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Yeah I agree with goat314. Most African Americans are liberal when it's comes to racial issues, since we're often the targets of discrimination, but most are conservative in alot of ways. Most are very religious, don't support alternative ways of living, and think the family is important.
Religious??? How do you explain the high out of wedlock births? Family is important? Few fathers stand by their children.
I have played in punk rock bands. Various of those bands had the good fortune of opening for folks like Yo La Tengo, The Figgs, Cracker, The Archers Of Loaf.
I have lived in Appalachia, where I was definitely a minority, and fell in love with the place, bluegrass music included.
I have a distant family member who launched an art career at the tail end of the Harlem renaissance.
I have one family member who was a Black Panther.
I have a family friend who was a participant in the 2-1960 lunch counter sit-ins in Greensboro NC.
I have family who have never stepped foot outside of the deep South.
I have family members who have lived in Lebanon, Greece, Hong Kong, The Philippines, Jamaica, South Korea.
I have 2 family members who have done prison time; 2 others who graduated from Ivy League schools.
I am what would be described as a granola - if I was white: birkenstocks, organic food, fair trade stuff all over my kitchen.
I drive as little as possible: public transport, biking, taking my own bags to the grocery, hiking and walking.
I support things like gay rights, environmental protections, and women's right to decide what's best for them - reproductive rights.
I am a native of the South, which is a part of the country I love. I love the weather, the landscape, the culture, and the maturity with which the South has negotiated the paradoxes and tragedies of its' won history, and has growth because of it.
By the time I was 12, I knew who Mahalia Jackson, Al Green, Parlaiment-Funkadelic, James Brown, Billie Holliday, Bob Marley, Stevie Wonder, and Alberta Hunter were. I love them all.
I also knew who David Bowie, The Velvet Underground, Bob Dylan, Buck Owens, The Clash, Astrud Gilberto, The Stooges, Puccini and Frank Zappa were. I love them all.
None of this make me any better or worse than anyone else.
These personal quirks and qualities may partially epitomize blackness, while some of them might defy the stereotype to a wild degree. All of these personal attributes seem to confound some white people, and some black people as well.
Black people do have a heritage and a culture, and I have a lot of that in me. I'm comfortable with it. I know it. I feel great in my own skin, Great enough that the theatrics of blackness don't interest me - performing blackness for purposes of assuaging the expectations of other people (of any race - mine or anything else) is boring, unimaginative, and usually more work than it's worth.
I feel very, very strongly that people - including black people - should follow their own destiny, instincts, interests, and passions, and have the strength, confidence and intellect to allow that to be a guide through life. Thus, I've lived in majority-minority places, and also places that where as white as it can be (Appalachia, again).
We live in a big country and a big world. For black people, that country and world is ours to the same degree as it is anyone else's. You may have to work for it, acquire education, know your history (which interestingly makes other people's history far less threatening), and do some traveling. When I was playing guitar in bands, I lived out of a van for years and saw many, many podunk towns all over the eastern 1/3 of the US, and it was a magnificent experience.
So I think any city can be a great city for black liberals. In some cities, not everyone will think like you do. You will find many people who do, and those people may be from a variety of backgrounds, but if they are ideological kindred, then that's what matters. And if you know your heritage and history, and find yourself living in Missoula, or Mississippi, or Atlanta, or Anchorage, it's not going to matter all that much. You'll still prosper, and lead a great black life, as you move about the world, and on through life. It can also be very productive to live in paces where not everyone thinks like you do: there's the possibility of enlightenment - yours, or someone else's. A life lacking those moments of insight is not really a worthwhile life, IMO.
I think a lot of us have difficulty shaking off the nasty hangover of rotten history - discrimination, violence. Many of us were raised with caution as we move through life as a strong undercurrent in community psychology. My mother - who was born during the nastiest years of Jim Crow (she has horrible stories) worried and worried when I lived in the mountains - I did a lot of hiking and camping: me, a tent, some food, a guitar, a journal and not much else. I know the Blue Ridge portion of North Carolina like the back of my hand. I never got lynched, shot at, called the n-word, run out of town, any of that. On a couple occasions, me and my guitar ended up jamming with mountain good old boys who knew their way around a guitar and ended up being cool folks to hang with, talk music, etc. Living without self-imposed limitations (there's the black stuff, where I'm cool, and then there's the other stuff) is liberating, enlightening, a real life of Zen moments. You become one with things that *seem* different. The artifice in that perception - be, rather than seem, becomes abundantly clear.
