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Old 12-21-2011, 07:42 PM
 
243 posts, read 545,781 times
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Thanks for the article, most writers focus on the micro level. I'm a macro guy, and there's a third category of savings: prevention of incurring macro expenses.

Examples:

Health - Large, recurring, and limitless. Staying fit avoids expensive treatments down the road. Regular dental, vision, and medical checkups catch problems at an early, treatable stage.

Retirement - Save early. Starting late costs exponentially more. Buying back lost time is extremely expensive.
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:24 PM
 
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Good read.

Now what happens if people do both without having to do either (aka the super "Kia su" people)???
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiasu
Are they considered just plain "cheap" then???
But still... in a good way (just like the family of way back when...).
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:23 PM
 
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Watch the pennies and the dollars will take care of themselves - unknown, sometimes attributed to Franklin
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:52 PM
 
4,043 posts, read 7,414,803 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Pride and self respect, though, DO stop me from that. Along with a comforting measure of laziness and the pleasure of being in control of the finite hours of my life.

Nobody on his death bed ever said "I wish I had spent more time at the office". But there are plenty who have said "I wish I had never bought that sailboat".
Perfect!
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:06 PM
 
4,761 posts, read 14,232,642 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pvande55 View Post
Watch the pennies and the dollars will take care of themselves - unknown, sometimes attributed to Franklin
Actually large companies can make a LOT of money from pennies and fractions of pennies.

For example sales tax calculations. When you calculate the sales tax percentage, this usually does not come out to an even penny. There are fractions of pennies left in the calculation.

What companies are *supposed* to do is "round off".

That is if the fractional penny is 4/10 of a penny or less, then use the same penny amount in the calculation. Or if 5/10 of a penny or more, then increase the penny amount by one penny. Example...

$12.64 x 7% tax = .88 4/10 cents. (88 cents tax should be charged.)
$12.65 x 7% tax = .88 5/10 cents. (89 cents tax should be charged.)

Well I once saw a large grocery store chain which was "rounding up" on all sales tax calculations. Any fraction of a penny in the calculation and they would increase the tax a penny. For example...

$12.59 x 7% tax = .88 1/10 cents. They would charge 89 cents tax!

So you could probably figure they were overcharging half of their customers one penny.

Big deal? YES!

How many transactions does a large grocery store chain have? I found stats for one large chain which had 10 million customers per week for its 1,500 stores.

So they were getting an extra 5,000,000 pennies a week.

Or 210,000,000 extra pennies a year! Small things add up!
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Old 08-31-2012, 12:47 PM
 
1,140 posts, read 2,133,059 times
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I have noticed people who have very large mortgages, or new cars - are very micro frugal - the won't eat out much, drink, watch what they spend carefully - they project an image of lots of money - but in actual fact their usually very frugal - but try to pretend their not. I don't mind someone being tight with their cash, I just can bear who people who pretend their not.

You know the types who drive BMWs, Audi, Merc, have large mortgage, latest fashions - but peer a bit closer and you will see the same types won't drive their car too far for fuel costs, take pack lunches to work, don't buy a coffee, and always trying squeeze cash out of others, getting multiple quotes to save a few dollars on getting their car fixed, using coupons at the supermarket - These are the secret tightwads that are everywhere.

Its amazing how a former spendthrift can be converted into being very very frugal with a large mortgage, or car payments. It makes you think that are entire behaviour revolves around money.

I'd say most of us are more macro frugal - I guess if you do both that's perfect for accumulating- I go for the balance, save for pensions, buy property, long investments, but enjoy spending on small amounts of cash on the things you want now.

Last edited by mikeyking; 08-31-2012 at 12:58 PM..
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Old 09-06-2012, 08:28 AM
 
Location: South Portland, ME
893 posts, read 1,202,859 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy_J View Post
Actually large companies can make a LOT of money from pennies and fractions of pennies.

For example sales tax calculations. When you calculate the sales tax percentage, this usually does not come out to an even penny. There are fractions of pennies left in the calculation.

What companies are *supposed* to do is "round off".

That is if the fractional penny is 4/10 of a penny or less, then use the same penny amount in the calculation. Or if 5/10 of a penny or more, then increase the penny amount by one penny. Example...

$12.64 x 7% tax = .88 4/10 cents. (88 cents tax should be charged.)
$12.65 x 7% tax = .88 5/10 cents. (89 cents tax should be charged.)

Well I once saw a large grocery store chain which was "rounding up" on all sales tax calculations. Any fraction of a penny in the calculation and they would increase the tax a penny. For example...

$12.59 x 7% tax = .88 1/10 cents. They would charge 89 cents tax!

So you could probably figure they were overcharging half of their customers one penny.

Big deal? YES!

How many transactions does a large grocery store chain have? I found stats for one large chain which had 10 million customers per week for its 1,500 stores.

So they were getting an extra 5,000,000 pennies a week.

Or 210,000,000 extra pennies a year! Small things add up!

Except that's not how sales tax works (or at least here). Sales tax applies to items per dollar. That's why so many things are $X.99 - to avoid having to apply tax to an extra dollar.

We have 6% sales tax. Something that is $10.00 or $10.99 (or anything inbetween) is going to incur a 60 cent sales tax. If you bump up the $10.99 item to $11.00 then you're going to incur a 66 cent sales tax - or, the other way, if you drop down to $9.99 then you are only going to have to pay a 54 cent sales tax.

