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Old 05-16-2013, 12:02 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma
6,808 posts, read 6,905,055 times
Reputation: 20954

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
Maybe not your original statement, but since then, you seem to make it clear, well done should be accepted by everyone. But, the issue really is, how do you like your meat and everyone has his/her own idea, no one way is right for everyone. Now I do apologize to you, even if I do think you were indicating there is only one way to eat meat. I might have read between the lines, but I am not sure that calls for judging someone's reading comprehension. Maybe comments like that are where I got the idea you might a little judgmental.
I could care less if someone wants their meat swimming in a bowl of blood (ok, myoglobin). It's personally repulsive TO ME, and by stating that it doesn't change your right to have your meat cooked the way you like it, or declare you have a "screw loose". I just want to be able to eat mine the way I like it without it being considered "wrong". That was my only point, despite the fact you keep trying to put words in my mouth, accuse me of starting a heated debate or label me a vegetarian. Sheesh!

 
Old 05-16-2013, 12:10 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,606 posts, read 55,841,995 times
Reputation: 11862
Quote:
Originally Posted by TabulaRasa View Post
fibonacci -

With all due respect, who cares what you think? Paying customers are allowed to have whatever bad taste they want. To me, sugar in a cup of coffee renders it undrinkable. Is somebody who thinks it it improves the taste a "complete dumbass?" Of course not. They like what they like. I don't have to. Just because the coffee is ruined, to me, doesn't mean it is to them, and they can have their food and drink however they like.

I cannot say that I have ever worried that "a chef is laughing at me." Although I don't eat my steak well done, but if I did, I STILL wouldn't worry that "a chef is laughing at me." If I'm eating my meat burned to a crisp, I also likely don't care if it's a piece of crap cut, either...so, oooh, you showed me.

Your toilet paper example is misplaced. That's about somebody wanting a discount that doesn't apply. This is about food preparation preferences. And someone screaming in your face is acting abusively toward you. Someone telling you that they would like their steak cooked through, with no pink, no red, no juices whatsoever is NOT behaving abusively toward you. I never said the customer is always right. I said that someone paying for food to be prepared for them should have the right to specify how they'd like it prepared. It's not ripping you off in any way. It might be bruising your "I know best" ego, if somebody legitimately doesn't care whether or not you know best, they just care about getting food they are paying for made the way they prefer it. But that's really neither here nor there.

You clearly have your own ideas about the role of the person preparing the food, and that's fine, but it doesn't make anybody else a dumbass for having preferences in how the food they have purchased and are paying to have prepared is prepared.
In fairness a restaurant's reputation is at stake here (or should it be steak?). They uphold certain standards, and that includes standards of TASTE as well as service.etc. I don't want a person complaining the food is crap because they wanted it that way. They may think it'll taste a certain way, but it might not. I know people have different preferences, but sometimes if a chef refuses to do something a certain way it's better just going to somewhere else. Of course if chefs want to accommodate good on them, but just highlighting why a chef might seem to overreact over something like this.

Of course most steak houses give you the option of having it rare to well-done. Most dedicated steakhouses will also have different cuts...Another thing that should be mentioned is sauces and seasonings. Many who enjoy well done steak smother it in sauce and seasoning to make it more tasty, they may prefer it that way. Even today I still like my steak smothered in black pepper or diane sauce even though i prefer it medium now.
 
Old 05-16-2013, 12:22 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,606 posts, read 55,841,995 times
Reputation: 11862
Quote:
Originally Posted by eating while walking View Post
I think a lot of the societal preference for rare steak is more about being 'cool', machismo, and finding ways to look down on people than it it is about actual taste. I mean jesus I love a warm red center to a steak but some red meat lovers just act like total pricks. Not only that, but this mentality that only rare beef is good is incredibly small-minded. Think of all the other beef preparations in the world which don't rely on rare-ness to be good (IE pretty much the rest of the beef-eating world outside Western Europe and North America)

The vast majority of the flavor on a steak comes from the outside crust anyway; if you have that you're like 80% of the way there.



Exactly. This a thousand times. Any mouth breathing cave man can buy a perfectly marbled rib eye, wave it over a candle, and produce a red steak that will satisfy rare meat lovers. It takes a much better cook to gently cook a steak through so that it retains its juices.
I don't think it's about 'real men eat their meat bloody!' thinking but what people who appreciate food consider tasty. I'm not saying someone can't find well done steak tasty, however, it also depends on the source of the meat. I've had well done kobe wagyu and that was the best steak I've ever tasted in my life, but that's a completely different thing from the regular beef you get.

The Japanese actually enjoy beef sashimi, as well as horse and chicken sashimi .
 
Old 05-16-2013, 12:27 PM
 
9,091 posts, read 19,155,489 times
Reputation: 6967
One thing to note is that on those competition cooking shows they are testing the skills of the contestants, usually with some manufactured pressure involved.

Some items have a "standard" that they are expected to hit. Some items have the expectation from the chefs/judges. In these instances those people are your customer and the ones you need to please.

