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Old 07-27-2017, 07:17 PM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
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It's amazing that they now can extract DNA from remains found in hot climates utilizing the petrous bone found in the skull.

https://phys.org/news/2017-07-presen...anaanites.html

http://www.cell.com/ajhg/fulltext/S0002-9297(17)30276-8

Quoted from Haber et al. "The PCA shows that Sidon_BA clusters with three individuals from Early Bronze Age Jordan (Jordan_BA) found in a cave above the Neolithic site of ‘Ain Ghazal and probably associated with an Early Bronze Age village close to the site.13 This suggests that people from the highly differentiated urban culture on the Levant coast and inland people with different modes of subsistence were nevertheless genetically similar, supporting previous reports that the different cultural groups who inhabited the Levant during the Bronze Age, such as the Ammonites, Moabites, Israelites, and Phoenicians, each achieved their own cultural identities but all shared a common genetic and ethnic root with Canaanites."

Last edited by AFP; 07-27-2017 at 07:52 PM..
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Old 08-01-2017, 06:40 PM
 
Location: Illinois
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Thank you for this.

I see that you have cited a full text article. Thank you for this.

As for Canaanites, how does this match up (I haven't read yet, just putting it out there)with say, other Semitic language speaking groups from The Horn of Africa? Like for instance, Amharic?
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Old 08-01-2017, 07:05 PM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
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Originally Posted by CMichele View Post
Thank you for this.

I see that you have cited a full text article. Thank you for this.

As for Canaanites, how does this match up (I haven't read yet, just putting it out there)with say, other Semitic language speaking groups from The Horn of Africa? Like for instance, Amharic?
I'm not sure about the linguistics but the genetics indicate there was a large migration from the Levant to the Horn of Africa bout 3,000 YBP.
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Old 08-01-2017, 07:13 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CMichele View Post
Thank you for this.

I see that you have cited a full text article. Thank you for this.

As for Canaanites, how does this match up (I haven't read yet, just putting it out there)with say, other Semitic language speaking groups from The Horn of Africa? Like for instance, Amharic?
Habesha?
Amharic didnt show up until around 1000ad. in fact most of the semitic languages appeared at that time.
The DNA for this study came from someone who lived 1000 years before Amharic apeared.

Most of the people in that area were probably related in one form or another with the exception of the southern Egyptians/Abyssinian. They seem to be the only different group in the region at that time.
Just my feelings
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Old 08-01-2017, 07:22 PM
 
Location: Illinois
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Originally Posted by AFP View Post
I'm not sure about the linguistics but the genetics indicate there was a large migration from the Levant to the Horn of Africa bout 3,000 YBP.
From my own DNA, I understand that there were two migrations from The Horn on the mitochondrial line. M and N, from L3. I find your article not only interesting but useful. More interesting than useful. But educational more than anything. The article more than anything.

I am extremely interested in the linguistics.

And tbh, I have no endgame here. I just know my my mtDNA is an offshoot from those groups. And the parent group is very prominent in Lebanon.
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Old 08-01-2017, 07:41 PM
 
Location: Illinois
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Originally Posted by Joe33 View Post
Habesha?
Amharic didnt show up until around 1000ad. in fact most of the semitic languages appeared at that time.
The DNA for this study came from someone who lived 1000 years before Amharic apeared.

Most of the people in that area were probably related in one form or another with the exception of the southern Egyptians/Abyssinian. They seem to be the only different group in the region at that time.
Just my feelings
I can understand this.

I am not Habesha. But have been mistaken as such, which confuses me.

So you think that Southern Egyptians are different? How does this bode for the pyramids and such?
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Old 08-01-2017, 07:51 PM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
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Originally Posted by CMichele View Post
From my own DNA, I understand that there were two migrations from The Horn on the mitochondrial line. M and N, from L3. I find your article not only interesting but useful. More interesting than useful. But educational more than anything. The article more than anything.

I am extremely interested in the linguistics.

And tbh, I have no endgame here. I just know my my mtDNA is an offshoot from those groups. And the parent group is very prominent in Lebanon.
What is your specific subclade? I have an interest in M and N they are both found in my own ethnic group specifically(M1a3a, M1b2, N1a and N1b1a2). My understanding is that there still isn't a consensus whether the mutation for M and N developed in East Africa or developed in Asia and back migrated, but both are indeed an offshoot of L3.
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Old 08-01-2017, 08:03 PM
 
Location: Illinois
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Originally Posted by AFP View Post
What is your specific subclade? I have an interest in M and N they are both found in my own ethnic group specifically(M1a3a, M1b2, N1a and N1b1a2). My understanding is that there still isn't a consensus whether the mutation for M and N developed in East Africa or developed in Asia and back migrated, but both are indeed an offshoot of L3.
I understand the back migration theory and think that it is possible.

I am down tree from H5, from Lebanon.

And I am very content with being identified as black American. But I get a lot of questions concerning my ancestry which makes no sense to me.
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Old 08-02-2017, 10:00 AM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
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Originally Posted by CMichele View Post
I understand the back migration theory and think that it is possible.

I am down tree from H5, from Lebanon.

And I am very content with being identified as black American. But I get a lot of questions concerning my ancestry which makes no sense to me.


I need to investigate further. Which branch of H5 are you H5a is found in Europe and appears to be linked to the Neolithic migration with a concentration in Wales. Haplogroups don't reliably correlate to "race", there are many examples of individuals that identify as black with maternal and paternal haplogroups that originate in Eurasia and there are examples of individuals who identify as white with mtDNA's that originate in Sub-Saharan Africa. But tbh I don't have an interest in a discussion about race they end up attracting people with rigid toxic opinions that have no interest in dialogue or learning and lead to the same old tired exchanges.




Quoted from Wikipedia(need to find a study, no time right now) "H5 has been dated to around 11,500 BP (9500 BC).[SIZE=2][4][/SIZE] It appears to be most frequent and diverse in the Western Caucasus, so an origin there has been suggested, while its subclade H5a appears European.[SIZE=2][5][/SIZE] However samples of mtDNA with T16304C in the HVR1 region have been found in four individuals of around 6800 BC from the Pre-Pottery Neolithic B site of Tell Halula, Syria,[SIZE=2][6][/SIZE] suggesting that H5 may have arrived in the Caucasus with farmers from the Near East." end quote


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_H5_(mtDNA)
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Old 08-02-2017, 12:55 PM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
7,238 posts, read 4,692,152 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CMichele View Post
I understand the back migration theory and think that it is possible.

I am down tree from H5, from Lebanon.

And I am very content with being identified as black American. But I get a lot of questions concerning my ancestry which makes no sense to me.
We were talking about the possibility of back migration N, and L3 were among the mtDNA samples extracted from Neolithic remains at the Tell Halula site. It really would help if Full Sequence(FMS) was done on those samples. Could this be an L3 line that went extinct? FMS on all of the samples would clarify some things.


Quoted from Wikipedia article "Eva Fernández Domínguez extracted samples of mitochondrial DNA from human bones from Tell Halula as part of the studies for her PhD thesis accepted at the University of Barcelona in 2005. The methodology used was later superseded, so a first publication of the results in 2008 was corrected in a subsequent publication in 2014. In the latter publication the mtDNA haplogroups were given as U, R0, K, HV, H, N and L3" End Quote


The study is in Catalan I don't read Catalan perhaps someone here does. I can think of one member that does.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tell_Halula#Ancient_DNA
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