[c3po]

Originally Posted by compelled to reply

Give them at least three years. It might take 5. Same "honeymoon" excuse as Florida except it might take a little longer for the second honeymoon to end, but the end will be twice as tragic. Then they will move back to FL and inevitably the same thing will happen because it is within you.

No. I can think of .... 10 people right off the bat, people b/w the ages of 25 up to 60-something, that would not move back to FL, and they have been there for 10, 15 yrs. I also have friends that moved up there, my age, and many have stayed. I can think of 2 friends from FL that moved to NC, and then returned. One of them is happy in FL, and the other misses NC and wants to move back. I speak from experience, I know these people, many of them for yrs, some are family members, and I'd say 8 out of 10 are happier in NC.

I like FL too, I know you defend it quite often, but this topic is more in my realm compelled. I have lived both. You have no idea how many people in NC are from FL, and many of which, are happier. But think about it, why wouldnt they be happier? Overall, nicer people, it's prettier, better economy/more diverse job opportunities, not so hot in the summer, change of seasons, less crime, less traffic/congestion, less road rage, the leaves change colors, etc...

[beckycat]

Originally Posted by ArtSpooner

I thought I wanted to leave Florida for good back in '99. So I rented my house out and tried going back to Pa where I grew up. I stayed for 2 years and missed Florida . I moved back to Florida and decided to do both. I now go to Pa in May and come back to Florida in October.. But I try to stay in Florida longer as I get bored up north (small town as well).. But leaving both places makes me appreciate the other more. I like the seeing the leaves change and the cool weather.

But Florida has more diversity and I have alot more friends there.

We are originally from PA also. We tried a similar scenerio this summer. We went to PA for a month to visit family. We stayed in a SD with a pool, lake and activities. I thought that would make it more fun. Athough it was very relaxing, the kids were so bored! The weather was a nice break. But all in all, everything is so far away and it doesn't have the same vibe. I really like FL, but the main reason I'd want to leave is b/c the humidity and heat just lasts too long. Don't get me wrong, the winters are beautiful. I do like the change of seasons. I want to try NC, but on the other hand, I don't want to feel like PA. I think with all the diversity there and better weather it would work.

[c3po]

Beckycat, try Asheville.

[Nanny Goat]

I hear so many good thing about NC from people everywhere.

[c3po]

^^^ It depends on where and what your looking for.

[Alphaman]

Really what does it matter if say 1000 people move to North Carolina and 900 love it and 100 come back to Florida?

No place is perfect for everyone and just because more people allegedly like NC more does not mean it is better there for everyone.

With all those people moving there it will get over crowded some day and the same problems will crop up.

[c3po]

^^^ If that happens, that will be pretty darn disappointing, as FL and NC are my 2 favorite states, for different reasons. We have already seen what has happened to most of South FL and Orlando, it would be crappy if that happened to NC too. It is already starting in Charlotte from what I've gathered.

[beckycat]

Originally Posted by c3po

Beckycat, try Asheville.

Why Asheville, just curious?

[doggiebus]

I know all about manufactured homes, my parents own a second home built like this. So I know plenty about it. It gives people a false security, its really sad. My parents know to not put anything of value in the 2nd home, as it could get destroyed. Even it can resist a hurricane of Cat 3, it will not survive a tornado that is part of hurricanes. Or the flying debris like a 2x4, a 2x4 will go right through that Hardy board (I went though Hurricane Andrew Cat 5, FYI.) I will never forget this 2x4 that was stuck in this HUGE Royal Palm near a friends home, that Hardy Board will be nothing for that 2x4.

I hope for your sake, you will never have to go through a storm while owning a manufactured home. I truely hope you don't.

To all those thinking of buying a stick built home, a mobile home or manufactured home, make sure you have the proper amount of home insurance because you most likely will be needing it to replace everything.
If you can buy a condo that is CBS or a home that is CBS.

Originally Posted by harry chickpea

I have to strongly disagree with this and another comment in the thread. Yes, there are mobile homes and manufactured homes that are very poorly constructed, especially if you are looking at the older models that weren't as highly regulated by HUD. However, I've also stood on the construction floor of a manufactured housing plant that was making homes for MEMA (Mississippi Emergency Management Authority). Those homes had so much redundancy in them that it was overkill. They were rated for CAT3 storms if properly secured, and designed to be deployed along the Gulf Coast. I suspect that if not hit by a lot of debris, they would weather a CAT4.

In contrast, many of the stick-built homes along the Florida Gulf Coast that were built prior to the strengthening of the building codes are crackerboxes that were built on the cheap because of legislative pressure from area builders. We were shaking our heads in disbelief down in Dade and Broward Counties when the legislature allowed the exemptions. Given a choice, I'd ride out a CAT2 or CAT3 in the MEMA home and seek public shelter if I lived in one of those crackerboxes. Obviously, I'd not take a chance in an older unrated mobile home.

