Racism in Middletown (Baltimore, Frederick: public schools, college, deed)

[tw71]

Well, at least Starbucks promised to fix all of this, right?

Hah.... Seriously, I think it's way past time people lose the "Fredneck" moniker. Frederick has undergone a LOT of development in the last decade or so. You have to go to the outskirts to see evidence of the rural farm community it used to be, and it's very likely more big business will be headed into the area in the next few years. (Right now, they're debating giving businesses some tax breaks to move in to Frederick, thanks to Astra Zeneca looking at further expanding in Frederick.)

I think a lot of companies will start viewing Frederick as a viable alternative to MoCo with less govt. red tape and taxes levied on them.

[bus man]

Originally Posted by steppinthrax

What are your kids nationality?

Originally Posted by MidValleyDad

Nationality - They are Americans.

Originally Posted by steppinthrax

Anyway, you didn't want to give me a direct answer to my question, regarding nationality. Providing a evading answer. I'm fairly certain your kids are Americans. I'm assuming you and your kids are white. Therefore you nor your kids qualify to state "I have not seen this in the almost 20 years I have either lived in the area or that my children attended Middletown schools."

Steppinthrax, there is nothing whatsoever that was evasive in MidValleyDad's response. You asked what the nationality of his children were, and he answered you. If you had wanted to know what race they were, you should have asked him that. Don't get mad at HIM, just because YOU used "nationality" when you meant "race."

And being of the majority race does not necessarily mean that one is not able to see what might be happening to members of minority races. Note that he did not say that you didn't experience racism; he simply stated that he himself did not observe any. Meaning, in his observation, racism was not a widespread, defining characteristic of life in Middletown. Just because he did not observe what you experienced does not negate his observation. His experience as a Middletown resident is no less valid than yours.

By the way, I live next to Columbia, and I know where Middletown is. So I guess you're right, we Howard Countians really are special!

[steppinthrax]

Originally Posted by bus man

Steppinthrax, there is nothing whatsoever that was evasive in MidValleyDad's response. You asked what the nationality of his children were, and he answered you. If you had wanted to know what race they were, you should have asked him that. Don't get mad at HIM, just because YOU used "nationality" when you meant "race."

And being of the majority race does not necessarily mean that one is not able to see what might be happening to members of minority races. Note that he did not say that you didn't experience racism; he simply stated that he himself did not observe any. Meaning, in his observation, racism was not a widespread, defining characteristic of life in Middletown. Just because he did not observe what you experienced does not negate his observation. His experience as a Middletown resident is no less valid than yours.

By the way, I live next to Columbia, and I know where Middletown is. So I guess you're right, we Howard Countians really are special!

I was born in Columbia, MD. I've been to most of Maryland. Middletown people (from what I remember) were very NARROW MINDED. If you asked them to draw a map of Maryland they would probably only have Middletown, Frederick and maybe Cumberland.....

If you are the majority race in an area that is highly discriminatory (Middletown, MD), you are not going to experience first hand prejudice and discrimination. You may witness it, but witnessing a tragedy onto a group of people is not the same as witnessing a tragedy on a group of people to which you are a member of that group. The worse being the victim of such discrimination. White pre-teen kids in Middletown, MD whose parents may not even speak highly on blacks (within the home) may not really care if they find one of their friends call someone a N----. Group Psychology and Mob Mentality aside they might have even participated (remember SAE).

In regards to MidValleyDad's response, we were talking within a very tight context. I don't need to use very precise language. Some people have a habit when you don't use precise language they will answer you based on what you asked (instead of expand). Taking advantage of the situation to prevent being "called out" or "put in the corner".

In other words. He knew exactly what I was asking!!!!!!

[westsideboy]

Middletown is 80 miles from Cumberland and 45 miles from Columbia. Middletown is more like Columbia than it is like Cumberland in terms of wealth, housing stock, commuting patterns, land use, and pretty much everything other than "being white."

Trust me, there is no sense of common cause between Allegany and Frederick Counties. They are just another rich downstate county to us, and having lived in Frederick, I was hard pressed to find anyone that knew anything about Allegany County other than we were on the way to the Lake.

Most people in Middletown and rest of Frederick are firmly part of the D.C. metro area and their focus is what is happening 40-50 miles "down the road," in the big cities they commute to, not with what is happening in the mountains 90 or so miles west of where they live.

[steppinthrax]

Originally Posted by westsideboy

Middletown is 80 miles from Cumberland and 45 miles from Columbia. Middletown is more like Columbia than it is like Cumberland in terms of wealth, housing stock, commuting patterns, land use, and pretty much everything other than "being white."