I am extremely grateful for my parents. Neither of them were college grads, or academics, or hipsters in any stereotypical fashion. They were extremely well-read, knew how to travel on a tight lower-middle-class budget. They had extremely good taste, and were self-made (as opposed to taught) intellectuals; they had the minds of world explorers. And they fully expected that their offspring - me - would be intelligent, free and capable of soaking up whatever I felt a desire to soak up. If black is beautiful, that's the most beautiful kind of black: instead of acting, you are being. Life's too short for anything else.
I highly doubt that many blacks below the age of 40 have experienced any actual discrimination.
Uh... where to start with this. Blacks face discrimination nowadays all the time, especially in terms of housing, police -profiling and in the job market. In most categories that directly affect one's livelihood, most blacks still face discrimination... contrary to popular belief, its not just a bunch of old people throwing around the word ****** like its 1945. One could also argue that the gentrification practices in cities like San Francisco are very racist... they specifically targeted poor black neighborhoods despite there being an equal number of poor asian neighborhoods and poor latino neighborhoods.
I'll write a more in-depth response to this later.
Uh... where to start with this. Blacks face discrimination nowadays all the time, especially in terms of housing, police -profiling and in the job market. In most categories that directly affect one's livelihood, most blacks still face discrimination... contrary to popular belief, its not just a bunch of old people throwing around the word ****** like its 1945. One could also argue that the gentrification practices in cities like San Francisco are very racist... they specifically targeted poor black neighborhoods despite there being an equal number of poor asian neighborhoods and poor latino neighborhoods.
I'll write a more in-depth response to this later.
I should restate my previous statement. Most blacks under the age of 40 haven't received any discrimination any worse than your average American. People of all races get denied jobs and housing because of BS reasons. It's the United States of America, and since we have the freedom of association in this country, private employees can easily get through loopholes in order to hire who they want. Likewise, landlords can easily decide who they want to rent to.
In addition, as someone who has lived in a majority-black environment, I can almost guarantee that white males can be profiled in this environment. If a white male happens to cause a crime, you can be sure that the police will be looking at the few white males they come across.
Keep in mind that I say "most". There will always be stories of discrimination, but this is not the reality for the vast majority of black people in this country.
I should restate my previous statement. Most blacks under the age of 40 haven't received any discrimination any worse than your average American. People of all races get denied jobs and housing because of BS reasons. It's the United States of America, and since we have the freedom of association in this country, private employees can easily get through loopholes in order to hire who they want. Likewise, landlords can easily decide who they want to rent to.
In addition, as someone who has lived in a majority-black environment, I can almost guarantee that white males can be profiled in this environment. If a white male happens to cause a crime, you can be sure that the police will be looking at the few white males they come across.
Keep in mind that I say "most". There will always be stories of discrimination, but this is not the reality for the vast majority of black people in this country.
Black applicants without criminal records are no more likely to get a job than white applicants just out of prison, according to a Princeton University study of nearly 1,500 private employers in New York City.
The study, “Discrimination in Low Wage Labor Markets,” was conducted by sociology professors Devah Pager and Bruce Western . It is the largest and most comprehensive project of its kind to date.
The study, which investigated discrimination against young male minorities and ex-offenders by employers, also showed:
• Young white high school graduates were about twice as likely to receive positive responses from New York employers as equally qualified black job seekers;
• Ex-offenders face serious barriers to employment; a criminal record reduced positive responses from employers by about 35 percent for white applicants and 57 percent for black applicants.
Even without criminal records, however, black applicants had low rates of positive responses, about the same as the response rate for white applicants with criminal records. Hispanics also faced discrimination by employers, but were preferred relative to blacks.
"The results of this landmark study are deeply disturbing and highlight the need for strong enforcement of the New York City Human Rights Law," said Patricia Gatling, commissioner of the New York City Commission on Human Rights, which assisted in the study. In New York City it is illegal for employers to discriminate on the basis of race or a criminal record.
The researchers presented the results of their study at the Population Association of America's annual meeting in Philadelphia on March 31 and are preparing a paper for submission to an academic journal.
"A lot of people are skeptical that African Americans still face discrimination in the job market. But even in a diverse city like New York , the evidence of discrimination is unmistakable," Pager said.