It also allows some places to avoid having to charge sales tax, if the item is sold for $0.99 or less.

Also, stores don't keep the sales tax anyways, that is what they have to pay as tax for selling the item. The cost just gets passed on to the consumer. That's why they try to cheat the system by charging $10.99 for an $11 item, saves them from having to pay an extra 6 cents in tax (and also saves the customer from doing the same).

*Edit: Also, there is no sales tax on food items (or at least here) so not sure if a grocery store is the best example.
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Old 09-20-2012, 01:50 PM
 
577 posts, read 999,280 times
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I am definitely both macro and micro, I think you have to balance it or you defeat the purpose of being frugal.

I constantly hear people talk about how much they save on Item xyz through discounts/coupons/deals, then don't even think twice about the huge mortgage they took out and/or car payments. It's somewhat of a waste to spend so much time on the little things, and then completely miss the big picture on your biggest purchases.

I also see some people that are more reasonable with their car/mortgage, but just throw away that money on day to day expenses.
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Old 09-21-2012, 07:43 AM
 
Location: MO->MI->CA->TX->MA
7,022 posts, read 14,424,224 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msdmoney View Post
I am definitely both macro and micro, I think you have to balance it or you defeat the purpose of being frugal.

I constantly hear people talk about how much they save on Item xyz through discounts/coupons/deals, then don't even think twice about the huge mortgage they took out and/or car payments. It's somewhat of a waste to spend so much time on the little things, and then completely miss the big picture on your biggest purchases.

I also see some people that are more reasonable with their car/mortgage, but just throw away that money on day to day expenses.
While I'm not that negligent, it pretty much sums up how others see me.. more like I'm an extreme tightwad when it comes to car and housing and spend like normal (non-frugal but non wasteful) people on day to day expenses. Pareto's principle applied to Frugality!
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Old 09-21-2012, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Connecticut is my adopted home.
2,398 posts, read 3,821,674 times
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Both with a caveat: I buy the best that I can afford for long lasting big ticket items and take very good care of them. When I say afford, I don't mean jumbo mortgages, McMansions or luxury cars. Our housing might need work or updating but they are normally older with the old time craftsmanship and detailing that are located in great or gentrifying areas, with good classic bones. Our cars are always bought used in good condition, lower mileage and are solid reliable brands. Our sailboat was used. It just needed some elbow grease and new lines. BTW, I'm really glad we bought it. Household furnishings are solid and well made (I tend to buy antiques) rugs (high knot count orientals) appliances (classic styling, easy to clean and maintain, high efficiency) and the like. I really despise planned obsolescence so we buy mid range tech items and small appliances on their third or fourth iteration or tech brands that offers continued support such as Apple. I don't go in for trendy in anything which becomes dated and tiresome too quickly.

Micro: We like good food so I learned to cook beyond the basics that I was taught as a youth. Same for good coffee, we grind and make our own with a second hand vintage pump machine that I found at a yard sale. With $25 in new gaskets and seals and some scrubbing I have an $800+ machine for $55. We grow a lot of our fresh veggies, fruits and herbs, initial investments that pays over and over. I shop on Craigslist, tag sales, auctions, overstock, occasionally ebay, and second hand, used, thrift, junk, consignment, antique shops, flea markets. It's purely amazing what people decide to get rid of. I trust my eye for good quality implicitly.

We buy staple food and household products at the warehouse and shop weekly sales at regular grocery stores. I really love the clearance meat bins where we often find good to expensive cuts of fresh beef and lamb for 30% off. We will be splitting the cost of a beef cow with my brother this year. Who needs magazine or newspaper subscriptions anymore when the content can be had online? We switched to largely LED lighting as bulbs burned out and haven't had to buy another lightbulb since the conversion, Though initially expensive, it's another investment that is noticeably paying off over time in lower bills and frustration of lightbulbs that burn out in months if not weeks at times. We ditched cable TV, the home phone, keep the heat down, buy gasoline on rewards plans. We occasionally eat out but it's not a priority for us, nor is going to the theater or concerts. Sometimes we do, but it is a fairly rare treat. Our real passion is travel so we go steerage or travel independently and we really enjoy our trips. It's worth every penny to us.

We've learned how to build, clean, repair or refurbish about anything. We use it up, wear it out and often do without until we find what we want at a reasonable price. Someone wisely mentioned healthcare which can devour a bottom line. The small extra expense in healthy food, a decent multi-vitamin supplement/s, exercise (and there is no need for machines or health clubs) fresh air, decent sleep, avoiding bad habits and moderation in all things could save many dollars in the future. No guarantees but the law of averages are on our side. I am preaching to myself on that last one.

We are retired and decided to redistribute some income downward by working odd repair jobs and gardening for a very wealthy person, dignity fully intact. We work as much as we want to and enjoy the work.

We have saved quite a bit but the majority is locked in our 401Ks and we are too young to take distributions for another 5 years. All in all living below our means has really helped us to achieve what we want out of life and I owe that to a couple of folks that I really heard and grasped what they were saying when I was young as far as goal planning and how much of the rat race is necessary to engage in to succeed along the way.

Good topic.
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