Cultural Boundaries Within Your Region (housing, estimates, metro area)

[blkgiraffe]

Originally Posted by grapico

Are you seriously about to argue they aren't the same culture? I just want to know if you are seriously contesting it, you already said they aren't remotely the same culture...which is absolutely baffling to me. I personally agree fully with WesternBankNola and ATL_Aficianado on their understanding of the area, so don't feel the need to rephrase what has already being said. You on the other hand haven't given any evidence for them being different. Having same CSA has everything to do with it, they are right next to each other, there is no cultural divide at the state line or within their respective metro areas.

Some people are ashamed to be compared to smaller cities. I've heard tons of people say Atlanta is just a bigger Birmingham.

[grapico]

Originally Posted by jluke65780

Some people are ashamed to be compared to smaller cities. I've heard tons of people say Atlanta is just a bigger Birmingham.

Well its not really a city comparison, just a culture comparison. Atlanta is far and away the bigger and better city, nobody is contesting that.

[waronxmas]

Originally Posted by grapico

Are you seriously about to argue they aren't the same culture? I just want to know if you are seriously contesting it, you already said they aren't remotely the same culture...which is absolutely baffling to me. I personally agree fully with WesternBankNola and ATL_Aficianado on their understanding of the area, so don't feel the need to rephrase what has already being said. You on the other hand haven't given any evidence for them being different. Having same CSA has everything to do with it, they are right next to each other, there is no cultural divide at the state line or within their respective metro areas.

Yes, I am seriously arguing that and I'll leave Westbank and Atl_aficianado to back up their argument.

For one, going back when the two cities diverged, Atlanta was more progressive on civil rights and desegregated on their own without incident. Birmingham on the other hand had riots, police dogs turned on children, bombings, federal troops, etc. Why was this the case if they had as what people claim is basically the same culture? This isn't an idle question as the same thing that happened in Birmingham during that time happened pretty much in every other city of size around the south.

The reason is that Atlanta has had for a long time had a large, politically influential, upper middle class and wealthy, Jewish and African-American population. This is something that Birmingham lacked during the civil rights era which was key to Atlanta's future success. One of the first groups MLK went to to begin desegregation in Atlanta were the Jewish business owners who had a lot of political clout. The protestant whites in the city worked with them instead of fighting them and were able to move out of that dark era unscathed and began planning the for the future. In fact, most of the major accomplishments during that time such as the building of the MARTA subway or the expansion of Hartsfield into the behemoth we know today were the direct result of the Black-Jewish coalition in Atlanta. Again, something that Birmingham completely lacked.

But fast forward to modern times there are still many significant differences between Atlanta and Birmingham. There is the obvious fact that there is a different synergy of ideas and people between a city with barely over 1 million people in the metro (Birmingham) and one with almost 6 million (Atlanta). Then there is:

-The HUGE LBGT community in Atlanta
-The affect of having the Buford Highway Corridor and the tens of thousands of International immigrants has on the city
-Nothing like the effect that the literally millions of transplants from elsewhere in the country have had on the area
-Nothing in Birmingham like Midtown
-Nothing in Birmingham like Little 5
-Nothing like Cascade Heights or Collier Heights
-Nothing like about a dozen other places around town

I've been to Birmingham several times and I fail to see what the other two posters were talking about (only slightly do see it for some southside neighborhoods, but even then not really). There is a very distinct difference between the two places that has nothing to do with "being better" than the other place. Someone would realize that if they took time to research it further.

Now what is your argument for how they have the "same culture" aside from hiding behind the words of other posters?

[waronxmas]

Originally Posted by jluke65780

Some people are ashamed to be compared to smaller cities.

Not I. I don't look down on any place, and in fact I have always had this fascination with Birmingham.

[NorthDeKalb]

Originally Posted by jluke65780

Some people are ashamed to be compared to smaller cities. I've heard tons of people say Atlanta is just a bigger Birmingham.

You know that will always be the case and I agree completely. But it's actually the other way around. Mostly all of the influence comes from Atlanta so Birmingham and Nashville are more like smaller versions. Nashville, Birmingham and Atlanta are practically the same culturally to me. If you don't think so you probably haven't spent enough time in each place. LOL

What's so different? The music the trends the slang? Not at all. Ask yourself a question, do you consider Nashville nightlife a culture shock from Atlanta's? I hope not, because it's never been for me. If you know these three cities and region as well as I do, you should agree that they are much more in line culturally than say New Orleans, Jackson MS and Memphis. For example, in Jackson MS, they play bounce music (South Louisiana/New Orleans genre) which they just don't play in Atlanta or Birmingham and surely not Nashville. The club scene feels different in that region too, much more vibrant to me but it's pretty good here too, just more laid back.

Originally Posted by grapico

Well its not really a city comparison, just a culture comparison. Atlanta is far and away the bigger and better city, nobody is contesting that.

Yes Atlanta dwafs Birmingham in every way, but you're right Atlanta's influence in Nashville and Birmingham is undenyable. I don't see how anyone could overlook it.lol

***Waronxmas, don't get pulled into any trickery. You know they'll pull a fast one on you and create a debate that wasn't even there to start with. No ones debating Atlanta's success, if it weren't as successful as it's been I'm sure I wouldn't be here. Don't fall for any of it.

[waronxmas]

Originally Posted by ATL_Aficionado

You know that will always be the case and I agree completely. But it's actually the other way around. Mostly all of the influence comes from Atlanta so Birmingham and Nashville are more like smaller versions. Nashville, Birmingham and Atlanta are practically the same culturally to me. If you don't think so you probably haven't spent enough time in each place. LOL,

What's so different? The scenery, hills and tree cover, no. The music the trends the slang? Nope.