It also takes more skill to hit different ranges when cooking .... the two things that really get you yelled at as far as cooking time is too much and too little ..... you'll actually get more slack for overcooking than undercooking because overcooked won't make anyone ill

As for the overall presence, at times it absolutely matters to taste on how well something is cooked and tastes/textures change based on the composition of the meat .... since steak is hotly debated here, there are some cuts that do better with a long cook and some that just don't work ....... a good steakhouse knows their cuts and has servers that can walk you through them .... some i've been asked how I like my steak and then suggestions are made (this is fairly rare as it can come off poorly if executed poorly) .... I have ordered a special steak before and when asked stated my normal preference (mid-rare) to which the server said for this particular cut & presentation he'd suggest mid-well .... it made sense

There is a lot more to food prep and finding the most ideal points relies on many different factors .... from there it is a matter of applying your personal tastes to the right dishes ....... if you like things cooked well then there are certain items you'd avoid (tartare, carpaccio, poke) or menu items that are by their design meant to be cooked less .... same thing works the other way
 
Old 05-16-2013, 02:32 PM
 
Location: North by Northwest
9,317 posts, read 12,929,928 times
Reputation: 6165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
The Japanese actually enjoy beef sashimi, as well as horse and chicken sashimi .
How do the Japanese make their raw chicken reliably safe to eat?
 
Old 05-16-2013, 02:42 PM
 
Location: Heart of Dixie
12,441 posts, read 14,783,671 times
Reputation: 28430
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeavenWood View Post
How do the Japanese make their raw chicken reliably safe to eat?
I looked this up long ago when I heard about chicken sashimi. They use a special variety of chicken, Nagoya Cochin, which are carefully raised and processed to avoid contamination. The pampering the chickens receive is comparable to the pampering of Kobe cows.
 
Old 05-16-2013, 02:54 PM
 
Location: Keosauqua, Iowa
9,614 posts, read 21,169,868 times
Reputation: 13662
Quote:
Originally Posted by fibonacci View Post
Personal taste schmersonal taste. Well done meat sucks. It. Sucks. Why would anyone like to eat burnt dried out crap that's the equivalent to leather? Sorry, but people that like well done meat simply have no palate.
Good to know there are level-headed people around to weigh in rationally on the debate.

Believe it or not, there is a difference between well-done and burnt. When I cook a steak myself, I always go for well done which to me is uniformly gray with no charring except possibly on the fat. When I go to a restaurant I order it medium-well because, as someone else mentioned, you can send it back if it's not done enough, but once it's burnt you can't go back. And I don't mind a little pink

And I do believe that there are cases where someone will overcook a steak ordered well-done out of spite. I don't know why anyone would do that other than the fact that the longer you cook the meat the more you taste of the meat itself and the less you taste of the marinade or glaze that the chef may be "famous" for.

I've had steak prepared every way from nearly breathing to truly well-done (and certainly a few times burnt, but not by choice). The fact that I prefer the flavor and texture of medium-well to well-done meat is not an indication that there's anything wrong with me, it's simply a matter of what my mouth likes.
 
Old 05-16-2013, 03:43 PM
 
569 posts, read 668,825 times
Reputation: 673
Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
Maybe not your original statement, but since then, you seem to make it clear, well done should be accepted by everyone. But, the issue really is, how do you like your meat and everyone has his/her own idea, no one way is right for everyone. Now I do apologize to you, even if I do think you were indicating there is only one way to eat meat. I might have read between the lines, but I am not sure that calls for judging someone's reading comprehension. Maybe comments like that are where I got the idea you might a little judgmental.
I have been reading this since I too like well done steaks when I eat it which is almost never. I didn't see that the OP wanted everyone to eat well done steak just to accept that some do. There is only one way to eat meat for that particular poster.

To be honest, I saw more instances of the rare crowd insisting that their way is the right way (and for those that like it, it is the right way for you but not me). Knowing that I will get served the old bad cuts of meat should I order it how I like it (butterflied and well done) I will now only eat steak at home (again, not often). I get that it is not what the chefs want to do but whatevs, not my job to make the chef happy.
 
Old 05-16-2013, 03:45 PM
 
7,357 posts, read 11,699,905 times
Reputation: 8941
It's just very fashionable at the moment to eat meat rare -- even "the other white meat" which could have trichinosis in it if undercooked, for pete's sake. That fashion rides the coattails of the food scare from a couple decades ago when well-done meat was supposed to cause immediate, fatal cancer.
 
Old 05-16-2013, 04:10 PM
 
Location: North by Northwest
9,317 posts, read 12,929,928 times
Reputation: 6165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliffie View Post
It's just very fashionable at the moment to eat meat rare -- even "the other white meat" which could have trichinosis in it if undercooked, for pete's sake. That fashion rides the coattails of the food scare from a couple decades ago when well-done meat was supposed to cause immediate, fatal cancer.
Do you actually have proof that rare meat has only been "fashionable" recently? From what I can tell, raw/"under"-cooked meat has been popular through the ages. Steak tartare was much more popular in the '50s than it is today, though it is starting to see a comeback.

Also, it's not well-done meat that might contain carcinogens, but charred food of any kind--that's blackened mahi mahi, barbecued burnt ends, fire-scorched marshmallows, Pittsburgh rare steaks, or any other sort of burnt food. A well-done steak isn't inherently bad for you, but a charred steak cooked to any temperature just might be. Note that in order to get that good exterior crust, you need a little bit of charring, and it probably isn't bad for you in moderation. Given their relatively high saturated fat and cholesterol, steaks shouldn't be eaten all that often anyway (I know some cuts like sirloin are very lean, but excessive red meat of any kind isn't good for you).
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