fired" for no reason. I've seen layoffs, department closures, downsizing, budget cuts, and terminations due to ineptitude, constant poor work performance, but never for r race, your religion, your political standing, your sex, etc
You are correct, it is unusual in the grand scheme of things for an employer to fire for illegal reasons, but it does happen, and it happens many times throughout the US, one just has to read EEOC findings to know this.

I have seen people fired for no reason, the firings come from incompentent managers, I have seen a few employees get employed again after an internal investigation found the manager at fault (which resulted in the demotion or termination of the manager).
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Old 07-27-2012, 09:13 AM
 
12,022 posts, read 12,662,533 times
Reputation: 5981
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle19125 View Post
You're right, I was confusing the term with At-Will Employment which is another employee unfriendly law in place here in Florida.

Employment At Will: What Does It Mean? | Nolo.com
Kyle, did you read your own link? It's not just in FL. Pretty much every state in the nation outside of Montana

Quote:
If you are employed at will, your employer does not need good cause to fire you. In every state but Montana (which protects employees who have completed an initial "probationary period" from being fired without cause), employers are free to adopt at-will employment policies, and many of them have. In fact, unless your employer gives some clear indication that it will only fire employees for good cause, the law presumes that you are employed at will.
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:33 AM
 
Location: Spring Hill Florida
12,135 posts, read 14,603,693 times
Reputation: 6053
Let me again clarify:

Right to Work State: State law prohibits employers from forcing employees to join a union in order to obtain or keep the job.


Employment at Will: You can get let go anytime.


If someone can tell me of a state where an employer cannot fire an employee for any justifiable reason please let mek know.

Right to Work has nothing to do with the termination of employment. Who is he going to file a grievance with? If he is a union member or in a collective bargaining unit, he may be able to do so.

Your Ft. DeSoto buddy may want to entertain a law suit for age discrimination.



Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
My brother just lost his job as new management took over the small company,fired the 12 guys working there and hired all new personnel, i told my brother to file a grievance of unfair dismissal he laughed saying jim its a right to work state meaning you got no rights at all.
Another buddy working at Ft Desoto park as general maintenance also got terminated after 20yrs about 6 months ago,to date no reason given other than laid off due to shortage of work which strikes him as kinda funny as a guy with half his tenure and salary is now doing the same job..
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:44 AM
 
Location: Native Floridian, USA
5,110 posts, read 6,813,420 times
Reputation: 6797
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spring Hillian View Post
There is no way "right to work" laws has anything to do with being fired.


People don't usually loose jobs for "no reason". Employers usually value competent employees while wedding out the incompetent. It makes no sense for an employer large enough to be covered under federal laws to discriminate due to the reasons you stated.

In my 40 years in the workforce, I've never seen somebody "fired" for no reason. I've seen layoffs, department closures, downsizing, budget cuts, and terminations due to ineptitude, constant poor work performance, but never for r race, your religion, your political standing, your sex, etc
I always like your posts and you are right about the right to work laws and employment at will.

eta: age discrimination is the hardest to fight and win. I, myself, was caught up in a general layoff at age 50 and later, the person that began doing my job was 25 and was paid at a much lower rate than myself. It wasn't worth the effort to me, knowing what I knew. I just moved on and started my own business.

But, first, it's "lose" not "loose", common misspelling and "weeding" not "wedding". I will probably misspell the next 10 words myself. LOL.

You cannot discriminate because of race, creed, religion or age. If you are covered under these laws, you can sue through the EEOC. Coverage

I was a Human Resources Manager for many years and these terms are common misconceptions. What Spring Hillian says in the second and third paragraphs are true. Sometimes, what happens just isn't fair but it happens.

In our area of Florida, we had a long time company owned by Coca Cola sold to a Brazilian company. The Brazilian company came in, fired everybody to a man and rehired some after reviews of their work history, etc. The previous employees didn't lose their pension benefits, if they were vested but, they were just gone. Sad but, true.

