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Old 05-01-2018, 10:45 AM
 
Location: Colorado (PA at heart)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
I thought this was an interesting read: https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/27/healt...acy/index.html


This especially caught my eye:


"23andMe has ... suggested that its longer-range goal is to collect a massive biobank of genetic information that can be used and sold for medical research and could also lead to patentable discoveries," wrote George J. Annas, a legal scholar at Boston University School of Public Health, and Dr. Sherman Elias of the Department of Obstetrics and Gynecology at Feinberg School of Medicine at Northwestern University.
The data sold for medical research is anonymous and they only do it with the individual's consent - they sell the raw DNA data along with surveys the testers take about their medical history, but with no names attached. I opt into this whenever I can, and answer as many questions as I can, I think it's a great thing and hopefully leads to important medical discoveries and advancements.
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Old 05-01-2018, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PA2UK View Post
The data sold for medical research is anonymous and they only do it with the individual's consent - they sell the raw DNA data along with surveys the testers take about their medical history, but with no names attached. I opt into this whenever I can, and answer as many questions as I can, I think it's a great thing and hopefully leads to important medical discoveries and advancements.
same here.. I uploaded my data to Open Humans And have participated in several of their studies. Last week I was invited to All of Us A very ambitious project that tracks participants for 10 years, I have an appointment at UC Davis for later this week where they will do a blood draw, obtain a urine sample and take my weight and measurements.
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Old 05-02-2018, 07:08 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
Last week I was invited to All of Us A very ambitious project that tracks participants for 10 years, I have an appointment at UC Davis for later this week where they will do a blood draw, obtain a urine sample and take my weight and measurements.
There's something similar I joined back in 2011 called the The Harvard Personal Genome Project, I think they are up to a little over 5,000 participates and it's supposed to run for until you opt out and/or die.
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Old 05-02-2018, 07:41 AM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
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Originally Posted by cjseliga View Post
There's something similar I joined back in 2011 called the The Harvard Personal Genome Project, I think they are up to a little over 5,000 participates and it's supposed to run for until you opt out and/or die.
small world! I've been in PGP for about the same length of time, last I heard 100,000 people had signed up but the project had only sequenced a very small number of the samples provided to them.
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Old 05-02-2018, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Colorado (PA at heart)
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Robert Estes has posted a great article about this issue: https://dna-explained.com/2018/04/30...iller-and-dna/
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Old 05-02-2018, 12:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
small world! I've been in PGP for about the same length of time, last I heard 100,000 people had signed up but the project had only sequenced a very small number of the samples provided to them.
Yeah, if I remember correctly, after the "original 10" had their entire genome sequenced, they choose 100 people for their next set, which also had their entire genome sequenced, all paid for by the Harvard PGP.

I didn't make it into that "100 group" and I didn't think I would, I'm just your normal white male, European ancestry, in good health, with no real ailments/diseases/conditions. I was a part of the "1000 group".

I realize the cost of sequencing one's entire genome has come down over the years, but I'm not sure if the Harvard PGP will ever get around to doing whole sequencing on everyone in the study, unless the cost gets down to $100 or less per person (which it might in the future).

Of course you can spend your own money and have your entire genome sequenced then give the results to the Harvard PGP.
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Old 05-02-2018, 01:01 PM
 
Location: NJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PA2UK View Post
Robert Estes has posted a great article about this issue: https://dna-explained.com/2018/04/30...iller-and-dna/
Thanks for posting the blog link. I've been trying to compile a reply to fill everyone in on what's been happening that lead to this. The blog post was a quick explanation of it. I wrote all of this before I read the blog you linked to; so now I have to process it because they made good points with the rape case.

I've picked the best articles for someone not familiar with what's happened that I've seen on the subject of what's happened in the missing and unidentified person's world where this has been huge news. It was just a matter of time and the timing is what's made it bigger news.

April 11th an Unidentified Jane Doe known as Buckskin Girl was identified as Marcia King by a new organization called DNA Doe Project. They're working on 2 of my 1st cases that I follow; Buckskin Girl and a guy that committed suicide known as Lyle Stevik. They lucked out with Buckskin Girl, they got a cousin match, went to Ancestry where they were able to find Marcia listed in a family tree as missing, presumed deceased. With Lyle, they haven't been so lucky. They have a lot of 3rd or 4th cousins but his family intermarried so it's been hard trying to pin point him. They do know his family settled; Rio Arriba, Taos counties New Mexico. *Note, I'm linking to their albums on the missing and unidentified person's FB page I co-own with a friend. Their article histories are in each album. Both Lyle and Buckskin Girl (Marcia) have had isotopes and pollen done. Their LE are very eager to solve their cases and have tried everything.