Making a blanket statement about the quality of manufactured housing is simply impossible. We chose manufactured over stick-built because of a number of factors, not the least of which is that it allowed us to get 2x6" wall studs instead of 2x4" studs in a comparable stick built. It doesn't take a physicist to figure out which is stronger in a storm. As to any comment that "you really don't know how they put it together," well, as a matter of fact we do. We watched our home being constructed. As long as we stayed in safe areas and didn't disturb the work, the company was happy to let us watch construction. I saw no major flaws, confirmed standard construction techniques and practices, and I know for sure that the home can easily withstand 60mph winds, because it had to do so when it was delivered - on a foundation that was constantly moving instead of being strapped in place. Try doing that with a stick-built home and see how many miles you go.

I will say that one particular upgrade we made was a big factor in our happiness with the end result. Instead of the typical thin vinyl siding that doesn't fare well in storms and eventually has all sorts of problems, we opted for a cementous Hardy Board siding, which is far stronger, longer lasting, and so fire resistant that I used the scraps of it to contain a pit campfire.

There are issues that you can find in modern manufactured housing, but with the huge fines that HUD inspectors can impose (and there are always HUD inspectors at the plants), the problems are going to be cosmetic and lower cost materials rather than major construction issues with the basic box.

Where many people get an erroneous impression of manufactured housing is from watching the news, which loves to show helicopter shots of TORNADO devastation through mobile home parks. Let me put it this way. If your home is hit by any of the stronger tornadoes, unless it is a bunker with no windows, it IS going to be devastated. Tornado winds are not only far stronger than hurricane winds (except the hurricanes that contain tornadoes), they typically are debris laden and involve huge fast pressure shifts that can literally pull open the grain of wood. If you watch the news a little more closely in some of those helicopter shots, you'll see brick and stick-built homes equally devastated. So much for the failings of manufactured housing.


Now, on to a reality check for those who haven't had the actual experience. After dealing with the aftermath of Andrew for my employer, which had a location in Homestead and Kendall, and relatively comfortably living through the days without power after Wilma, because I pre-planned, would I be eager to return to hurricane country? He-double L NO. We were fortunate with Wilma that our home sustained no damage other than a couple of shingle ends flying off. What I did see was a HUGE difference in the way the insurance companies treated their customers compared to after Andrew, and a HUGE difference in the attitudes of the inspectors that had to approve the work.

I witnessed a neighbor, who used the same insurance company that I used, suffer through waiting for an adjustor, who didn't know his job, then have to wait for another, who under-estimated the work, to a public adjustor, who finally estimated properly (a couple months after the event). Once the work was started, there were problems with the roofers, a wait for an inspection with a denial, re-work to correct it, another wait which was lengthened because, because... sorry, I just have to describe this in a little detail...

The requirement to get a roof inspection not only was to fill out the paperwork and take a number, but that at certain stages the work had to be stopped (regardless of weather or schedules) for the inspectors to physically be able to go up on the roof and inspect.

The rules were that not only did the homeowner have to supply an OSHA approved ladder that could carry the weight of an overweight inspector, but that it had to be secured to the roof by ropes and left in place from the time of the request until the inspector visited. That length of time was often as much as two weeks or more, where tar paper was baking out the volitiles that keep it flexible, and subject to tearing by strong winds.

I saw the underlayments of roofs having to be redone, because the inspector waited weeks before coming, and the tar paper disintigrated. I've seen inspectors arrive, look at a ladder, and then leave without a word or note.

I saw many houses with blue tarps and leaks, MONTHS after the hurricane, because the homeowner couldn't find a competent roofer at any price.

So my neighbor FINALLY got his roof completed and approved, and then had to try to get his back covered patio rebuilt and approved. A year after the storm it was about done. In the interim, he had to have an engineer sign off on professionally drawn plans, order in panels from out of state to meet the new code requirements, etc. etc..

Living through a hurricane is a piece of cake if you are prepared at all. Living through the aftermath, if you had any damage to your property, can be enough stress to take years off your life.

I suppose, if I were to go back to hurricane country to live, I would bring as few personal belongings and effects as possible, and live in a cheap trailer on private land. That way, I'd avoid the loss of valuables in a storm or by theft, skip the high taxes and insurance, and if the hurricane damaged the thing, be able to shrug my shoulders, say "Oh well." and walk away whistling.

As for folks who build expensive houses on the barrier islands and then complain, I have one question - "What part of the words inevitable total destruction don't you understand?"

[c3po]

Originally Posted by beckycat

Why Asheville, just curious?

Diversity, good weather, nice people, change of seasons, dont have the traffic/crime/hurricanes of many FL cities, decent schools, things to do, etc...