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Thing about this though is it means basically nothing on the people level. Arguing about how a state is run seems like a last resort to support dividing regions in a biased fashion.
On the street level, from person to person, this makes little to no difference. The towns of DIX and Montour in NY includes the villages of Watkins Glen and Montour Falls. But nobody says "hey, let's go to the town of DIX!", they say, "I'm going to Watkins Glen."
That stuff is just bureaucracy to everybody and means little in terms of the common culture.
I agree with your statement to some extent and its true that much of the country looks increasingly the same. But I still contend that there are little differences between one state and another state. Those little differences, like simply the difference between local zoning versus county wide zoning may add up over time.
Anyway, this is a thread about the concept of the Mid-Atlantic and I simply pointing out that Maryland, unlike the rest of the Northeast (except for possibly Delaware) has a traditional Southern style of local government versus the Northern style found in the Northeast and parts of the Midwest.
Along the I-95 corridor, the midpoint of the East Coast is roughly Emporia, VA, which is 1036 miles from Key West and 1030 miles from Van Buren, ME. (Technically 95 doesn't extend to either Van Buren or Key West but you get my point here). Emporia is in a region known as Southside Virginia, 10 miles north of the North Carolima stateline, which I would not consider Mid-Atlantic, but I'll get back to that. Geographically, though, Virginia is exactly the MIDDLE of the East Coast, with 99.9% of the state NORTH of the midpoint line of the East Coast in Emporia. So from a geographical sense, Virginia should without a doubt be seen as Mid-Atlantic...
From a cultural vantage, in realistic, modern, widely accepted thought, the Mid-Atlantic is a cultural mix of North-South on the East Coast and is centered on the Washington-Baltimore region. The confusion on which there is no consensus is how far in the compass directions does the Mid-Atlantic extend....
I think going southwards, it's increasingly difficult to argue against Richmond being Mid-Atlantic. This does not mean that Richmond isn't also Southern; the same way that Appalachia stretches across both North and South, so too does Mid-Atlantic, just closer to the coast. Not sure why people have a difficult time understanding this....
I'd say the Mid-Atlantic goes south through the RVA and HRVA regions. Those two regions, along with NoVA, are largely culturally dissimilar from the RoVA (rest of Virginia). Richmond certainly has plenty of cultural interchange/tie in to DC and the DC area, and if DC is the (co-)capital of the Mid-Atlantic, Richmond is just a more southern extension. I also think HRVA should be included. The primary cities of Norfolk and Virginia Beach, upon which the region is centered, are Southern but certainly aren't typical Southern cities culturally. I can tell you for sure that Central Virginia, particularly Richmond City, embraces both Southern and Mid-Atlantic descriptives...
The rest of Virginia is NOT Mid-Atlantic...
I lived in New York, in Albany and Elmira, and once knew Upstate like the back of my hand. That isn't the Mid-Atlantic lol. It is the Northeast obviously. I care not for the old timey Census designations; some of you do, fine. But if the DC-Bmore area ("DMV") is the center of M/A gravity, as I accept, Upstate NY has little to no cultural commonalities to DMV. Besides that, I lived there, and I don't think I ever heard Mid-Atlantic used in speech as a descriptor for where we were, I never recall seeing it used in or on businesses, certainly not to the prevalence you see in DMV, RVA, and HRVA regions...
The City of New York is its own thing. The farthest north and west I consider M/A is the Harrisburg area of PA, over through Philly and Central Jersey, but that's stretching it. I'm okay with Delaware and Philly being included. Maybe South Jersey...North Jersey is not Mid-Atlantic!
Along the I-95 corridor, the midpoint of the East Coast is roughly Emporia, VA, which is 1036 miles from Key West and 1030 miles from Van Buren, ME. (Technically 95 doesn't extend to either Van Buren or Key West but you get my point here). Emporia is in a region known as Southside Virginia, 10 miles north of the North Carolima stateline, which I would not consider Mid-Atlantic, but I'll get back to that. Geographically, though, Virginia is exactly the MIDDLE of the East Coast, with 99.9% of the state NORTH of the midpoint line of the East Coast in Emporia. So from a geographical sense, Virginia should without a doubt be seen as Mid-Atlantic...
From a cultural vantage, in realistic, modern, widely accepted thought, the Mid-Atlantic is a cultural mix of North-South on the East Coast and is centered on the Washington-Baltimore region. The confusion on which there is no consensus is how far in the compass directions does the Mid-Atlantic extend....
I think going southwards, it's increasingly difficult to argue against Richmond being Mid-Atlantic. This does not mean that Richmond isn't also Southern; the same way that Appalachia stretches across both North and South, so too does Mid-Atlantic, just closer to the coast. Not sure why people have a difficult time understanding this....
