Cities that are cosmopolitan, but not sophisticated (how much, homes)

[BigCityDreamer]

Originally Posted by pgm123

I don't know if this has been discussed, but what about DC? It's cosmopolitan by its nature because of the embassies (as well as a decent immigration population). However, it's not really sophisticated in that there's no entrenched elite and generational transfers of wealth and power. There are wealthy people, but the city tends to be more mercitocratic (connections matter, but your resumé matters more). Even the political elite are elected from elsewhere and don't make the city more sophisticated.

When I hear "sophisticated" I think of a city that is at least a major fashion capital along with having all the usual aspects of high culture.

So, to be honest, only New York City (particularly Manhattan) is a sophisticated city in America. Possibly Los Angeles too.

[tcave360]

Originally Posted by citylove101

Interesting thread. But I'd throw out a PART of a city that I consider cosmopolitan but not, on the whole, sophisticated. That's the New York City borough of Queens. It is the most populous borough of NYC with 2.3 million people, which would make it like the 4th biggest city in the country on its own.

Queens is decidedly international and incredibly diverse, probably more so than anywhere else in the country. The latest census puts the foreign-born population at 48%. And unlike many cities they come from all over the world with no one group dominationg: Colombians, Poles, Guyanese, Pakistanis, Dominicans, Haitians, Chinese, Mexicans... You name it, Queens has it. I'd bet there is NO other large city (considering Queens as a city) that is as diverse. The gateway fro immigration used to be Ellis Island. It's now just as likely to be JFK Airport in Queens. Tons of neighborhoods, many of which are ethnically oriented. But for the most part people get along fairly well. The days of neighborhoods you "can't" go into becuase you're a different race or ethnicity are largely gone.

But when you think of sophistication, high-end shopping, deep familairty with the arts, avant-garde intellectualism, no one will ever put Queens high on their list. It's an aggressively middle-class sort of place -- and I don't say that in a derogatory way. Most non-New Yorkers couldn't name three neighborhoods in Queens. It's a borough that wears its low-key identity with pride, if that makes sense. For sophisticated city offerings people go into "the city" (Manhattan) or more recently to Brooklyn. Queens has little of that. There is some wealth there, but more upper-middle class welath, not millionaires and billionaires.

All in all, cosmopolitan, populous, pleasant, laid-back (compared to Manhattan at least), middle-class, hard-working -- but not what OP would call sophisticated.

I can! Jackson Heights, Corona, Flushing, Forest Hills, Forest Hills Gardens, Astoria, Hollis, Queensbridge, Woodside, Far Rockaway, Jamaica, South Jamaica, Rego Park, Sunnyside, and Long Island City. That's all I know.

[Mutiny77]

Originally Posted by afonega1

I meant relevant as in it having a huge international impact like it used to have.Its not well known internationally.

You have a source for the festival's declining international impact? I've heard no such thing.

And Spoleto is quite well-known internationally when it comes to cultural festivals. You can't compare it to something like the Olympics or World Cup in this regard.

Savannah got almost 1 million people last St.Patrick's Day.Yes its a big party but so s Mardi Gras.

Spoleto Festival gets no where near that kinda of notoriety with somewhere between 70,000 to 100,000.

So your argument is that because the St. Patrick's Day festival gets more visitors, it's a more worldly event than a well-regarded international arts festival? By this measure, do you think Myrtle Beach is more worldly than Savannah because it gets more visitors annually?

"Worldly" is all about quality, not quantity. So is notoriety.

There are a lot of internationals that come to Savannah as it reputation is growing,so does things like St.Pats and other festivals like the Savannah Film Festival.
The Savannah Film Festival also has been drawing an international following as of the last few years.

Not to mention with a company like Gulfstream (The Rolls Royce of private jets and popularized hook "party like a G-6" in a song) is headquartered and built in Savannah does not hurt either.

Also realize that Savannah is the closest city other than Jacksonville near a couple of its world renowned 5 star resorts: The Lodge and The Cloister on Sea Island,Georgia where the G-6 summit was held several years ago.
Either way its not a huge difference which ever way you pick between the two.

The film festival is definitely an example of something that makes Savannah wordly.

I still give Charleston the edge though. It has a few more metrics working in its favor that are more indicative of worldliness (busier airport, higher tourism economic impact, more educated residents, more higher-end retail, etc.).

[odds]

queens is the best example no doubt
philly is another

[GioLM]

Maybe it would be easier to list the cities in the US that do have an air of sophistication (and are also cosmopolitan). My noms would be as follows ( I won't be mentioning cities with a pop less than 400,000 just to mske things less complicated):
NYC
SF
Boston
DC

and there is a case for Miami and Seattle, but too many things that would counteract the argument for both

Otherwise the US pretty much lacks on sophistication...probably something many would regard as being quintessentially "American". I'd say the most profound examples of large cosmopolitan US cities that miss out on sophistication are as follows:
Chicago
Philly
LA
San Jose
SanDiego
Houston
Dallas
San Antonio
Detroit
Phoenix
Denver
Oakland
Sac
Austin

All these cities are very diverse and arguably "Cosmopolitan" (save for maybe Phoenix, I just mentioned it bc of its population) but definitely do not emulate sophistication (people could easily make cases for LA and even Chicago, I just don't think they can be honestly labeled sophisticated).

[blkgiraffe]

SF is sophisticated???

LA is sophisticated???

NY is sophisticated???

But Houston isn't???? OK.

[columbus finest]

i'd say dallals if you'd consider it either cosmopolitan or sophisticated ... only city i can think of

[grapico]

Originally Posted by blkgiraffe

SF is sophisticated???

LA is sophisticated???

NY is sophisticated???

But Houston isn't???? OK.

Yes, you are delusional if you group Houston with these cities, only on city data.

[blkgiraffe]

Originally Posted by grapico

Yes, you are delusional if you group Houston with these cities, only on city data.

Cities where people are waking around naked and reeks of **** is not sophisticated.

[grapico]

Originally Posted by blkgiraffe

Cities where people are waking around naked and reeks of **** is not sophisticated.

wow...#seriousanger #superbooster #inferioritycomplex #issues. I agree that wouldn't make a place sophisticated, so I guess we could chalk off your mom's basement also by that definition?