I don't mind organizations like DNA Doe Project using our DNA samples on GEDmatch to give a Doe their identity back but LE possibly using it to capture criminals is a different story. Not that I mind them doing it to capture a monster like Joseph James DeAngelo, but I hope they don't start using it as another database. They have CODIS, they have a fingerprint database AFIS and a dental database NCIC. If everyone reads the articles I've posted, they'll have an idea of how involved it was to get to Joseph James DeAngelo. They had to take whatever they had with DNA, send it to a specialized company to extract it then put it in a raw file that could be uploaded to GEDmatch. It was unheard of until DNA Doe Project found people willing to help do just that. Not only that; the DNA was very degraded which you'll see in one of the Buckskin Girl articles. With some Does they only have a small percent to work from. Colleen from DNA Doe Project gave a link last night in a FB group she runs, she said it was the most accurate article she had read.

Since I'm talking about DNA Doe Project; PA2UK's blog Gedmatch Admixture Guide got mentioned on their page. People had been asking questions about GEDmatch so DDP made a post about it. To see their post - DNA Doe Project - March 28 at 6:55pm · I had given them my family tree and DNA direction post, not sure if they got the blog from there or by googling but it was pretty cool to see it.

For those that don't know who Colleen is I will add some links at the bottom. She identified a Jane Doe known as Lori Ruff. Someone then contacted her to see if she'd take on Lyle Stevik's case. It's what got the wheels in motion. LE should have been able to give her Lyle's DNA sample in UNT/ NamUs but they would not release the string of data unless it was a government agency. She set out to find another way and DNA Doe was born.

Quote:
For those with questions on reading the ethnicity reports, here's a great link: https://genealogical-musings.blogspo...ly-gedmatch… We're hoping to add Buckskin Girl's Oracle 4 report later tonight.

Remember ... If you would like to learn more about our cases, or wish to make a tax-deductible donation either to our general fund or a specific Doe Fund Me case, please visit our website at:
Cases - DNA Doe Project Cases
For anyone interested in the Buxkskin Girl case and how DDP turned things like blood, bone and teeth into a raw data file see the articles below. If you have time, I highly suggest the presser where Colleen and Margaret explained it.The morning of the presser I sent a bunch of FB PM's to various news agencies trying to get them to cover it live, I knew it was going to be huge news and it was. One did. It's available on FB Live video


'Buck Skin Girl' Case Break Is Success of New DNA Doe Project By Seth Augenstein April 17, 2018
Quote:
A four-hour flurry at their computer screens gave a name and a face—and started a homicide investigation—in one of the most infamous of Ohio cold cases: that of the Buck Skin Girl, found in a roadside ditch near Troy, Ohio, in 1981.

Starting late the night of March 28, Margaret Press and Colleen Fitzpatrick took the highly-degraded incomplete DNA profile, and started combing a public genealogical database. Within a short time, they had a staggering hit: a first cousin once removed.

They found the woman on Ancestry.com. Then they found the corresponding family tree, where they could click around on the grandparents, and the great-grandparents. Then they split up and worked backward, toward descendants.

“By a stroke of luck, I opened the name Marcia,” Press recalls. “And a death field was filled in. It said, ‘Death—Unknown. Missing—Presumed Dead.'”

By 3 a.m. on March 29, they were looking at the Buck Skin Girl’s real name: Marcia L. King. After nearly four decades of searches, interviews, advanced forensics like palynology and stable isotope analysis, and in-depth looks by detectives and experts alike, they had found it...

“The key is work with degraded DNA,” said Fitzpatrick. “This is not just a breakthrough on genealogy at work. We have adapted the existing tools, and we have developed new tools, and to apply the genealogy in a new context.” ...

...Between 50 and 75 percent of the crucial 600,000 to 900,000 SNPs in King’s DNA had survived the decades of storage without refrigeration, said Press and Fitzpatrick. Those SNPs are the same sets used by direct-to-consumer services such as Ancestry and 23andMe, said Press.

“Fifty to 75 percent of those points were left after they massaged it to get us the data we need,” said Fitzpatrick, a forensic genealogist and scientist who is well known for her work helping to solve the infamous Phoenix “Canal Murders” several years ago. “We got enough marbles in that jar to make it work.”

“We throw out 99 percent of the genome that we got,” said Press, who is a genealogist, researcher and writer...

Lyle Stevik
DNA links John Doe's ancestry to Rio Arriba, Taos counties By: Jackie Kent - Updated: Apr 05, 2018 04:57 PM MDT

Quote:
Amateur sleuths are refusing to give up on solving a mysterious suicide from more than 10 years ago, and genealogists now believe they've helped narrow down the search of a John Doe's ancestry to northern New Mexico.

