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I only wish my neighborhood association would enforce the covenenants. When you live on small lots and have covenenats you don't expect major violations.
If your kids have bunches of cars out front day after day after day, I can understand. Most people understand a party but not cars on the street all the time.
Believe me, my parents have a nice home on the water - main channel - right across from a wildlife preserve --- older subdivision -- no covenants. You would think that the nice homes would make a difference ---- no --- anything goes and does go. In addition to everything else it has really hurt their property values with neighbors who do not care.
Who in their right mind would pay for this harassment? I would end up in criminal court because I would have to resort to my affordable method of mediation, with Smith and Wesson, F.A. How do these people gather evidence, or do they just make it up? Do they have their own "kangaroo court"? Back in the good days of Florida there were no HOA's and people were much happier and friendlier. This arrangement is not in line with "southern hospitality".
Look, I am a non-confrontational, basically caring person that is an easy target as a push-over. But I have my proverbial gunny-sack...
for 5 years, I never received a letter of violation, or even a word from my HOA about problems with my property. Until 2 years ago.
2 years ago, I had a heated argument with this lady about financing a capital project. They wanted to hide this charge in the operating budget because during regular meetings, almost no home owners show up. Well, I was there and it got heated. She lost her cool, as well as myself.
Since then, I have gotten a letter for the fact that my teenager parked his front tire on the grass one night. One because the board thought that there are regularly too many cars in front of my property during day time hours (my boys play video games in the basement with friends; thy prefer many friends). I had a tile setter do work at my house. He left his beat-up, old pick-up in my driveway overnight. Multiple violations: unsightly car, logo's on the side etc etc etc. I went to the store and bought potted plants. I took them out of the car and placed them on my side walk to the front door. Admittedly, I left them there several days before planting. Letter that potted plants can only be on pathways unless the board gives permission. For years I hang these nice flags outside that have to do with the seasons. Yes, it violates the by-laws. But for years nobody seemed to bother. They are gone now.
We fortunately do not pay for any letters sent to us, and obviously, all these were easy to remedy.
I tried to talk it out with the board and they talk. But they say: article blah blah says that you can not park on the grass. Article blah blah says that you can not hang flags outside etc etc etc.
Yes, this lady is retired. She has nothing else to do. But from several board meetings, I am getting the clear picture that she bullies the board with her seniority (she has been on it for 10 years and knows everything) and that the rest of the board just follows along for the ride.
Again, I don't have any left over money to finance an attorney. I have a nice home, but we can barely pay the bills. I have asked around and it seems that the minimum legal counsel is several hundreds. Reality will be several thousands.
What is driving these types of people? They use HOA by-laws to fight private wars. I think she wants me to leave the community. And why must it be so darn expensive to get these issues corrected.
I tell you: I will NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER buy a house in a community with an HOA. NEVER EVER. Give me some punks in a garage, because they will grow up one day. But this harassment seems unstoppable.
Any coping strategies, short of expensive legal advise and moving please.
Jane.
Jane,
Like it your not, you have violated some of the rules, not in any huge way, but a violation none the less. If you take a pot out of your car and set it on the walk it is a violation, even if it is for a second. It is a matter of degree. If you take care of it in a timely manner, no big deal, a matter of degree. If they want to write you a letter, and you have already taken care of what ever minor issue they feel necessary to cite you for, no big deal. No one, not even them, are going to go through a major court suit to address such trivial matters. They are doing their job, maybe over reacting somewhat, but its a matter of degree too. Relax, keep your cool, they will move on. If you agiatate the situation with them, they will keep you on the agenda. Take the high road, keep your chin up, and try not to take it personal. If that person likes to agitate people, it will cycle around to her. Stay the course, don't let it wear on you too much. Good Luck!
You're right, they're only letters and there's little harm done when you only receive letters.
Those letters do cost your HOA money to produce however, and that comes out of a budget you fund, so I can see why you want this behavior to stop.
It sounds like you broke some of the rules, even if only briefly. Imagine if one of your neighbors is selling their house and a potential buyer notices your parking violations? That buyer might walk thinking "why should I pay for this HOA, when they don't even enforce the rules here?". So even "one day" of breaking the rules might affect your neighbors in a negative way, and you all agreed not to do that when you bought your homes in an HOA neighborhood.
I don't doubt that the board member may have some residual anger towards you because you had a confrontation. So you may be drawing more attention than you would otherwise.
Why not send a nice letter to the board member apologizing for allowing the confrontation to get out of hand and you hope that there are no hard feelings because you feel as if you're now being singled out by these "zero tolerance" letters?
You don't have to admit fault about the confrontation, only that you allowed it to escalate further than it should have, and you don't have to argue whether you've been in violation or not (it sounds like you have been), you only need to say "hey, stop picking on me". Carbon copy this letter to all the board members and to the property management company.
Be professional, be succinct, don't be emotional.
I had a dispute with my HOA over a 2 foot square piece of lawn that was less than perfect in my otherwise perfect lawn. My lawn could have been in a Scotts commercial and they went after me for a 2 foot square piece I was battling (which was hidden behind the electric box). Meanwhile, my neighbors had violations all over the place and lawns that were weedy for 6 months or more. I followed my own advice above and they backed off .
HOAs are what they are and they're all over Florida. For the most part, they're no big deal, but you've got to be willing to follow the rules to the letter or you can have a big headache .
What was the outcome ? Did it any complaint make it to the court? Or did it stop before ever getting filed?
And I"m curious to know did your attorney say you could also include the individuals in the complaint?