If anything, this study gives credence to the old saying that black people have to work twice as hard to get what white people get normally... studies like this make it hard to believe that the playing field is even.
This is the norm in most of the country... if anything, a city like NYC should have been the exception.
At any rate, I do agree that an individual who has actually experienced discrimination shouldn't be discriminating. My problem was that the statement about blacks collectively being discriminated doesn't hold water with me. I believe that this should be on an individual basis: to put it simply, if a homophobic black person doesn't feel discriminated by whites, then telling them that they shouldn't discriminate against gays because blacks as a whole were discriminated in the past wouldn't change their homophobic position.
At the end of the day, this was just nitpicking. If that argument results in a lot of blacks supporting or at least not opposing gay marriage, then the ends justified the means.
At any rate, I do agree that an individual who has actually experienced discrimination shouldn't be discriminating. My problem was that the statement about blacks collectively being discriminated doesn't hold water with me. I believe that this should be on an individual basis: to put it simply, if a homophobic black person doesn't feel discriminated by whites, then telling them that they shouldn't discriminate against gays because blacks as a whole were discriminated in the past wouldn't change their homophobic position.
At the end of the day, this was just nitpicking. If that argument results in a lot of blacks supporting or at least not opposing gay marriage, then the ends justified the means.
I find the argument that all blacks should be in favor of gay marriage because they've been oppressed is equally weak. The vast majority of discrimination against gays has to do with religion, plain and simple. A lot of blacks are religious... the two go together. But more than that, most of the anti-homosexuality you hear from blacks on TV is from the poorer end of the spectrum... middle class and upper class black folks are for the most part very liberal on the subject, or at least they are on the west coast.
And I don't see why blacks are subjected to this scrutiny than latinos or asians... you won't find too many of them supporting homosexuality either. The main reason is that the family structure has been more intact in these cultures than in European culture... When Henry VIII was busy getting a divorce, the rest of the world continued as usual. Homosexuality is sometimes seen as a shirking of familial responsibility. While its idiotic, homosexuals aren't going to be finding the kind of mainstream acceptance they're pining for anytime soon globally. Western Europe is the only part of the globe where no one really cares... not so coincidentally, Western Europe experienced the largest backlash against religion. America is still largely a Christian country and is governed by Christian principles. Anti-homosexuality is one of them.
Better question is where can a black man simply be a man and respected as a man on equal basis with all other men regardless of race? No city comes to mind.
And the cities who even come close are not even known for being that "liberal."
If anything, this study gives credence to the old saying that black people have to work twice as hard to get what white people get normally... studies like this make it hard to believe that the playing field is even.
This is the norm in most of the country... if anything, a city like NYC should have been the exception.
NYC comes off as one of those "passive racist liberal" cities, although not as bad as SF and DC. I would personally like to see the same stats for the following:
-Cities like Charlotte and Houston where blacks have made TRUE success without needing "Fed Jobs" or "rappin' and entertainin'."
-Cities like Denver and Seattle where being black is more of a neutral factor than you typical American city.
I'll bet you my paycheck that, all other things being equal, the numbers between black and white job/loan applicants would be narrowed.
Last edited by Do a Barrel Roll; 04-12-2011 at 04:48 PM..
Nivalis, you are very naive if you don't think discrimination and racism is around today. The first Africans arrived in this land at about 1624. They were separated from whites and discriminated against for over 300 years before the Civil Rights Movement of the mid-1960s when integration and other advances occurred. I think it's silly to think that 300+ years of open discrimination and racism has been totally eradicated and cured just because we've been able to eat a hamburger in the same cafe for about 40 years now.
It might not be out in the open like it once was, but it still exists and there are always new and improved ways to discriminate.
Hell, even black IVY LEAGUE students are having problems in 2010. And this is the north, where according to many city data posters, there is no racism and everybody joins hands around the city at night and sings kumbaya.
I hold blacks (victims of discrimination) to a higher standard of accepting others then the typical bible belt, middle aged white person that opposes gay marriage. Blacks know what it feels like to be discriminated against so i'd assume ALL of them would really be accepting of others with differences.
So in essence, even though blacks are not the only group in America whom have experienced discrimination at one point or another, you feel as though we alone should be held to a standard different then whites. Sounds pretty racist.
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