I have never worked for a company that gave regular bonuses and during economic downturns, we often took cuts in pay or raises were slim to none and I worked for large, sometimes multi national companies. It can be a dog eat dog world but, it is what it is. I was always glad to have a job and worked very hard to have a good work record.

eta: I was caught up in a general layoff at age 50 and the person they put in my position was 25 and paid a much lower
wage than myself. Since I was familiar with the laws, it wasn't worth the effort to me. I moved on and started my own business.

A friend of mine that was a bank VP was part of an age discrim. suit against one of the largest banks in the US. It appeared to be a blatant violation of the law but, unfortunately, they did not prevail and win their suit. **** happens.
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Old 07-27-2012, 05:21 PM
 
17 posts, read 25,319 times
Reputation: 22
It's not a good thing because it gives people with emotional and mental issues that happen to already be in positions of power, absolute power. I hear people saying "its rare people get fired for no reason." not now adays. Alot of people in management positions are psychopaths, sociopaths, egotists, or power trippers, especially in retail.
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Old 07-28-2012, 06:05 AM
 
Location: Hernando County, FL
8,488 posts, read 19,201,457 times
Reputation: 5397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
Another buddy working at Ft Desoto park as general maintenance also got terminated after 20yrs about 6 months ago,to date no reason given other than laid off due to shortage of work which strikes him as kinda funny as a guy with half his tenure and salary is now doing the same job..
Wouldn't it make more sense for a county making budget cuts to terminate the guy making twice as much doing the same job? If it was just the 2 working there at maintenance then the total salary for maintenance workers was just cut by 66%.
Not saying it is a good thing but it makes sense from a financial standpoint.
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Old 07-28-2012, 09:01 AM
 
2,932 posts, read 4,515,103 times
Reputation: 1807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike1306 View Post
Wouldn't it make more sense for a county making budget cuts to terminate the guy making twice as much doing the same job? If it was just the 2 working there at maintenance then the total salary for maintenance workers was just cut by 66%.
Not saying it is a good thing but it makes sense from a financial standpoint.
It makes financial sense for some to deny people medical care,pollute the environment,reserve education for the affluent, usury,exploitation, etc,etc. We should be better than that. As with almost everything, the answer is somewhere in the middle. Unfortunately it seems moderation is currently akin to balancing a bowling ball on a pin head.
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Old 07-28-2012, 09:11 AM
 
23,627 posts, read 35,982,780 times
Reputation: 23891
Quote:
Originally Posted by chopchop0 View Post
It's not just in FL. Pretty much every state in the nation outside of Montana
True, however it's more common in some states more so than others in terms of those that utilize the right. It's pretty well-documented in Florida's small business community. I didn't hear of or experience it in other states I lived in (NC, VA, DC, PA), probably due to the prevalence of unions.
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Old 07-28-2012, 02:18 PM
 
12,022 posts, read 12,662,533 times
Reputation: 5981
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle19125 View Post
True, however it's more common in some states more so than others in terms of those that utilize the right. It's pretty well-documented in Florida's small business community. I didn't hear of or experience it in other states I lived in (NC, VA, DC, PA), probably due to the prevalence of unions.
NC and VA don't strike me as union strongholds. If anything, they are "purple" swing states like FL
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Old 07-29-2012, 05:21 AM
 
Location: Hernando County, FL
8,488 posts, read 19,201,457 times
Reputation: 5397
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryWho? View Post
It makes financial sense for some to deny people medical care,pollute the environment,reserve education for the affluent, usury,exploitation, etc,etc. We should be better than that. As with almost everything, the answer is somewhere in the middle. Unfortunately it seems moderation is currently akin to balancing a bowling ball on a pin head.
It is against the law to deny emergency medical care to someone, there are laws in place to protect the environment, there are a multitude of government and private programs to help those that are not affluent go to college and there are also laws to protect people in the workplace, it just so happens that there is not a law that says they need to keep paying someone more than someone else to do the same job.
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