Should Philly and NYC be considered one giant CSA? (home, camp)
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Location: Watching half my country turn into Gilead
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maintainschaos
Would it really change either of these two cities if we woke up tomorrow and someone suddenly designated that they were a CSA?
Well, if we were like certain West Coasters, the new CSA definition could disingenuously become the default definiton for everything pertaining to Philadelphia or New York...
They technically meet the requirement I believe (kidphilly can you confirm?), but I don't see it happening anytime soon. Both cities have too strong of an identity to share a CSA. I do think the UN and/or Demographia classifies them as one urban agglomeration of 29+ million, though. And New Jersey IS viewed as one big suburb because, well, it is.
Yes Mercer meets meet MSA with NYC and Burlington technically meet MSA with Philly and CSA with NYC
The Census bureau specifically made the recomendation to keep the legacy Metros in place with Trenton as a stand alone and to not combine Philly and NYC into one CSA - These three also meet the criteria as one combined Urbanized area comprising ~30 million people
but the two metros are distinct and is sort of silly to combine them, the area in the middle is grey
and no Milwakee and Chicago while close do not have the same dynamic, first off they are further apart (the closest city border of NYC and Phildelpha are less than 47 miles apart) and the number of people that reside in the counties between these two cities is almost the the population of the whole Chicago MSA excluding the cities at either end
honestly if I were to make a Chicago Milwaukee comparison it would be Philadelphia and Allentown and the development between the two, much more similar than the NYC/Philly dynamic
Location: That star on your map in the middle of the East Coast, DMV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steeps
All should realize if Philly is basically CSA of NYC. Then New Jersey is just one big Suburb.... You may as well say Boston to DC is one Big >>>>MEGALOPOLIS<<< or Mega-Metro as was mentioned..... then too....
Yea the only noticeable "gap" from Philly CSA to DC Baltimore CSA is Cecil County, MD right before you hit Delaware. Otherwise you could quite literally say it's a dominant urban/suburban stretch from Central Virginia all the way thru to SW Connecticut.
And even Cecil County, MD is added to the Philly MSA.
All should realize if Philly is basically CSA of NYC. Then New Jersey is just one big Suburb.... You may as well say Boston to DC is one Big >>>>MEGALOPOLIS<<< or Mega-Metro as was mentioned..... then too....
Jersey is most likely the most urban developed state, and Jersey City is more urban looking then Philly, with all of Jersey Cities high rises buildings compared to those small 2 stories row homes in Philly. New Jersey is far from a suburb with all the small cities in the state.
The area between NYC is almost continuously developed and is also littered with smaller cities like Trenton, Princeton, etc. So what's stopping the two cities from being one gigantic CSA? There are CSAs out there with a bigger gap between their constituent cities' development, such as LA and Riverside/San Bernadino. Why isn't that section of the east coast considered one single megametro then?
I would say Philly is more like the San Diego of NYC than an Inland Empire.
I dont know what would be the Inland Empire of NYC though. Maybe Southwestern Connecticut.
It is almost continuous development between LA, OC, and SD besides Camp Pendleton. But NJ does have the Pine Barrens.
Jersey is most likely the most urban developed state, and Jersey City is more urban looking then Philly, with all of Jersey Cities high rises buildings compared to those small 2 stories row homes in Philly. New Jersey is far from a suburb with all the small cities in the state.
Plus there is open space in Northwest Jersey, Pine Barrens, and Deep South Jersey.
Location: East Central Pennsylvania/ Chicago for 6yrs.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133
I would say Philly is more like the San Diego of NYC than an Inland Empire.
I dont know what would be the Inland Empire of NYC though. Maybe Southwestern Connecticut.
It is almost continuous development between LA, OC, and SD besides Camp Pendleton. But NJ does have the Pine Barrens.
The BOLDED is TOTALLY REDICULAS.. Philly is a 65% Row home city..... much tight walled Rows on narrow streets and no yards and housing to the sidewalks..... Nothing like San Diego....
Location: Watching half my country turn into Gilead
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133
Plus there is open space in Northwest Jersey, Pine Barrens, and Deep South Jersey.
Doesn't mean squat. The contiguously developed trail from Philadelphia to New York bypasses all those areas; those areas are the periphery of the metro, not the core. NYC to Philly is a straight, contiguous shot.
The only things really preventing a giant CSA designation are Philadelphia and New York's separate labor markets, and, more importantly, pride. Riverside, Californians might be happy being LA's *****, but not Philadelphians. The uproar would be insane if Philly was added to NYCs metro and I think the Census wisely recognizes this.
Over a century ago, New York City expanded from Manhattan Island to incorporate the other four boroughs, including Brooklyn, which had been an independent city until that time and one of the largest cities in the country. As far back as the beginning of the last century, rail lines and ferries encouraged the growth of suburbs. The development of expressways, parkways, and toll roads from 1930 to 1970, low cost mortgage loans to GIs returning from World War II, and white, middle class flight from New York City and older cities like Newark and Jersey City fueled the massive growth of the suburbs, developing much of northeastern New Jersey, western and central Long Island, the lower Hudson Valley, and southwestern Connecticut. Locating corporate headquarters in suburban campuses and developing industrial centers in the suburbs, as occurred in the post-World War II period, allowed many residents of the suburban periphery to commute within that periphery and into exurban areas like northwestern New Jersey and even the adjacent counties of northeastern Pennsylvania.
It is inevitable that the New York metro area will expand to incorporate the Philadelphia metro area. With faster rail transportation between the two cities, lower real estate prices in the Philadelphia area, and digital communication replacing the formerly dominant television, AM/FM, and print media, it is likely, perhaps by mid-century, that the two metros will be seen as effectively one. There will still be local sports loyalties, just as there are in metro areas with two teams, like Chicago, the Bay Area, and New York as it currently exists.
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