I'm not sure about this. As someone who grew up on the Southside, I can tell you it was a mini "shock" the first time I was in both cities. It's hard to put in exact words, but I knew right away there was a big difference. The slang thing may be a little harder to pin down as a lot of street slang in Atlanta has gone mainstream through music/tv/film but I remember the first time I was in Nashville and Birmingham I had a hard time keeping up some people. LOL.

As for scenery that's a given it will be similar as they are all three in basically the same physical region.

Originally Posted by ATL_Aficionado

If you know these three cities and region as well as I do, you should agree that they are much more in line culturally than say New Orleans, Jackson MS and Memphis. For example, in Jackson MS, they play bounce music (South Louisiana/New Orleans genre) which they just don't play in Atlanta or Birmingham and surely not Nashville. The club scene feels different in that region too, much more vibrant to me but it's pretty good here too, just more laid back.

There is commonality there, but it's loose at best. Different kinds of music will appeal to several areas without a strong cultural link. For instance, "trap music" is real popular in NYC with the younger crowd and I can't think of two places more different than NYC and Atlanta. LOL

Originally Posted by ATL_Aficionado

Yes Atlanta dwafs Birmingham in every way, but you're right Atlanta's influence in Nashville and Birmingham is undenyable. I don't see how anyone could overlook it.lol

Now I'll agree with you that Atlanta does influence places like Nashville and Birmingham. That sort of thing always happens between larger and smaller cities in a region. But the same culture? There was a stronger case for that 60 years ago. In 2010, it's more echos of that era and superficial things that people misidentify as the exact same culture.

[NorthDeKalb]

Originally Posted by waronxmas

In 2010, it's more echos of that era and superficial things that people misidentify as the exact same culture.

How could it be the exact same with trillions more LGBT's, transplants and over 4 million more people?lol It's impossible and we all know that. That was never the argument.

The bottom line is this, if you don't think the region's largest and most progressive metro has little if any influence on it's neighbors then think again man. You may not feel it like others do, but take it from a former resident; it's there.

[waronxmas]

Originally Posted by ATL_Aficionado

How could it be the exact same with trillions more LGBT's, transplants and over 4 million more people?lol It's impossible and we all know that. That was never the argument.

Oh I agree totally. There is a common meme in this thread though that "Birmingham is just a smaller Atlanta" or that "the culture is basically the same" which to me is ridiculous outside a few superficial things and some commonalities in the over arching Southern culture that all places in the South (even Miami) share.

Originally Posted by ATL_Aficionado

The bottom line is this, Atlanta's influence in it's region is felt. You may not feel it like others do, but it's there. Take it from a former resident.

I don't disagree with this either and it is something you see repeated on a regional basis. For instance, take a look at the Northeast. There are several things culturally and architecturally born in New York city that filtered down to other cities like Philly or Boston. There are places in both cities where one might even say it looks just like NYC. But would anyone ever take seriously the argument that they have basically the same culture or that ___ is just a smaller New York? When it comes to the South, I think people don't take as much time to carefully look at the differing layers that make cities different in the culture department.

So going back to the original topic to get off of this tangent, cultural ties have these type of boundaries:

Level 1 - Regional
Level 2 - State
Level 3 - Metro
Level 4 - City
Level 5 - Neighborhood

These all are hard lines to me were further delineation of the regional culture becomes apparent. In big cities, the differences between Level 5 areas can be extremely stark within a small amount of space. Using our favorite city as an example East Point is completely different from Decatur proper which is completely different than Buckhead and they're all within a train ride of each other.

[NorthDeKalb]

Originally Posted by waronxmas

Oh I agree totally. There is a common meme in this thread though that "Birmingham is just a smaller Atlanta" or that "the culture is basically the same" which to me is ridiculous outside a few superficial things and some commonalities in the over arching Southern culture that all places in the South (even Miami) share.

LOL now you know that's stretching it a bit. Miami? I disagree. Miami culture feels much different to me from Atlanta, Nashville or Birmingham. The scenery's different, the music's different. If I were just "placed" in a Miami bar, I would know I'd at least left Atlanta and all surrounding areas for sure. That large a gap just doesn't exist in areas that are within relative proximity.

Originally Posted by waronxmas

I don't disagree with this either and it is something you see repeated on a regional basis. For instance, take a look at the Northeast. There are several things culturally and architecturally born in New York city that filtered down to other cities like Philly or Boston. There are places in both cities where one might even say it looks just like NYC. But would anyone ever take seriously the argument that they have basically the same culture or that ___ is just a smaller New York? When it comes to the South, I think people don't take as much time to carefully look at the differing layers that make cities different in the culture department.

So going back to the original topic to get off of this tangent, cultural ties have these type of boundaries:

Level 1 - Regional
Level 2 - State
Level 3 - Metro
Level 4 - City
Level 5 - Neighborhood

These all are hard lines to me were further delineation of the regional culture becomes apparent. In big cities, the differences between Level 5 areas can be extremely stark within a small amount of space. Using our favorite city as an example East Point is completely different from Decatur proper which is completely different than Buckhead and they're all within a train ride of each other.

I agree.

[waronxmas]

Originally Posted by ATL_Aficionado

LOL now you know that's stretching it a bit. Miami? I disagree. Miami culture feels much different to me from Atlanta, Nashville or Birmingham. The scenery's different, the music's different. If I were just "placed" in a Miami bar, I would know I'd at least left Atlanta and all surrounding areas for sure. That large a gap just doesn't exist in areas that are within relative proximity.

Lol, as I always say tell that to Uncle Luke or Rick Ross.