I'd say the Mid-Atlantic goes south through the RVA and HRVA regions. Those two regions, along with NoVA, are largely culturally dissimilar from the RoVA (rest of Virginia). Richmond certainly has plenty of cultural interchange/tie in to DC and the DC area, and if DC is the (co-)capital of the Mid-Atlantic, Richmond is just a more southern extension. I also think HRVA should be included. The primary cities of Norfolk and Virginia Beach, upon which the region is centered, are Southern but certainly aren't typical Southern cities culturally. I can tell you for sure that Central Virginia, particularly Richmond City, embraces both Southern and Mid-Atlantic descriptives...
The rest of Virginia is NOT Mid-Atlantic...
I lived in New York, in Albany and Elmira, and once knew Upstate like the back of my hand. That isn't the Mid-Atlantic lol. It is the Northeast obviously. I care not for the old timey Census designations; some of you do, fine. But if the DC-Bmore area ("DMV") is the center of M/A gravity, as I accept, Upstate NY has little to no cultural commonalities to DMV. Besides that, I lived there, and I don't think I ever heard Mid-Atlantic used in speech as a descriptor for where we were, I never recall seeing it used in or on businesses, certainly not to the prevalence you see in DMV, RVA, and HRVA regions...
The City of New York is its own thing. The farthest north and west I consider M/A is the Harrisburg area of PA, over through Philly and Central Jersey, but that's stretching it. I'm okay with Delaware and Philly being included. Maybe South Jersey...North Jersey is not Mid-Atlantic!
Great post aside from one small mistake. Baltimore is not part the DMV. The DMV applies to the DC metropolitan area.
Yeah, I do agree with Murk in that DC, Baltimore, NoVa-Hampton Road are all modern day Mid-Atlantic. Personally, I even place the OBX in because I feel like it's just an extension of VA (OBX kinda seems culturally similar to Tangier and Smith Island).
Yeah, I do agree with Murk in that DC, Baltimore, NoVa-Hampton Road are all modern day Mid-Atlantic. Personally, I even place the OBX in because I feel like it's just an extension of VA (OBX kinda seems culturally similar to Tangier and Smith Island).
Rdu? Nah. I feel that it's strictly just Upper South/Sunbelt city with a high transient population. It's way to new and shiny to be Mid-Atlantic. It's too far inland and unconnected with any type of Bay or Ocean.
Mid-Atlantic has to have some good fresh seafood joints around. Plus, RDU's architecture isn't Mid-Atlantic like.
Lol absolutely not. Nowhere in North Carolina is Mid-Atlantic. There is no real connectivity to DC-Baltimore, there is very little culturally in common with any part of the Mid-Atlantic. At best, as has been mentioned much before, RDU is similar to Northern Virginia in look and housing stock. And Nova is STILL about a million people larger as a suburb, with more urbanity and urban sensibility than the alleged most urban parts of RDU (Chapel Hill/Carrboro lol). Besides housing, RDU would share nothing in common with Nova...
North Carolina and Virginia are both Upper South. RDU has no real cultural commonality to the M/A...
People overstate the transient population in RDU. That area is very much Southern to a higher degree than RVA, HRVA, or anywhere in the M/A. Those areas are Mid-Atlantic. RDU is New South...
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It always seems to come down to the south in these threads.
Hilariously the mid atlantic as defined by the census has nothing to do with the south. According to what they shoved down my throat in school the mid atlantic states were always PA, NY and Jersey.
Yeah, I do agree with Murk in that DC, Baltimore, NoVa-Hampton Road are all modern day Mid-Atlantic. Personally, I even place the OBX in because I feel like it's just an extension of VA (OBX kinda seems culturally similar to Tangier and Smith Island).
I was just in the OBX this past weekend, and that area is pretty southern. Even the Tidewater region of VA has a distinct southern feel. Heck, Baltimore is southern, I don't think it'll get less southern as you venture farther south.
I was just in the OBX this past weekend, and that area is pretty southern. Even the Tidewater region of VA has a distinct southern feel. Heck, Baltimore is southern, I don't think it'll get less southern as you venture farther south.
Well, I say that because of the coastal community aspect of it. It's more distinct than what people see as Southern. It has an unusual accent and that waterman culture is its trademark. I haven't spent significant time in the OBX but I kind of see it as an extension of VA but someone mentioned how it could just be its own thing. It just seems like the last stop for VA's brand of rural Mid Atlantic waterman culture before the normal Tarheel culture starts to shine through.
EDIT: BBQ is huge in NC. Can you even get good bbq in the OBX? Seem like seafood rules (I get it, they are on the coast but is bbq fish and shrimp big there?)
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