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^ people who pay thousands in taxes to a specific city/town school district know for sure what jurisdiction they are in.
my feeling is that tourists who visit harvard square would think they are inside the city limits of boston even though they arent.
whereas most tourists visiting xyz in brooklyn, ny would think they are not inside of nyc even though they technically are (i think this changes much now that the nets moved back to nyc).
or am i off premise ?
edit: maybe because in bos there are many tourist attractions in places like cambridge and charlestown... that people dont care to memorize the map whereas in new york (excepting brooklyn recently), philly, dc most of the attractions are downtown and tourists stay centripedly located ?
I'd second Denver. When talking to people outside the area, no one says they're from Parker or Wheat Ridge or Thornton, etc. Boulder has it's own identity, but aside from that, almost everyone in the actual metro area refers to themselves as being from Denver.
Tucson really doesn't have any suburbs compared to most places. Green Valley and Marana are the only two and they were both planned type communities which came about in the '60s or 70's as opposed to a long standing town in the area.
I think you are mistaken. Don't you mean Oro Valley? Green Valley is 20 miles south of Tucson and even Sahuarita is closer to Tucson than Green Valley is.
Birmingham; it often gets associated with "205," even though Birmingham isn't the only city who uses the area code. Also, The Birmingham metro area consists of 1/4 of the state's population itself.
^ people who pay thousands in taxes to a specific city/town school district know for sure what jurisdiction they are in.
my feeling is that tourists who visit harvard square would think they are inside the city limits of boston even though they arent.
whereas most tourists visiting xyz in brooklyn, ny would think they are not inside of nyc even though they technically are (i think this changes much now that the nets moved back to nyc).
or am i off premise ?
edit: maybe because in bos there are many tourist attractions in places like cambridge and charlestown... that people dont care to memorize the map whereas in new york (excepting brooklyn recently), philly, dc most of the attractions are downtown and tourists stay centripedly located ?
I think we're pretty much on the same page. I think locals have a much more insular view of the Boston area than tourists. Boston is so compact and towns like Cambridge, Somerville, and Brookline are so small (smaller than "neighborhoods" in other cities) that a local is fully aware they're in Brookline whereas a tourist probably isn't paying too much attention to when he/she has crossed an invisible line. It's going to be hard for a visitor to differentiate the difference between Cambridge and Somerville when walking from Porter to Davis Square. Locals, on the other hand, don't have such a far-reaching sense of place. It's almost a point of pride for someone from the 6 square miles of Cambridge to tell everyone they're from Cambridge. The same applies to Brockton, Revere, Somerville, Medford, Milton, Arlington, etc, etc, etc.
On the flip side, New York City is so large that many tourists view Manhattan as New York. It's big enough to be its own city as are each of the boroughs. There's the point of pride thing going on there too, but each of those boroughs is so huge and so culturally distinct that it makes a lot of sense for someone to refer to their borough as where they're from. It also makes sense for a tourist to know they're not in Manhattan anymore. There are more physical barriers as well Manhattan is literally an island. Cambridge is across the river (a very short walk in many spots), but Somerville isn't physically separated from Cambridge and Brookline isn't separated from Boston.
I'm a Massachusetts person and I do consider Boston, Cambridge, Somerville and Brookline to essentially be "Boston." But I don't think most locals feel that way even if most everyone else does.
Metro Boston extends from Southern NH into RI and covers most of Eastern MA as well. I think people in this region identify STRONGLY with their local community and not with Boston. We lump places like Cambridge, Somerville and Brookline in with Boston because they're so connected, but most people who live in those towns will identify with that particular town. I work across the hall from a guy from Brookline and another from Somerville. Neither of them refer to where they live as "Boston." Even the guy from Dorchester (actually part of Boston) says he's from Dorchester. All of these little towns would be part of Boston proper if Boston was located somewhere else in the country, so it's really unsurprising that some people refer to those communities as "Boston" (in my experience, it's mostly college students and recent transplants who could be forgiven for not being able to easily make the distinction OR people talking about Boston on this forum or someplace similar). Still, the vast majority of people living in those communities identify strongly with that community.
Once you get even a little further out, the separation from Boston in the minds of the locals is even greater. Someone from Quincy (which is still close enough and connected enough to be a neighborhood of Boston) will almost undoubtedly tell you they're from Quincy. Someone from Melrose will tell you they're from Melrose and someone from Lynn will say they're from Lynn. Even further out in the metro area, people start identifying with smaller cities nearby. I hear "I'm from the Lowell area," "I'm from the Worcester area," or "I'm from the Taunton area" all the time. The parts of the metro area outside of the state line are almost completely disassociated with Boston. Have you ever heard someone from Portsmouth NH or Manchester NH say "I'm from Boston"? How about even "I live in the Boston area"? I haven't. I grew up in Lakeville, MA mostly which is part of Metro Boston and nobody considered our town to be part of the Boston area. We even had a commuter rail stop to the city!