The case never made it to court...the board basically had to admit that they were discriminating by not enforcing the rules equally...all fines were suspended and returned......after the first meeting of the attorneys..
The violating board members were served individually and as a group, as well as the HOA...punitive damages were sought against the board members that were pushing the issue...the suit was settled before money exchanged hands...but the board had to pay our attorney fee's out of their own pocket......Basically...in our case...their attorney acknowledged that they were selectively enforcing the parking rules and as such...if the case ever went to court...they (the HOA) would loose...
I've been following this thread, and for me it just reaffirms my plans to find a house in Florida without an HOA. I have no plans to park abandoned cars on my property or otherwise deface the neighborhood, but leaving a garage door open, or having potted plants along your walkway? Please. I feel that people should live and let live unless the behavior is creating a health or safety issue. In my current neighborhood there is no HOA, but the county has zoning laws that address a lot of these things. And sometimes just talking to your neighbors about noise or other issues will resolve the problem. I'm not saying there are exceptions, and I guess I run the risk of moving next door to the neighbor from hell, but I'll take my chances.
In this area, communities with an HOA are cheaper. We moved during a supply crunch here. Meaning: sold our house quick with a decent profit. However, the supply in our new area was 2 hours. We tried to bid on almost 30 houses, until we were homeless. Then this came around. Was on the market for 1 hour. The owner was still in the driveway and we signed whatever he asked. We had no choice. Kids had to go to school. So the argument that we "choose to live here" is VERY relative. All homes without the dreaded HOA were totally unaffordable.
There is a difference in my opinion, between clear violation and petty harassment. It seems that there are so many ways that HOA's can put a human face on these issues (what is so difficult about a neighborly knock on the door and chat), but no: cease and desist must be immediately wielded. It seems to me that HOA bylaws and regulations are more an instrument of inquisition and neighbor control than trying to keep property values in check.
At one point, our HOA sent out a letter congratulating everyone because all property values had almost doubled, mostly due to the fact that they are so vigilant enforcing rules and regulations. Now that the values are cut back in half, where did that argument go? I clearly do not believe that property value blabber.
HOA power plays are destroying this community. My neighbors walk around like these zombies on The Truman Show: fake laugh, until out of sight. No sense of community at all. Just waiting for the next violation letter.
Sorry, I had promised myself to stay positive. Almost went down the drain again. I am forced to live here but at the first opportunity, I am out of here.
I've been following this thread, and for me it just reaffirms my plans to find a house in Florida without an HOA. I have no plans to park abandoned cars on my property or otherwise deface the neighborhood, but leaving a garage door open, or having potted plants along your walkway? Please. I feel that people should live and let live unless the behavior is creating a health or safety issue. In my current neighborhood there is no HOA, but the county has zoning laws that address a lot of these things. And sometimes just talking to your neighbors about noise or other issues will resolve the problem. I'm not saying there are exceptions, and I guess I run the risk of moving next door to the neighbor from hell, but I'll take my chances.
Having an HOA adds an extra element, that's for sure. When you don't like what the HOA is doing, you'll hate having one. When the HOA is addressing something the city never would, you'll be glad to have the HOA. It's a dual-edged sword for sure.
My HOA's rules are pretty basic and straightforward. I can leave my garage door open 24/7 if I wish to, have all the potted plants I want, park on my driveway or the street, etc.
All they care about is that I keep the appearance of my home looking decent. Mow the lawn, keep it green, trim the shrubs - all reasonable requests.
It's near impossible to have a newer home in my city and not have an HOA, so it's just part of the deal .
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thejan
At one point, our HOA sent out a letter congratulating everyone because all property values had almost doubled, mostly due to the fact that they are so vigilant enforcing rules and regulations. Now that the values are cut back in half, where did that argument go? I clearly do not believe that property value blabber.
Exactly! I think the HOA claim that they "keep property values up" is a crock . I don't think they do a thing for property values - my home would be worth the same with or without an HOA, I feel sure of it.
What can I do, short of going to get legal help, if a board member decides it is time to start a personal vendetta against you and bully the rest of the meek board into following suit? She is making our lives living hell here by singling us out for minor infractions (like our garage door open longer than 30 minutes, supposedly).
Any words of wisdom on how to deal with board members turned bullys?
Thanks, Jane.
Jane,
I know you wrote this 2 years ago....but when i entered my subject....your story came up....i'm curious as to what ever happened in your situation..
My story is one of our board members has a vendetta against me so much as to have taken me to court and by lying to the judge...he got a restraining order against me...i wanted to throw out the question, can a board member have a restraining order against one of the members..isn't that a conflict of interest?...because i too am getting ridiculous fines and this board member has bullied the other members to agree with him...I am looking for a good real estate attorney specializing in HOA discrimination suits in ventura county,california, anyone know one?
Jane,
.I am looking for a good real estate attorney specializing in HOA discrimination suits in ventura county,california, anyone know one?
Since this is a Florida forum, you'd likely get a better answer in Cali.
Sounds like a miserable experience.
My HOA hasn't produced any horror stories. Not as gestapo as some of the of communities of members of this thread.
I like to keep my garage door open and exercise, wax the car, listen to music, read the paper, and even watch TV. I'd cry if I had to close the door and not utilize the garage as I'd like. It is very neat/orderly - but no complaints (yet).
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They Settled!!
...Basically...in our case...their attorney acknowledged that they were selectively enforcing the parking rules and as such...if the case ever went to court...they (the HOA) would loose...
hoa nightmare