Trust me, there is no sense of common cause between Allegany and Frederick Counties. They are just another rich downstate county to us, and having lived in Frederick, I was hard pressed to find anyone that knew anything about Allegany County other than we were on the way to the Lake.

Most people in Middletown and rest of Frederick are firmly part of the D.C. metro area and their focus is what is happening 40-50 miles "down the road," in the big cities they commute to, not with what is happening in the mountains 90 or so miles west of where they live.

I don't see how you can put Columbia and Middletown in the same boat. Middletown is such a small area pop of 4k and roughly 1.7 sq miles.

[westsideboy]

Originally Posted by steppinthrax

I don't see how you can put Columbia and Middletown in the same boat. Middletown is such a small area pop of 4k and roughly 1.7 sq miles.

I wouldn't go so far as to say the two communities are in the same boat by every standard. They aren't by population size, as you point out.

The similarities are that both places are commuter towns. Both communities exist in their current form because of ease of access to larger job markets. You have low poverty and high incomes in both towns. Both towns are full of modern housing to support continued rapid growth. Both communities are largely populated by non-natives because of the rapid growth rate (for instance Middletown grew from about 2700 residents to 4100 between 2000 and 2010.)

Contrast this to Cumberland. We are isolated and commuting to job centers is only an option for people willing to go 60+ miles one way. We have a high poverty rate and have a low median income. Our housing stock is historic. Literally a house built in 1970 or sooner would called "new" by us. My house was built in 1916, and about 75% of the housing stock in my neighborhood is roughly the same age. Cumberland is still depopulating, not gaining residents.

So the point isn't that Middletown and Columbia are identical. It is that they are much more similar to each other (not to mention closer in distance) than either is to Cumberland. And really, looking at both towns from a bigger perspective, the main things that separate them are scale and the race of the inhabitants. In the end both are growing, pretty well off communities in the D.C./Baltimore metro area inhabited by commuters.

[MidValleyDad]

I will make one more public statement on this thread. I have refused to continue into the race-baiting conversation that steppinthrax appears to want and would suggest that others do the same.

I do not believe anyone can change steppinthrax's opinion no matter how much they wish they could. SO I will follow the old maxim "Don't try to teach a pig to sing. You will only be frustrated and annoy the pig"

I agree that there are places in Frederick County (as well as other places in Maryland) that are similar to the environment that steppinthrax describes. I do not believe that Middletown is one of them. I have known educators who transferred to Middletown because they were subject to discrimination at other schools because of their or their spouses race or nationality.

And yes steppinthrax I knew what I believed you meant to ask but that is not what you asked. However a long time ago I learned not to assume what someone asks or says but to respond to what they actually ask or say. Since you have clarified your request I will respond. For census purposes my family is classified as Caucasian. I grew up in the Baltimore area and have seen discrimination throughout the region for the last 50+ years. I can remember when some of the schools with the largest issues with discrimination were in Howard County around Columbia. Our sports teams were not allowed to leave the bench area to return to the locker room at any time other than when the whole team went there at half-time because of problems with attacks in the hallways (these rules were put in place at that school by the local administration because of problems with their student population) And no I did not attend Middletown schools.

As far as Middletown students not knowing where Columbia is, I find that laughable. First of all some parents in Middletown commute to or past Columbia. Secondly with the influx of people into Middletown many moved here from areas much closer to Columbia. I try not to overstate my opinions or positions so I'll leave it here.

[blind eye]

I unfortunately had to relocate to Frederick because of my Husband serving in the military. I was called a _igger the first month I lived here by some guy driving a mack truck who was not only tailgating me on an exit ramp while I had to babies in the back; apparently I wasn't driving fast enough.

What I have also noticed is the substantial amount of African American men with white women. That's all I have to say about that topic. A lot of the Caucasians downtown Frederick look me like I have poop on my nose and don't even smile at you. However, There are a lot of friendly people but it appears the bad is out weighing the good at this point.

[stpickrell]

Originally Posted by blind eye

I unfortunately had to relocate to Frederick because of my Husband serving in the military. I was called a _igger the first month I lived here by some guy driving a mack truck who was not only tailgating me on an exit ramp while I had to babies in the back; apparently I wasn't driving fast enough.

What I have also noticed is the substantial amount of African American men with white women. That's all I have to say about that topic. A lot of the Caucasians downtown Frederick look me like I have poop on my nose and don't even smile at you. However, There are a lot of friendly people but it appears the bad is out weighing the good at this point.

No, go on, tell us about the African American men with white women. What, exactly, is the problem with that?

[blind eye]

Let me guess, stprickell. I hit a sensitive subject? lol.