Massachusetts is notorious for relying heavily on arbitrary (and in many cases- obsolete) political boundaries. It's part of where our "insular" reputation comes from. It's strange. I'd say Boston is closer to the weaker end of regional identity than it is to the stronger end. Metro Boston includes too many smaller cities that pull some of the cultural orbit from Boston itself. Worcester, Manchester, Lowell, Brockton, Taunton, etc. are all small urban areas with their own draw. Many people technically living in metro Boston actually identify with the smaller city next door (or close by). beyond that, the inner suburbs are often their own little world. Tell someone from Milton that they're from Boston and they'll laugh at you. Same goes for Needham, Weston, Winchester, Stoneham, Swampscott, etc.
My Massachusetts relatives will tell you that the are from Melrose, Malden, Chelsea and Revere, but not Boston.
I think we're pretty much on the same page. I think locals have a much more insular view of the Boston area than tourists. Boston is so compact and towns like Cambridge, Somerville, and Brookline are so small (smaller than "neighborhoods" in other cities) that a local is fully aware they're in Brookline whereas a tourist probably isn't paying too much attention to when he/she has crossed an invisible line. It's going to be hard for a visitor to differentiate the difference between Cambridge and Somerville when walking from Porter to Davis Square. Locals, on the other hand, don't have such a far-reaching sense of place. It's almost a point of pride for someone from the 6 square miles of Cambridge to tell everyone they're from Cambridge. The same applies to Brockton, Revere, Somerville, Medford, Milton, Arlington, etc, etc, etc.
On the flip side, New York City is so large that many tourists view Manhattan as New York. It's big enough to be its own city as are each of the boroughs. There's the point of pride thing going on there too, but each of those boroughs is so huge and so culturally distinct that it makes a lot of sense for someone to refer to their borough as where they're from. It also makes sense for a tourist to know they're not in Manhattan anymore. There are more physical barriers as well Manhattan is literally an island. Cambridge is across the river (a very short walk in many spots), but Somerville isn't physically separated from Cambridge and Brookline isn't separated from Boston.
I'm a Massachusetts person and I do consider Boston, Cambridge, Somerville and Brookline to essentially be "Boston." But I don't think most locals feel that way even if most everyone else does.
You really are the 1st Massachusetts native I know, who thinks of those surrounding towns as "Boston".
I think you are mistaken. Don't you mean Oro Valley? Green Valley is 20 miles south of Tucson and even Sahuarita is closer to Tucson than Green Valley is.
Don't consider Oro Valley as a previously free standing community because it didn't incorporate until 1974 and only did so in an attempt to avoid being annexed by Tucson.
Sahaurita, however did exist as a free standing community, albeit a tiny one. until the 1990s. So I guess it would count as a free standing community. Long ago there was just Tucson and maybe Flowing Wells was an independent community.
Contrast the areas around Tucson to Phoenix. Scottsdale, Glendale, Chandler, Mesa, Gilbert all were small towns existing from way back when. There were a couple others in the west Valley.
You really are the 1st Massachusetts native I know, who thinks of those surrounding towns as "Boston".
We have pretty strong "Town" identities around here.
I met two Mass folks in Berlin and both of them responded with "Dorchester" when I asked where they were from in Mass.
That being said, a lot of Transplants and Tourist think Brookline, Cambridge, and Somerville are Boston but Hyde Park, Roxbury and Dorchester aren't. I've had actual debates on it, it's asinine.
My Massachusetts relatives will tell you that the are from Melrose, Malden, Chelsea and Revere, but not Boston.
Thanks, this is exactly the point I was making. People in the Boston area identify more with their respective town, not "Boston." "Boston" is the city proper in the eyes of most around here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by polo89
You really are the 1st Massachusetts native I know, who thinks of those surrounding towns as "Boston".
I'm in the planning field (which is a headache with the divided municipalities here) and as a C-D nerd, it's impossible not to think of these areas as functionally Boston. However, I'm VERY careful in conversation with anyone else from the area. Cambridge is Cambridge, Brookline is Brookline and Somerville is Somerville. I'm definitely in the minority of locals who feel this way. As stanley-88888888 pointed out, tourists and transplants probably view it differently. At least until they're ridiculed and called a "retahd" for not knowing the difference between the city of Boston and Brookline.
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