However, in the past month, volunteer investigators and genealogists with the non-profit DNA Doe Project linked John Doe's DNA to what they call a cluster of potential matches in Rio Arriba and Taos counties in northern New Mexico.

"It appears there were a number of founding families that go back to the 1700s in that same area," said Margaret Press, a genealogist and co-founder of the nonprofit. "They're a close-knit community and intermarried a lot which is why we're seeing such a heavy concentration."
Colleen suggested this article, she said it's the most accurate
New genetic sleuthing tools helped track down the Golden State Killer suspect - Mining genealogy databases to find crime suspects raises privacy concerns - By Tina Hesman Saey - 9:49am, April 29, 2018


Quote:
To get the data needed for upload to GEDmatch, the DNA Doe Project — and probably the DeAngelo investigators — use a method Fitzpatrick and Press began developing last year. Their team uses special techniques to decipher, or sequence, degraded DNA. For the Doe Project, that can mean exhuming bodies and extracting DNA from bones, teeth or other tissues. Once that DNA has been sequenced, investigators use computer programs to compile a list of the same SNPs used by the consumer testing companies. Then files that mimic the format of 23andMe or Ancestry’s reports are generated and uploaded to GEDmatch.

If relatives of the unidentified deceased person (or, as in this case, a crime suspect) are in the GEDmatch database, investigators will be able to see those matches. Then painstaking genealogy research must begin to establish the person’s identity...

... Once Doe project investigators think they have identified the correct person, law enforcement officials contact the missing person’s family and collect DNA samples to verify the identity. On April 10, the project announced that its methods had identified the remains of “Buckskin Girl,” a young woman whose body was discovered in 1981, as those of Marcia Lenore King.

In DeAngelo’s case, police reportedly found a genetic link to DeAngelo’s great-great-grandparents in GEDmatch, then spent months following the branches of his family tree.

Once police settled on him as suspect, they had to do more routine genetic gumshoe work. DNA collected from an item DeAngelo discarded (police haven’t identified the item, but it might be something like a cup, used Kleenex or a bit of leftover food) was used to do short tandem repeat matching to DNA taken from the Golden State Killer crime scenes. That step was necessary because it’s unclear whether the genealogical DNA evidence would be admissible in court, says Katsanis. Confirmation that DeAngelo’s DNA matched crime scene DNA came on April 20, police say. They then collected DNA from another discarded item to verify the first result. On April 23, the second test confirmed the finding. DeAngelo was arrested the next day. So far, he has been charged with eight murders.

Police “followed this genetic lead to try to investigate this case in a novel way,” says Katsanis. “But it took a lot of resources. ... If they’d had the wrong DeAngelo, it would have been a lot of investigation for nothing.” Such extensive genetic detective work is difficult and takes money and manpower most jurisdictions can’t spare, says Katsanis.

Whether that soothes people worried about their DNA being mined by law enforcement — or by anyone else, for that matter — is another issue. Katsanis likens the data used in this case to phone numbers listed in the phone book’s white pages. People in GEDmatch’s database voluntarily placed their DNA information there for anyone, including the police, to see, she says....

... Katie Hasson, program director on genetic justice for the Center for Genetics and Society in Berkeley, Calif., disagrees with that comparison. “This kind of information is a little bit different than a phone number, very private.” Many people may not realize all the ways their DNA may be used or what it could mean for their families, she says. “People need to think about the ways making their genetic data public also makes their relatives’ DNA public.”

Press advises people considering genetic testing and uploading to GEDmatch to just assume that their data will be used by companies, law enforcement, foreign governments, marketers and other entities.


GEDmatch, a tiny DNA analysis firm, was key for Golden State Killer case

"No court order was needed to access that site’s large database of genetic blueprints." - By Cyrus Farivar - 4/27/2018, 10:25 AM
Quote:
According to the East Bay Times, which first reported the connection to GEDmatch late Thursday evening, California investigators caught a huge break in the case when they matched DNA from some of the original crime scenes with genetic data that had already been uploaded to GEDmatch. This familial link eventually led authorities to Joseph James DeAngelo, the man authorities have named the chief suspect in the case. To confirm the genetic match, Citrus Heights police physically surveilled him and captured DNA off of something that he had discarded.

On Friday morning, GEDmatch co-founder Curtis Rogers emailed Ars, underscoring the implications of uploading one's genetic profile to a database such as his. He published a statement, saying that he only learned of his site's connection to the California investigation through the media.

"Although we were not approached by law enforcement or anyone else about this case or about the DNA, it has always been GEDmatch's policy to inform users that the database could be used for other uses, as set forth in the Site Policy," he wrote. "While the database was created for genealogical research, it is important that GEDmatch participants understand the possible uses of their DNA, including information of relatives that have committed crimes or were victims of crimes. if you are concerned about non-genealogical uses of your DNA, you should not upload your DNA to the database and/or you should remove DNA that has already been uploaded."

Earlier on Thursday, some media outlets, including the Sacramento Bee, first reported the Golden State Killer investigation’s link to DNA analysis companies, leading to speculation that more mainstream commercial services might be involved. Ars contacted 23andMe, Ancestry.com, MyHeritage, and Helix—they all denied being connected to the DeAngelo investigation.

"Ancestry advocates for its members’ privacy and will not share any information with law enforcement unless compelled to by valid legal process," Melissa Garrett, an Ancestry.com spokeswoman, emailed Ars in a statement, noting that the company had never shared genetic data with law enforcement.

Similarly, Andy Kill, a spokesman for 23andMe, emailed Ars to say that it was the company’s policy to "resist law enforcement inquiries."

"23andMe has never given customer information to law enforcement officials," he wrote. "Our platform is only available to our customers, and does not support the comparison of genetic data processed by any third party to genetic profiles within our database."
___________________
Some links about Colleen for those that haven't heard of her - she identified a Doe known as Lori Ruff; the unknown child on the Titanic and she's working on an Australian case called Somerton Man to name a few. Her partner is a gal named Margaret.

Colleen Forensic Genealogy

Her website Identifinders International

The Genetic Genealogist - Interview With Forensic Genealogist Colleen Fitzpatrick, Ph.D.

Last edited by Roselvr; 05-02-2018 at 02:22 PM..
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Old 05-02-2018, 02:32 PM
 
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I haven't yet read through this thread thoroughly and am still catching up on the news about the arrest of Joseph James DeAngelo. I was not familiar with this serial killer's story until the news broke out recently. I plan to read some of the articles linked here.

This 4/27/18 article is in Wired Magazine titled "The Creepy Genetics Behind the Golden State Killer Case." I don't think it was shared in this thread yet.
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Old 05-02-2018, 05:59 PM
 
Location: NJ
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Originally Posted by maus View Post
I haven't yet read through this thread thoroughly and am still catching up on the news about the arrest of Joseph James DeAngelo. I was not familiar with this serial killer's story until the news broke out recently. I plan to read some of the articles linked here.

This 4/27/18 article is in Wired Magazine titled "The Creepy Genetics Behind the Golden State Killer Case." I don't think it was shared in this thread yet.
I didn't follow the case so have read a lot of articles, the 2 I linked are the best. It was not easy or cheap to catch him. The science is also very new. There were a lot of hands in this and if I understood all I've read and the presser I watched about Buckskin Girl being identified, there may have been 2 companies working with the DNA. They thanked people at the presser, I believe on their FB page too. I think I lost one link while compiling my post but I can't remember which article.

They said it's about $1,700 for extracting the DNA and making the raw file but so far there have been other charges they didn't foresee. One Doe's DNA has been done twice because it was too degraded. I wondering at some point today we'll learn more about how they caught him. We

milk Creek shed man
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Old 05-04-2018, 09:25 AM
 
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The DeAngelo case was the topic on the On Point radio program yesterday (NPR). One of the guests was CeCe Moore, "Your Genetic Genealogist" and creator of "DNA Detectives." Other guests were legal experts discussing "privacy" and your DNA. Really you have no privacy since it is currently perfectly legal for law enforcement to collect DNA from discarded cups/chewing gum etc. and run it through their databases.

But there were some apparent misunderstandings about DNA data on the program. The guests seemed to think that if you upload your raw data to a site like Gedmatch then others can see it. But they do not have access to your raw data file, they can only run your kit # through tools on the site and compare your DNA to themselves and other people. Other people cannot use Gedmatch to find your genetic health risks. Also, the fact that law enforcement submitted a DNA sample that they didn't have consent to submit according to the rules of Ancestry was glossed over.

One caller to the program suggested that we should be celebrating the use of DNA in genealogical databases to catch this killer, and the people who found him were "heroes". Will raising the profile of this case help or hurt genetic genealogy? Personally I wouldn't like to see this as a trend toward merging of forensic and genealogical databases. What happens if law enforcement starts to zero in on the family of a suspect, and needs to test family members in order to narrow down their search. Will these family members then be subject to requests for submitting DNA samples to help solve crimes? Seems like a slippery slope.

Then again, I have a few years of experience finding family for adoptees using DNA. The same skills are needed for identifying suspects through DNA. Is there a way I can offer my services to law enforcement to help solve crimes using genetic genealogy?
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